Add/Redraw Provinces in the Western Balkans that were updated in 1.30

[Shahanshah759]

The 1.30 patch and Emperor drastically improved the province density and historical accuracy of the southwestern Balkans from what the region looked like previously. That being said, the changes resulted in a few inconsistencies in province size and made it impossible for accurate historical borders during the EUIV time period to be formed organically (for example, the Habsburg-Ottoman border in Western Bosnia). Additionally, a few opportunities for creating provinces which reflect historical regional and administrative divisions were missed (ie. accurate Croatian županije, a correctly shaped Principality of Montenegro, and the Sanjak of Novi Pazar).

This suggestion seeks to further improve the region by evening out its province density and improving the historical fidelity of provincial borders. All of the new provinces I propose, as well as redrawn/renamed existing provinces, were drawn with some gameplay or historical purpose in mind (relevant sources are attached) and while attempting to avoid excessively small or unworkable province shapes and sizes. Much of my suggestion is compatible with @otaats' suggestion, focusing on Serbia, as most of the provinces I adjusted are to the west of this region. The picture I used as a base was taken directly from the dev diary for the Empire DLC which focused on the Balkan region.

The New Western Balkans:

Cyan stands for new provinces
Orange are provinces that should have their borders adjusted

Spoiler: Credit to other Forum Users

The colour scheme for the map above was inspired by @Martin_Mortyry. The colour scheme used below for province names, capitals, terrain types, and trade goods is inspired by @otaats.

Province Rework:

Spoiler: Croatia and Slavonia

1. Rijeka
Ita./Hun. Fiume, Ger. Pflaum

Rijeka - Woods - Cloth

This province represents the Modruš-Rijeka (Modrus-Fiume) county of the Kingdom of Croatia, including the city of Rijeka/Fiume that existed as a corpus separatum under Habsburg control in the latter parts of the game's timeline. Borders have been adjusted slightly to make the province's shape more accurate and accommodate the new Bihać province.

2. Zagreb
Hun. Zágráb, Ger. Agram

Zagreb - Grasslands - Cloth

Zagreb remains relatively unchanged, though the shape of its southern border has been adjusted to fit with the Bihać province.

3. Bjelovar
Hun. Belovár, Ger. Bellowar, Tur. Çazma

Bjelovar - Grasslands - Cloth

This province represents the Bjelovar-Križevci county of the Kingdom of Croatia, and is slightly adjusted to account for the changes to Slavonia.

4. Lika
Tur. Kırka

Kaseg (later Gospić) - Woods - Fish

This province has been changed to more accurately reflect the shape of the Lika-Krbava county. Under Ottoman rule, it represents the Sanjak of Kırka. The Sanjak (also called the 'Sanjak of Krka and Lika') had its capital to the south in Knin, but it included the region of Lika. Since the Krka river and the city of Knin lie outside of the province's border in-game, it could make sense to keep the name 'Lika' even under Ottoman control.

5. Bihać
Hun. Bihács, Tur. Bihke

Bihać - Hills - Wool

This new province, centred around the city of Bihać, represents the Western part of the Bosanska Krajina region which begins under Croatian control in 1444. With the 1.30 update, it is now impossible to create the historical Ottoman-Habsburg border after the Treaty of Karlowitz that followed the Sava and Korana rivers in Western Bosnia (this continues to be the modern Croatian-Bosnian border). The addition of this province fixes this problem. The province was also an administrative division (sanjak) of the Ottomans' Bosnia Eyalet after their conquest of Bosnia.

6. Požega
Hun. Pozsega, Tur. Pojega

Požega - Hills - Livestock

This new province represents the historical Požega (Poszega) county of the Kingdom of Croatia, one of the two administrative divisions which make up Slavonia. This southwestern area of Slavonia is more hilly and wooded than the fertile north, and was historically a part of the Ottoman Sanjak of Pojega. After the area was reconquered by the Habsburgs, it became a part of the Slavonian Military Frontier which was populated by Serb and Vlach peasants to form a buffer and conscription pool against the Ottomans.

7. Virovitica
Hun. Verőce, Tur. Rahoviçe

Virovitica - Farmlands - Grain

This province is a rework of the old Slavonia province, and represents the fertile Virovitica (Verőce) county of the Kingdom of Croatia. Under Ottoman rule it was part of the Sanjak of Pojega but the northern area was administered from Orahovica (Rahoviçe) as a kaza. Under Habsburg rule, the province was reconstituted as Civil Slavonia while the south remained under military rule.

Spoiler: Venetian Dalmatia

8. Zadar
Ita./Intl. Zara

Zadar - Grasslands - Naval Supplies

The province of Zadar represents the coastal part of the Venetian Stato da Màr administered from Zara (Zadar). Its borders have been adjusted to accommodate a new province in the Dalmatian Hinterland.

9. Split
Ita./Intl. Spalato

Split - Grasslands - Salt

The province of Split represents the coastal part of the Venetian Stato da Màr administered from Spalato (Split). Its borders have been adjusted to accommodate a new province in the Dalmatian Hinterland.

10. Zagora
Ita./Intl. Morlacca, Tur. Kilis

Knin - Hills - Wool

This new province represents the Dalmatian Hinterland, centred around the city of Knin. This hilly region in the Dalmatian interior never really came under direct Venetian control and remained more Slavic than the Italianized coastal cities. A few maps suggest that the area was under Croatian control in and around the 1444 start date, but it's probably best to keep it owned by Venice but with high autonomy and Croatian culture (rather than the new, Latin Dalmatian culture of the coast). When the Ottomans conquered the area it was administered as part of the Sanjak of Kilis, its capital moving north to Livno after the area was retaken by the Venetians.

Spoiler: Bosnia and Herzegovina

11. Tropolje
Tur. İhlevne

Livno - Hills - Wool

This new province represents the Tropolje area of Bosnia, centred around the city of Livno, which roughly corresponds to modern-day Bosnia's Canton 10. The Hum and Donji Kraji provinces are quite big in relation to other neighbouring provinces, so it makes sense to split off the Tropolje area as a new province. Under Ottoman control, the area was reconstituted as the Sanjak of Livno (İhlevne).

12. Donji Kraji
Tur. Banya Luka

Jajce (Banja Luka after Ottoman conquest) - Hills - Livestock

This province represents the region of Donji Kraji, the eastern part of the Bosanska Krajina which follows the Vrbas river valley and basin. Under Bosnian and Croatian-Hungarian control/suzerainty, the area was administered from its southernmost city of Jajce as the Jajačka Banovina. The Ottomans reconstituted the region as the Sanjak of Banya Luka and the provincial centre shifted to the city of Banja Luka.

13. Lašva
Tur. Travnik

Travnik - Hills - Grain

This province represents the area between the Vrbas and Bosna rivers, centred around the city of Travnik and the Lašva valley. It is a rework of the Bosnia province which really should be renamed/reworked as the Bosnia region was historically much larger than currently represented in-game. As with other north-south river valleys in the Bosnia region, the Lašva area is quite fertile despite its hilly terrain. Under Ottoman rule, the region was administered as the Sanjak of Travnik.

14. Usora
Hun. Ózora, Tur. Tuzla

Srebrenik (Tuzla after Ottoman conquest) - Woods - Salt

This new province represents the regions of Usora and Soli which were historically ruled by numerous feudal lords (bans) loyal to either Hungary or Bosnia (in the 1444 start, the Ban of Usora has sworn fealty to the Bosnian king so it should be a part of Bosnia). Prior to Ottoman conquest, the area was centred around the city of Srebrenik and, as such, was referred to as the Srebrenička Banovina by the Hungarians and Croatians who (usually mistakenly) saw the Bans of Usora as their vassals. The province, especially its sub-region of Soli, was known for its salt production. After the Ottomans took control of the region, salt production increased and the provincial centre shifted east to Tuzla in Soli. The area would be ruled by the Ottomans save for a brief interim period in the early 18th-century where the region came under Habsburg control following the Treaty of Passarowitz (the province was returned to Ottoman control in the 1739 Treaty of Belgrade).

15. Hum

Blagaj (Mostar after Ottoman conquest) - Mountains - Copper

This province represents the western parts of mountainous Herzegovina, known for its copper mines, ruled in 1444 as part of the Duchy of St. Sava. Under Ottoman control, the provincial centre shifted slightly to the west from the Kosača family home in Blagaj to Mostar.

16. Herzegovina
Tur. Hersek

Trebinje - Mountains - Wine

This province represents the eastern parts of mountainous Herzegovina, centred around the city of Trebinje. The famous wine produced in the Tvrdoš Monastery is native to this province.

17. Vrhbosna
Tur. Saraybosna

Visoko (Sarajevo after Ottoman conquest) - Hills - Grain

The province of Vrhbosna represents the fertile river valley region near the source of the Bosna river which was the centre of the medieval Bosnian kingdom. Following the Ottoman conquest of the region, the centre of the province would shift from the old Bosnia capital city of Visoko to the modern Bosnian capital, Sarajevo. During Ottoman times it was administered as the Sanjak of Saraybosna (the ending eventually changed to -evo in common speech as this is a South Slavic suffix used to indicate place-names).

18. Podrinje
Tur. İzvornik

Zvornik - Hills - Iron

The province of Podrinje represents the Drina river basin which straddles modern-day Bosnia and Serbia. Maps and sources suggest that the province was under Serbian control in the 1444 start date, and that the region was famous for its mines. Under Ottoman control, the province was reconstituted as the Sanjak of Zvornik (İzvornik).

Spoiler: Serbia and Montenegro

19. Kotor
Ita. Cattaro

Kotor - Mountains - Naval Supplies

This province represents Venetian holdings along the Montenegrin coast, especially in the Bay of Kotor. Despite its current 'flat' shape in-game, the region is full of natural harbours and should be redrawn to represent the inland curve of the Bay of Kotor in the western part of the province.

20. Zeta
Intl. Montenegro, Tur. Karadağ

Zabljak (Cetinje after Montenegrin independence) - Mountains - Livestock

This province represents the mountainous regions of Old Montenegro and Brda. Currently, in-game, the province of Zeta is quite oversized and extends too far to the north into the modern-day Sandžak region. As Montenegro didn't expand into that region until the late-19th century, I think it makes sense to reduce the size of the province to the historical territory of the Crnojevići, the Prince-Bishopric, and the Tribes of Brda that remained de-facto independent from Ottoman rule after the fall of the Serbian Despotate. Shortly after the 1444 start date, the Zeta area would get its independence after Stefan Crnojević rebelled against Serbia with Venetian support as the former was invaded by the Ottomans. The Crnojevići capital was originally the city of Zabljak until the 1470s when Cetinje was founded.

21. Raška
Tur. Yeni Pazar

Novo Trgovište - Hills - Livestock

While modern-day Raška is located entirely in Serbia, historically the region spanned across both northern Montenegro and southwestern Serbia. This region was where the Serbs originally settled after migrating south of the Carpathian mountains. After the collapse of the Serbian Empire, the region emerged as an autonomous realm ruled by the Brancović family. Under the Serbian Despotate, the provincial centre was the market town of Novo Trgovište which developed into modern-day Novi Pazar (Yeni Pazar in Turkish). Following the Ottoman conquest of the region in 1459, it became the Sanjak of Yeni Pazar (referred to simply as 'Sandžak in Serbo-Croatian) and remained in Ottoman hands all the way until 1912 when it became part of Serbia after the First Balkan War. There is some debate as to whether Raška and Sandžak are two separate regions, but drawing a distinction seems to have an ideological motive (ie. Orthodox Christian 'Raška' vs Muslim 'Sandžak'). For this region, I suggest that the issue be dealt with through dynamic province names. This way, players who want to recreate the historical Muslim corridor (from Kosovo, through Sandžak, and into Bosnia) and those who want to play around with the Serbian mission tree and create a 'Greater Serbia' can both be satisfied.

22. Stari Vlah

Užice - Hills - Livestock

This province represents the Stari Vlah region which encompasses the Zlatibor foothills and the Moravica river valley. It gets its name from the numerous Vlach pastoralists who practised transhumance in this hilly region (Vlach doesn't necessarily mean romance-speakers; it eventually became a term to refer to any nomadic pastoralist, including Serbs). Important cities in the province include Užice and Čačak. Though often considered a part of Raška, administratively the region was governed from the north during the Despotate and under Ottoman rule (forming the southern third of the Sanjak of Smederevo).

Thanks for reading through my suggestion! I tried to make my provinces as compatible with other suggestions as possible and of a feasible size and shape for the devs to implement (I would do it myself if I had the modding skills). I focused on Bosnia and Croatia as I have studied those areas extensively, but I'm sure a case could be made for continuing to even out province density in neighbouring areas like Hungary and Serbia as well (ie. splitting Niš into Niš and Kruševo/Toplica). If any of you would like to see more sources, maps, or have some information that contradicts my suggestion, feel free to start a discussion in the comments!

 

[Vaximillian]

It won’t happen but I’d love to see it.

 

[otaats]

It's done in great detail, (would work greatly for some sort of a more focused mod) but you're never getting so many provinces out here. It wouldn't make sense from the gameplay standpoint.

 

[Svabo_Loca]

Its pretty good concept of redraw to the balkans/hum but croatia dont need that much provinces bosnia dont need new provinces its need a new remake of bosnia area cause its not historicly accurate ofcourse the whole balkans are not historically acurate like croatia its never existed in that time bosnian culture ??
if Tvrtko Kotromanic was a gamer he would be really mad and ofcourse albania idk why are they still in the game but ok

 

[Shahanshah759]

It's done in great detail, (would work greatly for some sort of a more focused mod) but you're never getting so many provinces out here. It wouldn't make sense from the gameplay standpoint.

I would be happy if 2-4 of the proposed new provinces get added and some of the weird province shapes are fixed. I could see ignoring the Dalmatian hinterland and southern Slavonia but implementing the other changes. Given that some nearby provinces in Italy and Austria have been made smaller there might be a chance to increase province density in the West Adriatic region as well.

 

[otaats]

Thing is i'd like to see all of them, but it's more like Victoria III level of map detail

And yeah, i agree on shapes, you really did a great job making the borders according to natural obstacles.

 

[Pbhuh]

So this is too much. There are too many provinces that are too small. We need to be realistic.

What provinces are missing that would be a major addition and make the region more accurate?

Well there is one that I generally want and that should have been added:

Bihac or Bosanska Krajina.

Adding this single province would allow for more accurate modern day borders people are used to from Bosnia.

The Bosnia Province is fine but needs to simply include Visoki or the Visoki province should represent Original Bosnia. Then the Bosnia province can be changed to Usora Where its Capital is located anyway.

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Slovenia
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Slovenia is in a much more dire need of Fixing.

Celje should probably represent Slovenian part of the Styrian March.

Styria (Slovenia) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Rivers are still weird. The Drava and Mur need to be split so that the borders can be accurate. Sopron also sucks.

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Hungary
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Then there is Hungary in general, which is way worse off than Croatia and Bosnia. Sopron taking up all of the western side of Lake Balaton. Lake balaton being too far south, no Zala or other province west of Balaton. Pest is huge, while it could easily be split into smaller provinces.

No Arad or Zarand, No representation of the Banat, only Toronal and Temes, no area, no third province etc.

 

[Shahanshah759]

Hungary is definitely in dire need of better provinces, so these suggestions should really be included with some sort of patch that updates the Hungarian region (which should have happened in the Hungary patch, but whatever.

I like your suggestions for Slovenia, though I think the shapes can be fixed without adding an additional province for the Prekmurje (would be too small).

For Bosnia, I agree that the Bihać/Krajina province is the most necessary and I would be okay with just renaming Bosnia to Usora. Also, I'm not sure what you meant by...

The Bosnia Province is fine but needs to simply include Visoki or the Visoki province should represent Original Bosnia. Then the Bosnia province can be changed to Usora Where its Capital is located anyway.

...but the capital (Visoko and later Sarajevo) is not in the Usora province/region; it is in Vrhbosna which is in the current province of Visoki.

 

[Pbhuh]

Hungary is definitely in dire need of better provinces, so these suggestions should really be included with some sort of patch that updates the Hungarian region (which should have happened in the Hungary patch, but whatever.

I like your suggestions for Slovenia, though I think the shapes can be fixed without adding an additional province for the Prekmurje (would be too small).

For Bosnia, I agree that the Bihać/Krajina province is the most necessary and I would be okay with just renaming Bosnia to Usora. Also, I'm not sure what you meant by...



...but the capital (Visoko and later Sarajevo) is not in the Usora province/region; it is in Vrhbosna which is in the current province of Visoki.

True, hence I think the Bosnia province is off. The province is better represented by Visoki. I get the use of the name though. Bosnia represents the original territory. Though the current choice is odd, Usora is a better choice for what the Bosnia province represents with its area and capital of Doboj and Visoki is kinda weird as it was part of the Original Territory. Sarajevo could be an event for Ottomans, maybe founding the city replacing Visoki.

oh yeah i dont think Prekmurje is needed, Celje already is good for this area. It just needs to be locked more to the Sava river.