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Davisx3m

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I was thinking, Cities Skylines have a mod which makes it possible to gain achievements even though you play with mods. Is this something the CK2 community would like?

I know some could and probably would abuse it to get the achievements.
But the game has been out for a long while, and we (me) who only play mods would like to
be able to try and reach for the achievements with mods.

What does other think about this? Is it a big no? Or would you also like it?
 
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heliostellar

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Paradox is the only video game house that I know of that forces this issue on mods. I'm not even sure why. You cannot even see what my achievements are without some significant effort on your part, so my own achievements are basically a trophy that I only show myself.
 

Keizer Harm

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I like the closed nature. It makes achievements mean something. And you can check what percentage of the community has them, a reference which would deteriorate immediately if mods were allowed.
 
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Davisx3m

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Could it perhaps be possible to make a copy of all existing achievements but make them catchable with mods.
That way the normal achievements would keep the stats and not deteriorate.
 

Heinrich4

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I would not like it.
I like the closed nature. It makes achievements mean something. And you can check what percentage of the community has them, a reference which would deteriorate immediately if mods were allowed.

I have to agree. Achievements are something unique. If you want to get some achievements you need to invest a lot of time and they basically show what you have achieved in the game. If they could be earned with mods a lot of players could just "cheat" all of the achievements. E.g. there are achievement cheats for CS:GO or TF2, so some players with only little hours have all of the achievements unlocked.
 

loup99

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There is a mod (which you can find in the list of user modifications) that allows to "acquire" achievements via events and the chronicle, and as long as it is compatible, it should work with other mods.
 

Davisx3m

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There is a mod (which you can find in the list of user modifications) that allows to "acquire" achievements via events and the chronicle, and as long as it is compatible, it should work with other mods.

Could you perhaps link them to me?
 

loup99

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Davisx3m

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loup99

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Given how much the game has changed since patch 2.0 introduced the achievements, the question of achiements and mods becomes less clear than if the game had been changed very little since then. For example, I got the S.P.Q.R. achievement shortly after SoA, which most likely would have become easier with 2.1 (due to factions being easier to defeat; though I would have been less able to grab land from rebelling vassals), harder with 2.2 (due to the vassal limit, and possibly other things), probably unaffected by 2.3 (though playing with WoL might lead to crazy focus stuff), not overly affected by 2.4 (though HL could have made a large difference), and much harder with 2.5 (due to the ERE starting out large enough that there *will* be Defensive Pacts forming if you try to expand even half as rapidly as you could do in 2.0). It is still possible to roll back to a different patch to grab that achivement (and a lot of others) if you don't want to try getting them with the current version, but that's in many ways similar to modding the game (though somewhat more official), so in a way the argument that the unmodded game is the way the game is meant to be played falls apart due to that.

Some of the most basic achievements (get married, play until the end, become a duke in one generation, etc.) would, in my opinion, make sense to open up to mods and perhaps even non-Ironman games. Others (e.g. become king of England as Denmark in 1066) could easily be cheated with mods by simply giving your character lots of troops/money/prestige/etc., which can make a difficult achievement very easy. Then again, as achievements have no effect and mostly are a way to keep track of the fact that you have managed to do some things, letting people get them even with mods wouldn't give people an unfair advantage, though those who had gotten the achievements without any mods might feel cheated as they had to spend time and effort to unlock something that became trivial with mods.
 

Keizer Harm

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Given how much the game has changed since patch 2.0 introduced the achievements, the question of achiements and mods becomes less clear than if the game had been changed very little since then. For example, I got the S.P.Q.R. achievement shortly after SoA, which most likely would have become easier with 2.1 (due to factions being easier to defeat; though I would have been less able to grab land from rebelling vassals), harder with 2.2 (due to the vassal limit, and possibly other things), probably unaffected by 2.3 (though playing with WoL might lead to crazy focus stuff), not overly affected by 2.4 (though HL could have made a large difference), and much harder with 2.5 (due to the ERE starting out large enough that there *will* be Defensive Pacts forming if you try to expand even half as rapidly as you could do in 2.0). It is still possible to roll back to a different patch to grab that achivement (and a lot of others) if you don't want to try getting them with the current version, but that's in many ways similar to modding the game (though somewhat more official), so in a way the argument that the unmodded game is the way the game is meant to be played falls apart due to that.

I do not agree with that argument. One way of playing makes the achievement easier than other ways, that only makes sense. That can include rolling back to whatever version best fits your goals, but also starting with the right character at the right time and essentially trying the same strategy over and over again until the dice roll in your favour and you win. But all of these strategies have one thing in common: they take time and effort. Even on the easiest patch, becoming Augustus or Samrat Chakrivartin is a beast. That is in no way comparable with mods, where the simple click of a button can get you all the lands you want. If there was a way for the computer or Steam to distinguish between mods like HIP/CK2+ or minor correction mods, that do not unbalance the game, and the mods that intentionally do, I would support achievements for them, but there is no clear line possible to be drawn.

Some of the most basic achievements (get married, play until the end, become a duke in one generation, etc.) would, in my opinion, make sense to open up to mods and perhaps even non-Ironman games. Others (e.g. become king of England as Denmark in 1066) could easily be cheated with mods by simply giving your character lots of troops/money/prestige/etc., which can make a difficult achievement very easy. Then again, as achievements have no effect and mostly are a way to keep track of the fact that you have managed to do some things, letting people get them even with mods wouldn't give people an unfair advantage, though those who had gotten the achievements without any mods might feel cheated as they had to spend time and effort to unlock something that became trivial with mods.

It would not give mod-players a true advantage, but it would deteriorate the statistics. If I get The Outside Bet pop up in a game, I would want to know how many people actually succeeded in doing that.
 
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