Adding War goals :(

[evran]

Ok I understand war goals are harder to add and that makes sense and is usually good. But there should be some middle ground. For example, I DoW against Tunis as france for Establish Proc, and Morocco joined in. I also had a justification against morrocco going on (can you add goals you justified while at war?)

Basically I think you should be able to add war goals easier especially when you are steamrolling a country, I want to take all of morocco before the other countries try. How do I add jingoism?

 

[unmerged(732631)]

Im new to victoria, and I think its stupid that if Spain attackes me trying to take my colonie, i still get 10 infamy if I want theres.

 

[evran]

Im new to victoria, and I think its stupid that if Spain attackes me trying to take my colonie, i still get 10 infamy if I want theres.

Well the idea is that you are only protecting your colonies so you are only justified in fighting a defensive war. In cases like that there shouldn't be an infamy penalty if you want to humilate them or cut down to size. Only payback for attacking you.

 

[BBBD316]

I would concur with evran, I think that if you are attacked there should be some war goals that can be added for no infamy as a retailation on the aggressor.

If they choose to attack me I should be able to force them to pay repariations if their war goes badly enough.

 

[Arentak]

Maybe Humiliate should be allowed for defenders, not sure.

 

[Tumblew33d]

I don't see the point of adding humiliate for defenders. You already get a bit amount of prestige for winning a defensive war (and they take a prestige hit for failing to enforce their cb).

It might make sense for an event that gives you a free cut down to size cb against a country if you're at war with them for like 5+ years.

And HoD lets you add wargoals without needing 7% jingoism, but you still need to be winning.

 

[blaidd]

And HoD lets you add wargoals without needing 7% jingoism, but you still need to be winning.

I'm not sure that's true. My experience is that it's even harder than before to add additional war goals in Heart of Darkness. I've fought whole great wars and never been able to add a single goal. I've also noticed that you just have to be lucky and looking at the diplomacy screen at exactly the right time. It'd be super nice if there was an indicator. Maybe the flag could light up if you have the jingoism to add a goal.

For example, playing as Sardinia-Piedmont last night in 3.02b I was fighting against Egypt. I needed something like 9.98% jingoism to add a goal. Even though I was winning the war (50% warscore and they had zero troops) and they were begging me for peace, I couldn't add a new war goal because my jingoism was going DOWN. It would spike up slightly when I occupied a province or won a battle and then slowly tick down again without ever getting to the magic number. The trick was sending over a couple small cavalry stacks to occupy several provinces simultaneously. That caused a big spike which I took advantage of to add my goal before it ticked down again.

It's also a bit irritating that the jingoism percentage seems to appear and disappear from the Add Wargoal tooltip more or less randomly. Sometimes its there and sometimes its not.

 

[Raii]

In my eyes, Pro Military should be enough to add a war goal, but you should have to be significantly winning (like blaidd's 50%). Jingoism is intense nationalism, and it should be required to add war goals if you are at, say, >5~10%. I miss being able to complete steamroll a country, because now I feel like that when I'm done I pretty much just camp my troops in his entire country and just wait so I can get my extra land.

 

[Ricox]

Maybe Humiliate should be allowed for defenders, not sure.

Don't think it's needed. As Tumblew33d said - you already get prestige for winning a defensive war, while the enemy that failed to accomplish the CB takes a prestige hit, plus also gets a militancy hit (not sure what are the amounts for each CB, but I think failing acquire state gave 2 militancy to all pops).

 

[blaidd]

now I feel like that when I'm done I pretty much just camp my troops in his entire country and just wait so I can get my extra land.

Yeah, that's pretty much where I was with Egypt. I already had more than enough war score to demand both provinces that I wanted, but the war dragged on for an extra year or so just because I couldn't get my jingoism up enough to actually add it.

 

[maxirage]

Yeah, jingoism is now almost impossible to get. Even as Germany, going around bearing up Europe, I could never add any wargoals.

It feels like a very artificial and unfair limit. I wish they chose something else.

 

[Ricox]

Well, there is a little helpful event in HoD that incerases your pop's support of jingoism by 20%. Too bad it always comes in peace and not the right moment when I need it, meh.

 

[evran]

Don't think it's needed. As Tumblew33d said - you already get prestige for winning a defensive war, while the enemy that failed to accomplish the CB takes a prestige hit, plus also gets a militancy hit (not sure what are the amounts for each CB, but I think failing acquire state gave 2 militancy to all pops).

I think it's needed, I never have a problem with prestige but if I have to gear up for a war and mobilize it hurts my economy in the long run and it costs so much, I want reparations dammit... (looking at you Germany)

 

[Ricox]

I think it's needed, I never have a problem with prestige but if I have to gear up for a war and mobilize it hurts my economy in the long run and it costs so much, I want reparations dammit... (looking at you Germany)

Then you should fight for an automatic CB for cut down to size! Humiliate won't do much in terms of that.

 

[evran]

Read the third post on this thread...

 

[Tumblew33d]

I'm not sure that's true. My experience is that it's even harder than before to add additional war goals in Heart of Darkness.

Oops. I meant to say if you're lucky enough to have an extra existing cb.

 

[Director]

So I'm Sardinia-Piedmont, allied with France. I justify a war with Tuscany (allied with Austria) for conquest. I had to cheat a load of money to be able to supply my army, but hey - I'm still learning, so OK. War goes well - goes better when Prussia launches war for hegemony on Austria. I add a wargoal for Venetia. Immediately, France makes peace. I get Tuscany and the infamy for the second wargoal, followed by gang-bang wars from Russia, France (thanks - I became a great power after getting Tuscany which zeroed out the alliance) and Great Britain. Time to quit that game...

So given this, we can assume that Sardinia-Piedmont never formed Italy. Because if they had everyone on the planet including Japan and Zulu would have attacked them, tight? Sorry if this sounds bitter. I just hate that I enjoy so much about the game but always end up quitting the game after I waste a day for a result like this.

Serious question. Why get the infamy for a war goal when another power ends the war and I don't get the goal?

 

[unmerged(712097)]

Serious question. Why get the infamy for a war goal when another power ends the war and I don't get the goal?

I have this issue too cause i once drowned in infamy because every time a crisis happened id jump in with wargoals to make it worth my while but the ai kept peacing out without giving me my goals so i got the infamy for no reason i feel like you should only get infamy for wargoals you actually succeed at otherwise the ai can hamstring you by having you get infamy for nothing

 

[Raii]

Its because you are announcing to the world that that is your plan: to take even more land from country X (or whatever war goal). It is stupid that the AI hamstrings you, and maaaybe you could have an option to keep on fighting, even though you aren't the warleader (doubtful, but it should be an option if both of you are GP's), but in the end the infamy should be there.

Think about North Korea's recent proclamations, it kind of freaked the world out. They didn't actually attack any nations, and yet the whole globe was against them -- even China, their main ally. Adding war goals is just like that, showing how the globe was growing more interconnected and that infamy will adversely effect relationships.

 

[Director]

Perhaps if you kept 25% of the infamy... but saying, "Italy wants Venetia" is NOT the same as Italy TAKING Venetia.