Add (some) RoTW ideas with unique mechanics

[Empreorpoef]

Hey.


One thing which I would like to see is more national ideas with unique mechanics. Europe has these kind of ideas, take a look at these:

The French idea Native Trading Principles (Reduced native attacks, native tax & manpower +100%).
The Castillian idea Inter Caetera (Can fabricate claims on any overseas province, +1 Colonist).
The Horde tradition no cost for reinforcing.
The Russian idea Siberian Frontier (Auto-exploration of all territory adjacent to owned home territory, +1 colonist).
(Hungary, USA, even NORWAY has these type of unique ideas!).

Now, England used to have an "unique" idea (+33% [sic?] embargo efficiency), which is now gone. Same for Ottomans, which had Ghazi, again, removed. Shame.

RoTW has nothing like this. I'd like to see more ideas like this implemented in the game (of course, more time than regular ideas as these might actually require coding).

what do you think?

[Moderator edit] three threads on the same topic merged.

 

[PurpleFantasy]

saw this thread, immediately reminded me of japan from civ 5:

Bushido - units fight at full strength regardless of regiment strength (or at least decreased penalty for regiment strength)

 

[saegoto]

unique idea for austria: double bonuses of marches (military forntiers e.g.)

 

[birincikalite]

There are some good ideas actually, they just need number tweaks ofc. Btw, guys dont forget those are just ideas and some of the suggestions seems too complex to be ideas!

 

[LanMisa]

Nepal: Mountain Warriors. 1/2 army travel time and 50% attack bonus in mountain provinces. 10% Attack malus outside of mountain provinces.

Any Nation, for example North American ones: Unyeilding Spirit: 20% morale damage/defense boost if fighting enemy units with more pips/a higher military tech level.

 

[saegoto]

unique ideas for major powers

Inspired by unique ideas such as French Native attacks are severely reduced. +100% Tax and manpower from natives, Spanish Can fabricate claims on any overseas province, Russian Auto-exploration of all territory adjacent to owned home territory, Horde no reinforments cost , I decided to suggest some ideas for major powers to make the game more unique and interesting for these countries which people play the most.



NETHERLANDS

Spoiler

Traditions:
+50% Naval forcelimits modifier
-10% Shipbuilding time
Found the Amsterdam Wisselbank
+0.10 Yearly inflation reduction
double time you must repay a loan
Dutch Trading Spirit
+1 Merchants
-10% trade power required to receive a merchant from trade company
Polders
+10% Production efficiency
half build cost and power cost for build Canal in whole Low Countries region
Instructie voor de Admiraliteiten
+2 Naval leader fire
Admirality gives +33% naval tradition instead of flat +0,5
Embrace Humanism
+3 Tolerance of heretics
every point of positive tolerance of heretics reduce idea cost by 2%
Army Sappers
+10% Siege ability
increased chance for breach enemy walls
Platoon Fire
+10% Infantry combat ability
infantry can fire from second row in fire phase of a battle (as artillary)
Ambitions:
+15% National trade income modifier

AUSTRIA

Spoiler

Traditions:
every point of True Faith Tolerance gives +3% Land morale
+30% Better relations over time
Imperial Ambitions
+10% Imperial authority
double bonuses for marches
Military Frontier
+25% Fort defense
increace Military tactics when fight in Austrian core province
Fugger Banks
+0.05 Yearly inflation reduction
-1 Interest per Annum
Habsburg Dominance
+2 Diplomatic reputation
every royal marriage gives +1 Power Projection
Edict of Restitution
+2% Missionary strength
converted province gives army tradition (depends on base tax)
Austrian Court
+1 Diplomatic relations
+10% positive reasons for acceptance of AI (I mean this modifiers)
Hofkriegsrat
+30% Reinforce speed
every alliance with HRE member gives +1% Discipline (value can not exceed max diplomatic slots)
Ambitions:
+50% Increased chance of new heir

SPAIN

Spoiler

Traditions:
+15% Morale of armies
+1 Missionaries
The Reconquista
Religious Unity gives Discipline, instead of flat +5% discipline
-50% cost of Defender of the Faith
Spanish Inquisition
+2% Missionary strength
Inter Caetera
Can fabricate claims on any overseas province
+1 Colonists
Devout Catholicism
+2 Yearly Papal influence
Counter-Reformation decision gives no penalties
Treasure Fleet
+20% gold produce in all overseas and CN provinces
+15% Global tariffs
A Spanish Armada
+10% Heavy ship combat ability
+100% naval tradition from naval battles
Siglo De Oro
+1 Yearly prestige
+25% effects of prestige (also negative)
Ambitions:
+25 Global settler increase

FRANCE

Spoiler

Traditions:
+20% National manpower modifier
+1 Diplomatic relations
French Language in all courts
-25% support rebels cost
-10% negative reasons for acceptance of AI (I mean this modifiers)
Elan!
+20% Morale of armies
+50% wine good produce
Estates General
+10% National tax modifier
-20% cost of rising war taxes
Native Trading Principles
Native attacks are severely reduced.
+100% Tax and manpower from natives
Vauban Fortifications
half build cost and power cost for Star Fort for all border and coastal provinces in French region
+30% Fort defense
Louvios's Military Reforms*
+5% morale recovery speed
-25% reinforcement cost
The Philosophes
-10% Technology cost
a chance that arrived advisor has better modifier
Ambitions:
Legitimicy gives Discipline

*no Liberté, égalité, fraternité. It's idea for a Revolution country not for monarchical, conservative Bourbons and Valois France.

PORTUGAL

Spoiler

Traditions:
+5% Trade efficiency
+30% Trade range
Legacy of the Navigator
+25% Colonial range
Afonsine Ordinance
+10% Goods produced nationally
Found the Casa da India
+10% Global trade power
Encourage the Bandeirantes
+1 Merchants
all trade companies provines gives +0,1 land forcelimit
Royal Absolutism
-25% Build cost
Land before Faith
+15 Global settler increase
reduce truce time for Portugal agaist all countries in other religious group
Open up the Guilds
+10% National trade income modifier
Ambitions:
+20% Global tariffs

POLAND

Spoiler

Traditions:
-20% Cavalry cost
-15% Accepted Culture threshold
Promote the Folwark System
+10% Production efficiency
+50% good produce in all grain provinces
Nihil Novi
-10% Stability cost modifier
Piechota Wybraniecka
+25% National manpower modifier
+10% Infantry combat ability
Winged Hussars
+33% Cavalry combat ability
-50% insufficient support penalty
Wojsko Komputowe
-10% Regiment cost
Found the Foreign Section
+5% Discipline
Focus on Field Defense
+15% Morale of armies
+10% Maximum of Cavalry
Ambitions:
+3 Tolerance of heretics

ENGLAND

Spoiler

Traditions:
+33% Embargo Efficiency
+20% Morale of navies
A Royal Navy
+10% Heavy ship combat ability
Protecting trade fleets gives more naval tradition
The Eltham Ordinance
+15% National tax modifier
Courthouse gives +25% tax income instead of 10%
Secretaries of State
+1 Diplomatic relations
max +10% morale for country receiving subsidies (percentage of total income received) which is at war agaist English rival
The Navigation Acts
+15% National trade income modifier
provincial trade power of English CN decrease trade power of all non-CN countries in a node
English Bill of Rights
-1 National unrest
+10% Global Tariffs
Reform of Commission Buying
+5% Discipline
-50% cost of recruiting land leader
The Sick and Hurt Board
+5% Ship Durability
+10% ship speed
Ambitions:
Every 30 points of naval tradition gives +1 Admiral without upkeep

SWEDEN

Spoiler

Traditions:
-25% Mercenary maintenance
+20% Infantry combat ability
'Kung och Riksdag'
+1 Yearly legitimacy
Swedish Steel
+5% Discipline
+30% good produce in all iron provinces
The 'Hakkapeliitta'
-10% Cavalry cost
+20% offensive shock cavalry units pips
Indelningsverket
+20% Manpower recovery speed
Swedish Absolutism
-10% Stability cost modifier
a monarch who leads an army gives 0,5% discipline for his every fire and shock pipe for this stack
Produktplataket
+10% Goods produced nationally
Union and Security Act
+10% National manpower modifier
Ambitions:
+1 Land leader shock

RUSSIA

Spoiler

Traditions:
+25% National manpower modifier
-20% Infantry cost
Sudebnik
-15% Core-creation cost
+25% effects of scorched earth
Found the Streltsy
+50% Land forcelimits modifier
Oprichnina
+10% Manpower recovery speed
-20% Culture conversion cost
Abolish the Mestnichestvo
+10% Production efficiency
Siberian Frontier
Auto-exploration of all territory adjacent to owned home territory.
+1 Colonists
The Table of Ranks
+0.5 Yearly army tradition
Broathen the curriculum of the Cadet Corps
-10% Technology cost
Ambitions:
+50% National manpower modifier

OTTOMANS

Spoiler

Traditions:
+5% Discipline
-33% Core-creation cost
Ottoman Tolerance
+3 Tolerance of heathens
-15% Accepted culture threshold
Ghazi
+20% Manpower recovery speed
double bonus if is in war agaist rival from other religious group
Timariot System
+15% Cavalry combat ability
Autonomous Pashas
-10% Cost of reducing war exhaustion
The Law code of Suleiman
+10% National tax modifier
Tulip Period
+10% National trade income modifier
Found the Imperial School of Naval Engineering
-10% Ship costs
Ambitions:
+33% Land forcelimits modifier

 

[ragingrondo12]

1. We have this thread in here already.
2. No god No.
This would cause rebalancing the whole NI system. Not to mention make people complaints that the majors are too op more frequent.
3. Free buildings is not fair, balanced or anything. I can think of several ways to abuse the things you've posted already.

 

[deathsheep221]

40% Ghazi?

You're lucky you weren't around for 300% Ghazi.

 

[Freudia]

And if these major powers stop being major powers? Do they get to keep their magic inflated bonuses just by virtue of having them at one point?

That's the problem with 'unique ideas just for major powers.'

 

[Arag]

And if these major powers stop being major powers? Do they get to keep their magic inflated bonuses just by virtue of having them at one point?

That's the problem with 'unique ideas just for major powers.'

Not only this, it would take the uniqueness of certain nations away in favor of "major" powers.
Because a Sikh Nepal WC is more interesting than playing France again.

 

[Freudia]

Not only this, it would take the uniqueness of certain nations away in favor of "major" powers.
Because a Sikh Nepal WC is more interesting than playing France again.

Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of unique ideas. I just don't think they should confer bonuses that are inherently stronger than two 'normal bonuses' combined. This is why I think Russia's "gets adjacent territory revealed for free" and France's "doesn't get native attacks" is fairly fine, honestly, because they're pretty trivial in the grand scheme of the game.

Spain's 'can claim wherever I want' is stupid, though. That should be an event chain, not just some magic bonus granted only to Castile/Spain.

Edit: If anything, those 'unique ideas that are stronger than two normal bonuses combined' ideas should be given to 'doomed' starts or minor powers, as incentive to actually play those nations. It's kinda dumb that 50% of starts in the game are some mix of England, France, Russia, Castile, and the Ottomans.

 

[ahyangyi]

40% Ghazi?

You're lucky you weren't around for 300% Ghazi.

It requires rivalry, so I guess it's less prone to gamey strategy...

 

[ahyangyi]

Edit: If anything, those 'unique ideas that are stronger than two normal bonuses combined' ideas should be given to 'doomed' starts or minor powers, as incentive to actually play those nations. It's kinda dumb that 50% of starts in the game are some mix of England, France, Russia, Castile, and the Ottomans.

I guess it's much harder to justify unique ideas on small nations. What kind of unique idea can you design for Ryukyu (or Albania if you don't try to model everything after its one genius ruler), that you can justify on historical grounds?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

It requires rivalry, so I guess it's less prone to gamey strategy...

The only thing gamey about using Ghazi back in the day was picking the Ottomans at the start. None of their challenging fights were Islamic.

 

[ahyangyi]

The only thing gamey about using Ghazi back in the day was picking the Ottomans at the start. None of their challenging fights were Islamic.

Well I hear the gamey part is DoW and don't actually fight to win.

This version requires rivalry. DoWing a rival and don't actually fight is at least slightly more risky.

 

[saegoto]

3. Free buildings is not fair, balanced or anything. I can think of several ways to abuse the things you've posted already.

ok, you're right - half cost then. any other ways to abuse?

40% Ghazi?

You're lucky you weren't around for 300% Ghazi.

Yes, I was. It was really so OP. Now it requires RIVALRY so the country u'r fighting must have same potencial as Ottomans and be non-muslim.

And if these major powers stop being major powers? Do they get to keep their magic inflated bonuses just by virtue of having them at one point?

All bonuses are magical. if england don't colonise but focus on continantal wars whole game why does England still have bonus to trade income, tarrifs and fleets if player don't develop these aspects?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Well I hear the gamey part is DoW and don't actually fight to win.

This version requires rivalry. DoWing a rival and don't actually fight is at least slightly more risky.

My point is that you wouldn't need to "DoW and not fight to win" before as Ottomans; the only opponents where it mattered in the slightest what your manpower recovery was weren't Sunni so you'd get it when you needed it regardless in SP. In MP you'd at least have the risk of a strong Mamluks or Mughals or something gumming you up early on, or a big dogpile pre-ghazi.

The suggested version wouldn't be so bad, staying at war with a legit rival for extended periods carries a cost in that you're spending at least some time at war with only them and not others, and that time is time you'd otherwise spend using temporary peace to remove WE and especially LA.

 

[saegoto]

Wiz, Johan what do you think about it guys?

 

[Me_]

More one-of-a-kind national ideas

I think that it might be a good idea to give some nations more one-of-a-kind national ideas.

For example: France has a national idea that reduces native attacks and doubles bonuses from natives. This is something that no other nation has, and regardless of its actual utility, it's something that strongly influences your preferred way of playing, by making certain play style (peaceful coexistence with the natives) considerably stronger.
Another example: Norway has an idea that lets it hire explorers and conquistadors and another that gives you colonists. This allows Norway to play the colonial game without committing an idea group, and therefore opens up the possibility of a considerably different colonial experience.
There are also some ideas that achieve this by the sheer scope of the bonus. E.g. Poland gets +33% cavalry combat ability making a large cavalry force a very good idea.

Having a highly unique ideas is something that makes nations more interesting to try out. Oh great, another +10% global trade power just does not have the same vibe as I can have the largest, most advanced army in the world and pay no extra cost for reinforcing it (westernized Qing).

So, what I would propose is adding more ideas that strongly influence your game style.

E.g.

An idea for one of the Mediterranean nations that would let you protect trade with galleys and giving them 2 trade power. This would make galley fleets a more reasonable choice for that nation.

An idea that adds another effect to republican tradition, say, +0.2% goods produced per point of tradition, that is +20% goods produced at 100% republican tradition. This would make keeping your tradition high more important. Alternatively an idea that halves the effect of tradition on stability cost. This would make low tradition less problematic.

An idea that gives prestige for every trade node where you have 50%+ tradepower. A way for trader nation to gain prestige peacefully (this one, I'd actually like to see become a standard feature, it's strange that trade cannot generate prestige).

An idea that gives access to one of the Espionage actions without requiring Espionage. Those actions seem quite uninteresting, consider the price that one needs to pay to get them, perhaps giving one to one nation “for free” would at least make them become a tiny bit more common.

An idea that gives +10% discipline when fighting rivals. A powerful bonus that only Japan can match, but at a price of being applicable only to 3 nations at a time.

An idea that increases military tactics on own territory. For a more defensive, let-them-come-here type of warfare.

Your colonial nations have +10% manpower. Similar to how marches affect subject's stats, how about an idea that gives a bonus to your subjects. I'd choose colonial nations, since those are the subjects you'll have whether you like it or not.

Get 10% of your vassals' manpower. Similar to how you get cash from vassals, how about getting some manpower.

Can demand conversion from subject nations. This would require a new diplomatic option, but it would be similar to one already present.

Can create trade posts. This would be a powerful addition for a trade nation that for whatever reason isn't/cannot become a merchant republic.

Manufactures give +15% more goods produced. And other possible changes to building effects. E.g. each fort level adds +5% defensiveness.

Trading in X effects are gained at 10% share (instead of 20% share) encouraging the player to seek out those bonuses.

+50% [insert trade good name] produced a big bonus to a single trade good, encouraging you to prioritize provinces with this trade good.

Claims last 50% longer. Exactly what it says.

Converting a province lowers its autonomy by 25 or Converting a province gives you 5*its base tax in cash or Converting a province gives it a 10-year bonus of +25% tax income.

Trade company provinces do not suffer a tax penalty.

Effects of negative stability are halved.

Gain power projection when you force someone to break treaties with a rival.

+33% manpower if power projection is 50% or more


I might add some more suggestions later.

 

[marcsimus]

Yeah, it's a great idea, NIs have to be more unique, atleast the most significant and promisingly countries should be tweaked.

 

[saegoto]

great ideas Me_

there are some new ideas of modifiers for Netherlands, Spain, Austria, France, Sweden and Prussia (All numbers are exemplary):

NETHERLANDS
Found the Amsterdam Wisselbank
+0.10 Yearly inflation reduction
double time of repaying loans (10 years instead of 5)
Instructie voor de Admiraliteiten
+2 Naval leader fire
Admirality gives +25% naval tradition instead of flat 0,5
Embrace Humanism
+3 Tolerance of heretics
every point of positive tolerance of heretics reduce idea cost by 2% (max tolerance for heretics is +3 so max idea cost reduce is -6%)
Platoon Fire
+10% Infantry combat ability
double damage of infantry in fire phase if attacked units have equal or higher defensive fire pips than dutch infantry have offensive fire pips

SPAIN
The Reconquista
Religious Unity gives 6,5% Discipline, instead of flat +5% discipline; (0 religious unity gives 0% discipline, 100% religious unity gives 6,5% discipline, so every point of religious unity gives 0,065% discipline)
-50% cost of Defender of the Faith and gives no penalties
Devout Catholicism
+2 Yearly Papal influence
Counter-Reformation decision gives no penalties
Siglo De Oro
+1 Yearly prestige
+50% effects of prestige (also negative)

FRANCE
The Philosophes
-10% Technology cost
there is a chance that arrived advisor has better modifier (e.g. Philosopher: prestige +1,5 instead of +1 or Artist: Stability cost -15% instead of 10%, Commandant +7,5% discipline instead of +5% etc but it's only A CHANCE, not every advisor)
Ambition:
Legitimicy gives 7% Discipline, instead of flat +5% discipline; (50 legitimicy gives 0% discipline, 100 legitimcy gives 7% discipline, so every point of legitimcy higher than 50 gives 0,14% dicipline)

AUSTRIA
Traditions:
instead of: +10% Morale of armies, every point of true faith tolerance gives +3% morale
Military Frontier
+25% Fort defense
increace Military tactics when fight in Austrian core province
Habsburg Dominance
+2 Diplomatic reputation
every royal marriage gives +1 Power Projection
Edict of Restitution
+2% Missionary strength
converted province gives army tradition (depends on base tax)
Hofkriegsrat
+30% Reinforce speed
every alliance with HRE member gives +1% Discipline (value can not exceed max diplomatic slots), instead of flat +3 discipline

SWEDEN
Swedish Absolutism
-10% Stability cost modifier
a monarch who leads an army gives 0,5% discipline for his every fire and shock pipe for this stack

PRUSSIA:
Ambitions:
every military monarch point of the ruler gives +2% discipline (min 0%, max 12%) - instead of flat +7,5% discipline