Erm.. read again. It's a typo, but it should be "or".
The Netherukraine doesnt seem to collapse very fast.
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The Netherukraine doesnt seem to collapse very fast.
:huh: So it should be. I'm obviously as illiterate as the guy who wrote the event. Or too hot - it's England and 28°C !!!!!!!!Erm.. read again. It's a typo, but it should be "or".
:laugh:
it cannot while being at war.
wow... I assume that's QUITE hot in England - still raining at least?Or too hot - it's England and 28°C !!!!!!!!
I have added some house rules, which so far I followed implicitly, as far as I can remember.
I have also thought of a victory condition
Venice must control all COTs, either directly or through vassalage
- Mission "Fund Patriot / Nationalist / Pretender" is not allowed. Mission "Support Revolt" is allowed , though. I think I never used the "Fund *" mission. I am pretty sure no province has defected to Venice after a revolt.
- If at the time of the conquest of a province a vassal has a core on it, and Venice doesn't, the province must be sold to the vassal at the first opportunity. Pretty sure I always followed this. Istria wasn't ceded to Croatia because Croatia became a vassal after we got Istria.
- No war without CB. Pretty sure I followed this too
- No war when troops are inside of the enemy's territory. I didn't even know that was possible.
I have also thought of a victory condition
Venice must control all COTs, either directly or through vassalage
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Nice possible material for the raaaage thread - last month of the game "Sire, a wild CoT appeared in the middle of a non controlled blob. You lose :trollface:" "fuuuuuuuu...!"
Your strategy is pretty cruel, sitting on all those nations while waiting for infamy room!
I like to think that the people in the occupied provinces enjoy the illuminated rule of Venice and will miss us when we are gone.
1605-1606 : War with Portugal and Persia. Unam Sanctam.
In December 1605, we declare war on Portugal to try and get the colonies in Madagascar, before they become cities.
Portugal is allied to Switzerland who joins the war as well.
Meanwhile, in North America the Portuguese colonies have become visible.
Two other provinces defect in the East. Astrakhan declares independence from the Netherlands.
... as can better be seen in this map.
The Swiss entered into Würrtemberg and we defeat them there.
We rout them in Breisgau.
The Portuguese had colonized the Andamans as well. We didn't notice it, but Ryuku does. They seize the colony.
Scotland is at war with Great Britain and is losing. We give them war subsidies, but that might not be enough.
Portugal has around 50k soldiers in the Iberian peninsula. Even with our support, we are outnumbered there.
We should have kept Aragon and Navarra out of this war.
As nothing is to be gained from a war with Switzerland, we peace them. We make them release Baden.
In July 1606, we have seized Portugal's colonies in Madagascar.
We peace Portugal. We give them 25 ducats, so the war is technically lost. We had a positive war score, thanks to the blockade, but in the Iberian Peninsula we were outnumbered.
As a consequence, we lose the title of the DoTF. It is not a problem, since we have a border with Ming, Persia and Bihar. And we will soon have the NI "Unam Sanctam".
As Persia is also active against the Timurids, we declare war on them.
So this is a diplomatic map of Asia in August 1606. We have now a lot of uncored provinces connected to the capital, which might lead to overextension if I elect a leader with low administration skills.
Our current doge has 9 administration skill. I will need to count the provinces.
It is pretty obvious, though, that a land connection to India would lead to overextension even with our current doge and will have to wait till most of the provinces are cored there.
The main Persian stack is beaten in Kerman.
In November 1606, Gov Tech 25 is researched. It is God's will that we choose Unam Sanctam as a national idea.
Shortly after that, we get notified that now we have a casus belli against all heretics and infidels.
We will now be sending colonists only to our current colonies in the Horde territories. To fulfill our mission, we will have to cancel the vassalage of Ragusa, and that will stop our wars with the Hordes.
War may be declared soon on Novgorod and Polotsk using the new Casus Belli, to slow down their colonization of the Hordes.
But it is the situation in Great Britain who needs to be taken care of. Scotland needs our help.
In December 1605, we declare war on Portugal to try and get the colonies in Madagascar, before they become cities.
Portugal is allied to Switzerland who joins the war as well.
Meanwhile, in North America the Portuguese colonies have become visible.
Two other provinces defect in the East. Astrakhan declares independence from the Netherlands.
... as can better be seen in this map.
The Swiss entered into Würrtemberg and we defeat them there.
We rout them in Breisgau.
The Portuguese had colonized the Andamans as well. We didn't notice it, but Ryuku does. They seize the colony.
Scotland is at war with Great Britain and is losing. We give them war subsidies, but that might not be enough.
Portugal has around 50k soldiers in the Iberian peninsula. Even with our support, we are outnumbered there.
We should have kept Aragon and Navarra out of this war.
As nothing is to be gained from a war with Switzerland, we peace them. We make them release Baden.
In July 1606, we have seized Portugal's colonies in Madagascar.
We peace Portugal. We give them 25 ducats, so the war is technically lost. We had a positive war score, thanks to the blockade, but in the Iberian Peninsula we were outnumbered.
As a consequence, we lose the title of the DoTF. It is not a problem, since we have a border with Ming, Persia and Bihar. And we will soon have the NI "Unam Sanctam".
As Persia is also active against the Timurids, we declare war on them.
So this is a diplomatic map of Asia in August 1606. We have now a lot of uncored provinces connected to the capital, which might lead to overextension if I elect a leader with low administration skills.
Our current doge has 9 administration skill. I will need to count the provinces.
It is pretty obvious, though, that a land connection to India would lead to overextension even with our current doge and will have to wait till most of the provinces are cored there.
The main Persian stack is beaten in Kerman.
In November 1606, Gov Tech 25 is researched. It is God's will that we choose Unam Sanctam as a national idea.
Shortly after that, we get notified that now we have a casus belli against all heretics and infidels.
We will now be sending colonists only to our current colonies in the Horde territories. To fulfill our mission, we will have to cancel the vassalage of Ragusa, and that will stop our wars with the Hordes.
War may be declared soon on Novgorod and Polotsk using the new Casus Belli, to slow down their colonization of the Hordes.
But it is the situation in Great Britain who needs to be taken care of. Scotland needs our help.
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1606-1607 : Third war with Great Britain(1)
We then declare war on Great Britain, using the colonialism casus belli.
We count the provinces. Connected to Venice there are 38 cored provinces and 35 uncored provinces, as far as I can tell. We are at great risk of overextension.
We attack the British colony in North America.
On the 5th of January, Scotland makes peace with GB. Is it because of us ?
We lose both of our colonies in Madagascar that we stole from the Portuguese - to natives. Our war with Portugal was useless.
In April, our troops begin gathering in Scotland.
Soon the British troops meet us. Reinforcements are under way.
It looks like we are going to be outnumbered...
But more and more of our troops come. In the end, we win the day, also thanks to our god-like general.
Situation in Persia in May 1607.
The retreating British troop split. One stack is routed in Lancashire.
I am not sure why, but we get overextension. Do occupied provinces count ?
We therefore peace Persia, taking care not to connect our Persian provinces to our bulk.
By now, it would actually be pretty easy to connect India to Venice, but we won't do that.
Overextension goes away in July. So occupied provinces do somehow count. Meanwhile we lay siege to the German OPMs who are at war with us. Maybe we can get some cash out of them.
The last surviving British stack is wiped out in Kent. Carpet sieging time.
In August 1607, most of Britain is under siege.
And again, we get overextension. I am not sure why it happens.
Regrettably, our doge dies. We choose an administrative one - to have a chance against overextension. He turns out to be a great diplomat as well.
By December 1607, Moose Cree, in America, falls.
The towns in Britain also fall pretty quickly.
In Asia, the province of Ferghana defects to us.
We then declare war on Great Britain, using the colonialism casus belli.
We count the provinces. Connected to Venice there are 38 cored provinces and 35 uncored provinces, as far as I can tell. We are at great risk of overextension.
We attack the British colony in North America.
On the 5th of January, Scotland makes peace with GB. Is it because of us ?
We lose both of our colonies in Madagascar that we stole from the Portuguese - to natives. Our war with Portugal was useless.
In April, our troops begin gathering in Scotland.
Soon the British troops meet us. Reinforcements are under way.
It looks like we are going to be outnumbered...
But more and more of our troops come. In the end, we win the day, also thanks to our god-like general.
Situation in Persia in May 1607.
The retreating British troop split. One stack is routed in Lancashire.
I am not sure why, but we get overextension. Do occupied provinces count ?
We therefore peace Persia, taking care not to connect our Persian provinces to our bulk.
By now, it would actually be pretty easy to connect India to Venice, but we won't do that.
Overextension goes away in July. So occupied provinces do somehow count. Meanwhile we lay siege to the German OPMs who are at war with us. Maybe we can get some cash out of them.
The last surviving British stack is wiped out in Kent. Carpet sieging time.
In August 1607, most of Britain is under siege.
And again, we get overextension. I am not sure why it happens.
Regrettably, our doge dies. We choose an administrative one - to have a chance against overextension. He turns out to be a great diplomat as well.
By December 1607, Moose Cree, in America, falls.
The towns in Britain also fall pretty quickly.
In Asia, the province of Ferghana defects to us.
1608-1609 : Third war with Great Britain(2)
The spare colonists now are used to colonize South America...
Meissen is peaced for 25 ducats after the town falls. Anothar Asian province, Kashmir, defects to us.
Situation in Asia in April 1608
and in Europe.
and in the world. It is never too late to learn how to take these screenshots.
Venice-only.
We engage the British troops in Sweden
In May, overextension goes away. No idea.
In July, Samarkand defects to us.
In September 1608, overextension comes back. We peace Great Britain. We get a colony out of them, Moose Cree.
So this is how Britain looks in September 1608
Qazbah defects to us. Meanwhile, Denmark, Algiers and some other little countries have declared war on Britain.
I think I found the reason why I get in and out of overextension. When rebels pop up in Imereti, Erserum, Mus or Adana, they block the only path to the provinces in the Caucasus who become overseas provinces for a short while.
In fact, in December 1608, after getting rid of the rebels in Erserum, overextension comes back. The Netherlands go bankrupt again, but this is hardly news.
In January 1609 Mugan defects to us - and we lose overextension. But where are the rebels ?
We therefore cancel the vassalization of Ragusa and immediately all wars with the Hordes finish. We make Alsace pay 275 ducats for being so cocky.
I want to find out if peacing Bavaria will help us with overextension - even if I will have a bad reputation for a short while. We get Konstanz, Schwaben and 1275 ducats. The provinces will be ceded to Württemberg, since they have a core on both provinces (House Rule).
We get a core on Sierra Leone. Ragusa breaks the alliance with us. Good, so we can immediately declare war on them.
In March 1609, we force-convert them to Catholic.
Mission accomplished. We were supposed to lose 2 infamy, but it doesn't happen! This really sucks. Next mission is convert the province Sarai, a missionary is already active there.
Anyway, we sell the provinces Konstanz and Schwaben to Württemberg.
In April 1609, Great Britain loses the provinces in Scandinavia - to Denmark.
Maybe we will see Britain collapse this time. We supported some revolts.
The spare colonists now are used to colonize South America...
Meissen is peaced for 25 ducats after the town falls. Anothar Asian province, Kashmir, defects to us.
Situation in Asia in April 1608
and in Europe.
and in the world. It is never too late to learn how to take these screenshots.
Venice-only.
We engage the British troops in Sweden
In May, overextension goes away. No idea.
In July, Samarkand defects to us.
In September 1608, overextension comes back. We peace Great Britain. We get a colony out of them, Moose Cree.
So this is how Britain looks in September 1608
Qazbah defects to us. Meanwhile, Denmark, Algiers and some other little countries have declared war on Britain.
I think I found the reason why I get in and out of overextension. When rebels pop up in Imereti, Erserum, Mus or Adana, they block the only path to the provinces in the Caucasus who become overseas provinces for a short while.
In fact, in December 1608, after getting rid of the rebels in Erserum, overextension comes back. The Netherlands go bankrupt again, but this is hardly news.
In January 1609 Mugan defects to us - and we lose overextension. But where are the rebels ?
We therefore cancel the vassalization of Ragusa and immediately all wars with the Hordes finish. We make Alsace pay 275 ducats for being so cocky.
I want to find out if peacing Bavaria will help us with overextension - even if I will have a bad reputation for a short while. We get Konstanz, Schwaben and 1275 ducats. The provinces will be ceded to Württemberg, since they have a core on both provinces (House Rule).
We get a core on Sierra Leone. Ragusa breaks the alliance with us. Good, so we can immediately declare war on them.
In March 1609, we force-convert them to Catholic.
Mission accomplished. We were supposed to lose 2 infamy, but it doesn't happen! This really sucks. Next mission is convert the province Sarai, a missionary is already active there.
Anyway, we sell the provinces Konstanz and Schwaben to Württemberg.
In April 1609, Great Britain loses the provinces in Scandinavia - to Denmark.
Maybe we will see Britain collapse this time. We supported some revolts.
Oh the indignity - the Great British and Netherlands empires reduced to shadows of their former selves. All to Venetian glory, of course.
What do you plan to do about the non-reduction of infamy from successfully completing the mission? Go back to a previous save? Manually reduce the infmay by 2 in the save file or just carry on? If you keep your Def of the Faith, you'll get a mission to convert Styria by the sword, sooner or later. I hope you'll diploannex - soonest. Shame about Madagascar. Those pesky natives will require the sword before fresh colonists are sent. I'd like to see the European, Africa and Asian parts of the Venetian empire united. Then retrace the steps of Marco Polo all the way to China.
What do you plan to do about the non-reduction of infamy from successfully completing the mission? Go back to a previous save? Manually reduce the infmay by 2 in the save file or just carry on? If you keep your Def of the Faith, you'll get a mission to convert Styria by the sword, sooner or later. I hope you'll diploannex - soonest. Shame about Madagascar. Those pesky natives will require the sword before fresh colonists are sent. I'd like to see the European, Africa and Asian parts of the Venetian empire united. Then retrace the steps of Marco Polo all the way to China.
Finally GB is burning down again
What are you going to down? Are you going to refrain your expansion to avoid overextension or you have some cores coming out soon? India still needs some more cleaning, you still need to put the Russians in order and China escaped somewhat unharmed from your clutches ...
What are you going to down? Are you going to refrain your expansion to avoid overextension or you have some cores coming out soon? India still needs some more cleaning, you still need to put the Russians in order and China escaped somewhat unharmed from your clutches ...
Well, I'll just keep on playing. Better not to play with save games... . But from now on, I'll feel entitled to cancel (or fail) this kind of mission.
Regrettably, the provinces will take a while to core - expansion has to stall. Ming and Novgorod are definitely on my todo list...Finally GB is burning down again
What are you going to down? Are you going to refrain your expansion to avoid overextension or you have some cores coming out soon? India still needs some more cleaning, you still need to put the Russians in order and China escaped somewhat unharmed from your clutches ...
Thank youOverextension sometimes seems to be a bit unpredictable - you can get it and lose it at the most surprising times. I just ignore it when it becomes difficult to keep under control.
I like how that world map shows your naval focus.
I would like if there was a way to see when I am about to overextend though, a cored / uncored rate for provinces who are not overseas.
It is more meant to be this way : When Venice owns all COTs, the game is over. Or in 1821
1609-1610 : War with Novgorod and Ming (1)
A map of Europe in April 1609
In July 1609, Portugal peaces Great Britain. Great Britain has to cede the Orkneys and the province in Norway.
In August 1609, we declare war on Novgorod. They were allied with Muscowy and Finland, but they don't answer the call.
We declare war on the Ming as well.
We destroy their fleet, first things first.
And defeat their first army.
Soon, the crusade effect kicks in. Regrettably, our doge dies and we have to elect a new one. We choose the bureaucrat candidat....
But he turns out to be a 5 Adm doge !
And as expected, we get overextension again. Luckily we are a republic, so we will get a chance to elect a new doge in 4 years. But he becomes a general anyway, a decent one. Maybe he will die....
We have no direct border with Novgorod, but get military access from Muscowy and Polotsk, which will give us some strategic possibilities.
We blockade Novgorod's ports, while our allies Leinster and Cornwall make a landfall.
By January 1610, several small stacks have landed in the Ming territory.
We move our national focus to Edirne and we build a COT in Thrace. Athens was our biggest COT and it needed a split.
In March 1610, we defeat another major Chinese stack.
Juggling with attrition is the major challenge in the Hostile chinese territory.
It is also a challenge in Russia. We are now siegeing three provinces in Novgorod. Reinforcements have come also by ship, through Sweden and Lithuania.
In April, we lose the effect of trading in Grain. Not sure why...
Meanwhile France is blobbing - she is now the second biggest economy in the game. Hmrr....
Novgorod peaces the Golden Horde - this is great news. But they are still occupying a province in the Kazakh.
By May 1610, Rzhev, Smolensk, Vologda and Vetluga are under siege.
While the Chinese provinces keep falling. The last surviving Ming stacks have been wiped out.
By July 1610, several Novgorod provinces have fallen as well.
A map of Europe in April 1609
In July 1609, Portugal peaces Great Britain. Great Britain has to cede the Orkneys and the province in Norway.
In August 1609, we declare war on Novgorod. They were allied with Muscowy and Finland, but they don't answer the call.
We declare war on the Ming as well.
We destroy their fleet, first things first.
And defeat their first army.
Soon, the crusade effect kicks in. Regrettably, our doge dies and we have to elect a new one. We choose the bureaucrat candidat....
But he turns out to be a 5 Adm doge !
And as expected, we get overextension again. Luckily we are a republic, so we will get a chance to elect a new doge in 4 years. But he becomes a general anyway, a decent one. Maybe he will die....
We have no direct border with Novgorod, but get military access from Muscowy and Polotsk, which will give us some strategic possibilities.
We blockade Novgorod's ports, while our allies Leinster and Cornwall make a landfall.
By January 1610, several small stacks have landed in the Ming territory.
We move our national focus to Edirne and we build a COT in Thrace. Athens was our biggest COT and it needed a split.
In March 1610, we defeat another major Chinese stack.
Juggling with attrition is the major challenge in the Hostile chinese territory.
It is also a challenge in Russia. We are now siegeing three provinces in Novgorod. Reinforcements have come also by ship, through Sweden and Lithuania.
In April, we lose the effect of trading in Grain. Not sure why...
Meanwhile France is blobbing - she is now the second biggest economy in the game. Hmrr....
Novgorod peaces the Golden Horde - this is great news. But they are still occupying a province in the Kazakh.
By May 1610, Rzhev, Smolensk, Vologda and Vetluga are under siege.
While the Chinese provinces keep falling. The last surviving Ming stacks have been wiped out.
By July 1610, several Novgorod provinces have fallen as well.
1610-1611 : War with Novgorod and Ming (2)
November 1610 in Russia....
and in China.
In January 1611, we get another border with Spain - thanks to their peace with Adal.
In February 1611, we have made further progress in China.
In this month, though, Spain declares war on Grenada. We therefore immediately declare war on Spain.
Meanwhile, the Novgorod capital falls.
We discover Naval Tech 23.
Portugal is at war with lot of countries : France, Spain, Bohemia.
Meanwhile, Protestant zealots seize a province in the new world. Hadn't happened for a while.
Our god-like general Dolfin wins the day for us in Vetluga before reinforcements come.
Situation in Russia in April 1611.
... and in China.
By May 1611, Novgorod loses other provinces.
We are also fighting Spain, but this is hardly a problem, since Spain is at war with Portugal, Granada, Aragon and Navarra and is hopelessly outnumbered in Iberia !
In June 1611, the Novgorodian stack is wiped out in Viatka,.
We have landed a couple of stacks in Iberia to finish the war.
In July 1611, something unpleasant happens. A new COT pops up in Cyprus, who even dares trading in our provinces. Not now, though...
In August 1611, we peace the Ming. 2000 ducats and three provinces. It is hard to resist the tentations of some ducats....
We peace the Novgorod as well we get spammed by declarations of independence. No provinces, our goal is just making Novgorod weaker.
So this is, in fact, the situation after the war.
It turns out that Cyprus is not the only foreign COT who is trading in Venice's provinces. Andalusia is, too. Maybe it is time to change that...
November 1610 in Russia....
and in China.
In January 1611, we get another border with Spain - thanks to their peace with Adal.
In February 1611, we have made further progress in China.
In this month, though, Spain declares war on Grenada. We therefore immediately declare war on Spain.
Meanwhile, the Novgorod capital falls.
We discover Naval Tech 23.
Portugal is at war with lot of countries : France, Spain, Bohemia.
Meanwhile, Protestant zealots seize a province in the new world. Hadn't happened for a while.
Our god-like general Dolfin wins the day for us in Vetluga before reinforcements come.
Situation in Russia in April 1611.
... and in China.
By May 1611, Novgorod loses other provinces.
We are also fighting Spain, but this is hardly a problem, since Spain is at war with Portugal, Granada, Aragon and Navarra and is hopelessly outnumbered in Iberia !
In June 1611, the Novgorodian stack is wiped out in Viatka,.
We have landed a couple of stacks in Iberia to finish the war.
In July 1611, something unpleasant happens. A new COT pops up in Cyprus, who even dares trading in our provinces. Not now, though...
In August 1611, we peace the Ming. 2000 ducats and three provinces. It is hard to resist the tentations of some ducats....
We peace the Novgorod as well we get spammed by declarations of independence. No provinces, our goal is just making Novgorod weaker.
So this is, in fact, the situation after the war.
It turns out that Cyprus is not the only foreign COT who is trading in Venice's provinces. Andalusia is, too. Maybe it is time to change that...
STOP! COOKIE TIME