Abyssinia help, tips and suggestions

[Polldark]

I'm currently trying a 769 Ironman play-through of Abyssinia. I've tried this many times, as it's always grabbed me as an interesting corner to fight your way out of. However, I've never done especially well (I normally get stomped on by the Abbasid blob) but this time I've got far enough that i'm hitting up against a few new issues.

Some context:

• Download file attached for those that are interested.
• I think have all of the expansions except Holy Fury or whatever it is called and I've turned off sunset invasion because it's stupid.
• I've got elective succession.
• I have not once been attacked by a Muslim character. Crazy i know, but my Chancellor has been camped out in the Abbasid capital and they just haven't bothered with me.
• I quickly consolidated Abyssinia, Numibia and what would nowadays be modern day Yemen.
• I've been using holy wars to expand West and keep the Miaphysitism religion strong.
• However, my Miaphysite brethren in the Caucuses have been smashed. So we only control one religious site and this is making Miaphysitism prone to heretics.
• The Abbasid's are hench...I've not seen them do this well in ages and they control from Morocco through to the Indus Valley. I've not seen any major revolts let alone one i could take advantage of.
• I could easily make my self Emperor of Kanem-Bornu, but i haven't yet. Mainly because i may want to swear fealty to the Byzantines to get myself out of a situation where i'm isolated behind a wall of Abbasid. However, i'm also concerned as to who the electors will be and that i don't hold those titles.
• I might go for a "custom" empire if i don't manage to swear fealty to Constantinople.
  
• Income of circa 30.
• My tech level is poor, and even poorer outside of my demesne.

There are few issues i need help with.

Religion

• I'm running out of holy wars to wage and soon I will control all of Mali . How can i keep my religion strong? Build temples? i'm worried about the inevitable lock in behind a wall of Strong Muslim states.
• What strategies could i employ to become Orthodox or Catholic? i'd happily change religion for benefit. That being said i hate the gamey dynasty mechanics of playing as a Muslim. So i'd rather go down fighting than swear fealty to the Abbasid's. Plus my dynasty has been spread far and wide, so i don't think i'd last long as a Muslim at this point.

Vassals

• Most of my vassals are tribal and correspondingly they are very weak. I've set up lots of Duchies to help a few consolidate wealth and power in the hope the will eventually go feudal, but how else can i boost them? Should i build holdings for them? Maybe temples to help with the religion issues? should i upgrade their main holdings for them?
• I've been lowering tax rates on tribal vassals for a while in the hopes this will also help them out.

Abbasid blob

• What can i do to destabilize them from the outside? I have no idea.
• If i have to swear allegiance how can i avoid my titles being revoked or a forced conversion?
• What's the best way of getting allies? I'm not great at this aspect of the game.

Any idea or help would be much appreciated and i'm happy to think outside of the box.

 

[Willy Waggler]

Just bee yourself.

 

[Blackwhitecavias]

I'm currently trying a 769 Ironman play-through of Abyssinia. I've tried this many times, as it's always grabbed me as an interesting corner to fight your way out of. However, I've never done especially well (I normally get stomped on by the Abbasid blob) but this time I've got far enough that i'm hitting up against a few new issues.

Some context:

• 
  
• However, my Miaphysite brethren in the Caucuses have been smashed. So we only control one religious site and this is making Miaphysitism prone to heretics.
• The Abbasid's are hench...I've not seen them do this well in ages and they control from Morocco through to the Indus Valley. I've not seen any major revolts let alone one i could take advantage of.
• Income of circa 30.
• My tech level is poor, and even poorer outside of my demesne.

I would say these are the most important things.
You have a very strong income, which can and should be used to pay for mercenaries to assist in wars.
Your tech level is most likely the biggest thing holding you back, as your vassals need a certain level of castle infrastructure to feudalise (I checked the safe file and that level is only present in the area around your capital and the 1 county you hold in the west.

Religion

• I'm running out of holy wars to wage and soon I will control all of Mali . How can i keep my religion strong? Build temples? i'm worried about the inevitable lock in behind a wall of Strong Muslim states.
• What strategies could i employ to become Orthodox or Catholic? i'd happily change religion for benefit. That being said i hate the gamey dynasty mechanics of playing as a Muslim. So i'd rather go down fighting than swear fealty to the Abbasid's. Plus my dynasty has been spread far and wide, so i don't think i'd last long as a Muslim at this point.

I wouldn't know why changing to Orthodox or Catholic would really help you before 900 (start of crusades as Saxony is still alive and norse and the Ummayads are pushing into France).
Catholic moral authority isn't much higher than your own, so that also wouldn't really help.

Vassals

• Most of my vassals are tribal and correspondingly they are very weak. I've set up lots of Duchies to help a few consolidate wealth and power in the hope the will eventually go feudal, but how else can i boost them? Should i build holdings for them? Maybe temples to help with the religion issues? should i upgrade their main holdings for them?
• I've been lowering tax rates on tribal vassals for a while in the hopes this will also help them out.

In order to feudalise a tribal leader needs a stone hillfort (fort level 4, which requires Castle infrastructure 1) or a castle, so upgrading their hillforts should be the best way to get them to feudalise.

• What can i do to destabilize them from the outside? I have no idea.
• If i have to swear allegiance how can i avoid my titles being revoked or a forced conversion?
• What's the best way of getting allies? I'm not great at this aspect of the game.

I don't think there are many ways to destabilise the Abassids except for just murdering a bunch of good rulers (which would be difficult as good rulers are usually liked by their vassals) and maybe sowing discontent (or whatever the action is called).
The key to getting alliances are marriages , your current character has a few spare kids left, Marry them off to big realms (Byzantines or the big Georgia are good examples in your game) to get non-aggression pacts. After you get a non-aggression pact you can ask for an alliance, you might have to pay some money in a gift (which would be big in the case of the Byzantines, but they can bring 15-25k if they're not in another war, and even when they are they can be a distraction). With the help of these alliances and some mercs (which you should easily be able to afford) you should be able to win some holy wars against the Abassids when they are already in a war (which is almost always) as they will most likely not send their main stack after you before you win the war.

 

[Naughtius Maximus]

Just swear fealty and eat them from within. There are very limited things the AI does that is hostile to king tier vassals.

Be sure to take Taizz and socotra before swearing fealty. Taizz is the most lucrative duchy in the game, even after Socotra was removed.

Three Silk trade routes out of four counties, one of them being a trade node. No other duchy is that productive.

 

[Jaevelklein]

Your playstyle is different from mine and not what I'd suggest you. But considering your circumstances I'll try to help you with your current campaign.

Religion

• I'm running out of holy wars to wage and soon I will control all of Mali . How can i keep my religion strong? Build temples? i'm worried about the inevitable lock in behind a wall of Strong Muslim states.
• What strategies could i employ to become Orthodox or Catholic? i'd happily change religion for benefit. That being said i hate the gamey dynasty mechanics of playing as a Muslim. So i'd rather go down fighting than swear fealty to the Abbasid's. Plus my dynasty has been spread far and wide, so i don't think i'd last long as a Muslim at this point.

You won't be able to keep your religion strong. You will suffer at 20-30% until you manage to conquer your holy sites and restoring the High Priesthood. You also won't be able to send your Marshal out to arrest rebels in every counties. There's just too many. Your solution is to keep your Vassals strong so that they can bring down the rebels. If you are a King, create Grand Dukes. The other option is to get the Light Infantry retinue and send them across your Kingdoms. You are therefore spread out to shut down all peasant rebellions.

You don't really need to switch religion. But if that's what you want, you can secretly convert by right clicking provinces with such a religion. There should be plenty of miaphysite ones. Then you can inter-marry with Orthodox characters (and Catholics?) and convert to these religions from there. Or you can check if you have some Orthodox character in your court to raise your children for you.

Vassals

• Most of my vassals are tribal and correspondingly they are very weak. I've set up lots of Duchies to help a few consolidate wealth and power in the hope the will eventually go feudal, but how else can i boost them? Should i build holdings for them? Maybe temples to help with the religion issues? should i upgrade their main holdings for them?
• I've been lowering tax rates on tribal vassals for a while in the hopes this will also help them out.

Your Vassals will suck. You won't be able to build buildings for them for now, Just deal with it. Upgrade your own castles and save money to hire mercenaries. Create the Light Infantry retinue so that you will have a high military strength, making the Abbassids scared of declaring war.

Abbasid blob

• What can i do to destabilize them from the outside? I have no idea.
• If i have to swear allegiance how can i avoid my titles being revoked or a forced conversion?
• What's the best way of getting allies? I'm not great at this aspect of the game.

You will have low chances of destabilizing the realm. Whenever revolts happen, that's your chance to snatch land away. Another option is to spend 5,000 grace [Jade Dragon] and ask the Chinese for an invasion.

You shouldn't have to swear allegiance, but if you do, you can fake your religion and spread your true religion through secret societies.

As a Jewish character you won't have many allies. You could get the Nomadic Khazars on your team though, if they are still in the game that is.

 

[Blackwhitecavias]

As a Jewish character you won't have many allies. You could get the Nomadic Khazars on your team though, if they are still in the game that is.

He is not Jewish but Miaphysite, so he can already marry and ally all christians

 

[Polldark]

I would say these are the most important things.
You have a very strong income, which can and should be used to pay for mercenaries to assist in wars.
Your tech level is most likely the biggest thing holding you back, as your vassals need a certain level of castle infrastructure to feudalise (I checked the safe file and that level is only present in the area around your capital and the 1 county you hold in the west.




I wouldn't know why changing to Orthodox or Catholic would really help you before 900 (start of crusades as Saxony is still alive and norse and the Ummayads are pushing into France).
Catholic moral authority isn't much higher than your own, so that also wouldn't really help.



In order to feudalise a tribal leader needs a stone hillfort (fort level 4, which requires Castle infrastructure 1) or a castle, so upgrading their hillforts should be the best way to get them to feudalise.



I don't think there are many ways to destabilise the Abassids except for just murdering a bunch of good rulers (which would be difficult as good rulers are usually liked by their vassals) and maybe sowing discontent (or whatever the action is called).
The key to getting alliances are marriages , your current character has a few spare kids left, Marry them off to big realms (Byzantines or the big Georgia are good examples in your game) to get non-aggression pacts. After you get a non-aggression pact you can ask for an alliance, you might have to pay some money in a gift (which would be big in the case of the Byzantines, but they can bring 15-25k if they're not in another war, and even when they are they can be a distraction). With the help of these alliances and some mercs (which you should easily be able to afford) you should be able to win some holy wars against the Abassids when they are already in a war (which is almost always) as they will most likely not send their main stack after you before you win the war.

Thank you very much for this, very very helpful. As are the other posts, but this is one i'd seen before i started playing again.

I've managed to progress somewhat and have nearly wiped Mali of the map. The morale authority of Miaphysite is pushing 80 right now and though i know it will drop i'm going to start building a succession of temples across my tribal holdings. My income is above 50 now, which makes me feels that's doable without stopping me investing in my own demense. I'm hoping this will slow moral authority attrition whilst i plan my next move.

I've had a succession of short alliances with the Byzantine Empire and i can't quite believe how many play-time hours i have with this game without completely understanding these mechanics...something new for my next game. I'm feeling pretty strong and if i can maintain my Independence until Mali is all mine then i feel like i'm very much on the ascendancy.

One final question, is there a map view you used to look at tech levels? I'm sure there used to be a tech map, but for the life of me i can't find it...

 

[IanReSc]

I tried this a few weeks back and found it to be easier than in the past. Granted, I did convert o Judaism, but the Abassids didn't care about me. I think they're too busy fighting revolts these days. Besides, you shouldn't hold any of their de jure territory. Funny thing, I did hold such a piece of land and even then they never cared.

What you should be looking out for is the Shia Uprising. In my game they established their caliphate in Arabia und declared war on me all the time. So I would suggest keep doing what you're doing and as soon as the Shia form around you, swear fealty to the Abassids. I did not, because I was afraid of them revoking my titles, but think about it for a minute. You are a powerful kingdom and can surely fight them to a white peace, especially with other people joining you.

In terms of Africa, I have to admit that I struggled big time. I tried to expand, but attrition wrecks you. Since you already own that land, create a vassal and give all the tribal counties to him. Let him deal with it, while you appear to be even more powerful.

 

[Blackwhitecavias]

One final question, is there a map view you used to look at tech levels? I'm sure there used to be a tech map, but for the life of me i can't find it...

I don'think there is a map for general tech level, but there is a mapmode for individual techs which can be accessed by going to the tech menu and clicking the box under the tech bar

 

[Polldark]

Just swear fealty and eat them from within. There are very limited things the AI does that is hostile to king tier vassals.

Be sure to take Taizz and socotra before swearing fealty. Taizz is the most lucrative duchy in the game, even after Socotra was removed.

Three Silk trade routes out of four counties, one of them being a trade node. No other duchy is that productive.

I think I control this as part of my demesne already. Is it the Duchy the Yemeni coast with Aden and trade port in it? I only remember a single trade route, but maybe i'm misunderstanding the mechanics of trade. And Socotra is the little island right? If so they are both in my Demesne along with the Duchy of Aksum.

I didn't realize the AI was so muted towards king tier vassals as i rarely play as vassals. Is it possible/viable for Muslims to revoke titles or demand religion changes? I guess it depends on the laws, but i never play as them. I'm also curious as to whether i can holy war inside an empire? Would i be able to use holy wars to take Egypt of a fellow vassal? That would be appealing. If not what's the best way to grow as a vassal?

 

[Polldark]

I don'think there is a map for general tech level, but there is a mapmode for individual techs which can be accessed by going to the tech menu and clicking the box under the tech bar

Cheers, didn't know that.

 

[Polldark]

I tried this a few weeks back and found it to be easier than in the past. Granted, I did convert o Judaism, but the Abassids didn't care about me. I think they're too busy fighting revolts these days. Besides, you shouldn't hold any of their de jure territory. Funny thing, I did hold such a piece of land and even then they never cared.

What you should be looking out for is the Shia Uprising. In my game they established their caliphate in Arabia und declared war on me all the time. So I would suggest keep doing what you're doing and as soon as the Shia form around you, swear fealty to the Abassids. I did not, because I was afraid of them revoking my titles, but think about it for a minute. You are a powerful kingdom and can surely fight them to a white peace, especially with other people joining you.

In terms of Africa, I have to admit that I struggled big time. I tried to expand, but attrition wrecks you. Since you already own that land, create a vassal and give all the tribal counties to him. Let him deal with it, while you appear to be even more powerful.

It was an absolute cake walk taking all of that tribal land.

My strategy was to pretty much permanently have 1500-3500 mercenaries on my western border. I'd declare war on a single country tribal leader, pile in my mercenaries and build a fort whilst my army arrives from the east. 90% of the time they have single holdings so siege them out once and you win. As you get further west it gets harder because the opponent get bigger, your threat value has inevitably climbed and it takes an age for your troops to arrive. Same strategy works more or less though and trade posts make it possible to field large mercenary armies.

As far as i can tell tribal vassals don't count towards your limit, so I've been making a series of Grand Duchies, which as suggested above seem to be better for holding the land against revolts and raiders.

I don't think the Shia have appeared in my game yet, but it sound more like an opportunity than a threat at this stage.

 

[IanReSc]

My strategy was to pretty much permanently have 1500-3500 mercenaries on my western border. I'd declare war on a single country tribal leader, pile in my mercenaries and build a fort whilst my army arrives from the east. 90% of the time they have single holdings so siege them out once and you win. As you get further west it gets harder because the opponent get bigger, your threat value has inevitably climbed and it takes an age for your troops to arrive. Same strategy works more or less though and trade posts make it possible to field large mercenary armies.

In my game Central Africa united under one ruler before I had the chance to conquer it. That didn't help in my case. I also have to admit that I never use forts.

 

[Evangeline]

Since you have Jade Dragon, you could make use of the Chinese Emperor for shattering the Abbasids: if you please him enough with gifts, you can ask him to invade them. I've found that this seems to be the best way to break up and weaken a huge stable blob.

Also, don't forget to build and upgrade trade posts in your silk road provinces. Maybe also create a Merchant Republic vassal if you like. Trade will not just make you even wealthier, but will also increase the technology spread throughout your realm. When selecting vassal dukes, make sure they have high learning. In order to bring up your capital's tech level, make sure that your spymaster is stealing tech in or near Constantinople while at the same time, your other councillors are set to research their respective tech categories. Doing this will increase the technology spread rate you receive from Constantinople. Bring your spymaster back home occasionally to check for plots for a bit if you're worried, then send him or her back to the Byzantines. Check Constantinople's and Thrake's spy masters and send your own spy master to the county with the best tech and worst spy master (or one who's busy elsewhere). An alternative way to increase your tech level would be to conquer or inherit a high technology province and then make it your new capital. Always invite anyone with good genes to your court and make sure all children at your court get good educations (generally start with thrift except for geniuses), so that they'll become good councillors for yourself and your vassals later. All of this will help with your tech level over time.

You can also check out the prosperity wiki here https://ck2.paradoxwikis.com/Prosperity for good ideas on how to increase prosperity in your provinces which can also help with its tech level (and even increase the number of holdings in it). Try to always have councillors who are genius, quick, or shrewd because this will give you more "capital prospers" events.

Hope this helps a bit with the tech and crushing the blob!

 

[Polldark]

Since you have Jade Dragon, you could make use of the Chinese Emperor for shattering the Abbasids: if you please him enough with gifts, you can ask him to invade them. I've found that this seems to be the best way to break up and weaken a huge stable blob.

Also, don't forget to build and upgrade trade posts in your silk road provinces. Maybe also create a Merchant Republic vassal if you like. Trade will not just make you even wealthier, but will also increase the technology spread throughout your realm. When selecting vassal dukes, make sure they have high learning. In order to bring up your capital's tech level, make sure that your spymaster is stealing tech in or near Constantinople while at the same time, your other councillors are set to research their respective tech categories. Doing this will increase the technology spread rate you receive from Constantinople. Bring your spymaster back home occasionally to check for plots for a bit if you're worried, then send him or her back to the Byzantines. Check Constantinople's and Thrake's spy masters and send your own spy master to the county with the best tech and worst spy master (or one who's busy elsewhere). An alternative way to increase your tech level would be to conquer or inherit a high technology province and then make it your new capital. Always invite anyone with good genes to your court and make sure all children at your court get good educations (generally start with thrift except for geniuses), so that they'll become good councillors for yourself and your vassals later. All of this will help with your tech level over time.

You can also check out the prosperity wiki here https://ck2.paradoxwikis.com/Prosperity for good ideas on how to increase prosperity in your provinces which can also help with its tech level (and even increase the number of holdings in it). Try to always have councillors who are genius, quick, or shrewd because this will give you more "capital prospers" events.

Hope this helps a bit with the tech and crushing the blob!

I've not really engaged the Chinese Emperor yet, I've recently being playing Vikings or Catholics. I think i'll try this just for the novelty.

My trade posts are as upgraded as they can be given my tech level, but I've never created a Merchant Republic vassal. What are the advantages? And how do you do it effectively?

I'd be tempted to let Socotra go if it would allow me to rake in a massive profit. It's always a hassle to get my troops over to the mainland.

Thanks for the tips on technology, i'll definitely pursue these.

 

[IanReSc]

A MR will get you massive amounts of money, so turn Socotra, if you can.

 

[Naughtius Maximus]

I think I control this as part of my demesne already. Is it the Duchy the Yemeni coast with Aden and trade port in it? I only remember a single trade route, but maybe i'm misunderstanding the mechanics of trade. And Socotra is the little island right? If so they are both in my Demesne along with the Duchy of Aksum.

I didn't realize the AI was so muted towards king tier vassals as i rarely play as vassals. Is it possible/viable for Muslims to revoke titles or demand religion changes? I guess it depends on the laws, but i never play as them. I'm also curious as to whether i can holy war inside an empire? Would i be able to use holy wars to take Egypt of a fellow vassal? That would be appealing. If not what's the best way to grow as a vassal?

Great, you have the duchy. That's the one, with Aden.

They aren't completely muted but they can't freely revoke your kingdom, generally protecting you from massive realm disintegration. Try to keep above -30 and you should be fine for the most part.

AI never demands religion changes from you unless they arrest you (maybe, I don't get jailed by liege enough to know.) They'll never ask it out of the blue.

You cannot holy war at all if your liege is of a different religion. You can still do county conquests if pagan (Zunist or West African,) but only to external enemies that are not your religion or Sunni (liege's religion.)

As for expanding inside the realm, fabricating claims and farming favors is the answer. Fabricating claims is self explanatory.

For favors, get on the council. Should not be too difficult as a king. Faction for increased council power so council members can vote.

You'll soon have people like the Sultan of Egypt and other powerful dukes asking for favors to vote their way. Caliph might even do so himself. Anyways accept from any member whose top title you are interested in. Use the favor to force marry your sons to their daughters.

Your grandsons will have claims to those titles, and with a few plots you can either kill them until you force a child regency, make them go into hiding and force a regency, or wait till they go on pigrimage. Press for the title. Very important note. The only person you should let marry the Caliph or Sultan's daughter is your heir. That'll be the only way to incorporate their titles into your own.

 

[Polldark]

Thanks to everyone for all your help. I thought i'd report back on my progress and maybe ask for a few more suggestions. Save file attached for reference

Since creating the thread I've:

• Used holy wars to finish off Mali and keep my religions moral authority high.
• Built temples across my land to keep my religions moral authority from dipping back down.
• Formed a few alliances with strongish Byzantine Dukes. However, the emperors allegiance has always escaped me.
• Created a merchant republic in Socotra. Though I've just done this and i'm yet to see any benefits materialize.
• The year is around 900, maybe a bit before.

I've also managed to assassinate a child caliph ensuring that the Caliphate is inherited by another weak child. This seemed to be ruinous for decadence and i could see it was rising steeply. I started saving for a mercenary horde. However, whilst that was ticking up I got attacked in a holy war by the ruler of Egypt for the first time. I'm not totally sure why they did this as i had significantly more troops (+20%), but nonetheless i smashed him without mercenaries and took a nice 1000 payoff as a reward. This helped towards my mercenary budget.

Almost immediately after winning this war the Shia rose for the first time. Though I couldn't work out where and would be interested to know how you figure that out, as i still don't know where they are or how dangerous they are. The child Calip who had a measly 16,000 troops (it was normally around 35,000) seemed suitability weak. I chose to do a great invasion for Egypt. This went pretty well and i'd got a warscore of 65+ by the time an army came to challenge me. I consolidated my forces (circa 20,000 to his 15,000) and their army fled and he peaced out.

I've made myself emperor, I've destroyed the Abyssinia Kingdom title and i'll be handing out other Kingdom titles to my vassal to make everything a bit more manageable. I'm now revoking all of the Muslim titles, which has caused a rebellion. However i have around 16,000 troops already in Egypt, as i figured they might rebel, so i'm expecting this to be a straightforward and i great way to reclaim all these titles.

Once i put this rebellion down i'm not quite sure which direction to take things and i have some questions if anyone has the time.

1. I've read that giving your religion head a holy site will help boost moral authority. I'll now have two holy sites so this should be manageable, but it would be great to boost it further. Can i do this without making them independent? if so how? I was thinking of giving them Alexandria.
2. Also if my religion head is my vassal is it as lucrative as having the Pope as a vassal?
3. If i produce a second merchant republic in the Mediterranean will they run into any conflict with Socotra or are they isolated to their respective seas? If i do create one is it feasible for it to slowly take over the med or will i (eventually) need multiple MRs?
4. I'm not quite sure what my next objective challenge should be. The Calip is now weak enough that i think i can just about hold my own with them on any given day and i expect he'll loose his Shia war now and so he'll presumably be even weaker. There aren't really any other rivals near me that are major threats. Do people think i should go into the holy land and take all of my religious sites or spread west along the African coast and up into Iberia. I'd be interested to see what objectives people would suggest.

Once again thanks for all the help and guidance.

Africa is rising!

 

[Naughtius Maximus]

1. Honestly have never bothered to try that. Maybe. Try to just grant him the temple only, though by all means you can make him king tier if you want. I dislike doing so personally, but that's just my taste. Would prefer dynasty holds all the high prestige titles.

2. Usually no. Pope has many more mechanics to abuse when he's your vassal. Particularly the generate claims function. Typically a vassal religious head of any other religion will only allow you to divorce at will, and excommunicate anyone within his jurisdiction at will.

3. They are isolated. Personally I would have kept Socotra since it has a trade node. It would have been better to set your capital in Taizz or Aden, then make the MR in Bayda, the only county there with no Silk Road. Vassals in your capital duchy have no desires duchy modifier. This allows you to keeo a one county MR and not have it run over by de jure claims from the duke. Like Amalfi. Being destroyed by Salerno every game.

4. Usually at this point I get bored with the fame and the only thing that entertains me is how much land I can grab at once with claims. I'll make a ton of kids, marry as few as possible to vassals to prevent factions. The rest are getting claimants and princes I spend thousands of cash on to invite/marry via buying favors.

As I play with pacts on anyways, also keeps me occupied while I (occassionally) wait for threat to dip below 50. I will still go to war above 50 threat if the target is big enough (usually Umayyads.)

 

[IanReSc]

Actually I think you have done very well. You can certainly grant the head of religion a temple or even the county and the duchy. He will remain your underling unless you grant him a title equal to your own. I would advice against a second MR, though.