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unmerged(163187)

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Keep going, this is good info and I like the running commentary in the Kremlin! This will be very interesting to see the developments. :D


im kinda dissapointed...

i wanted to see a true blitzkrieg by germany, and instead i see a shitty rattenkrieg.

goddamn it... im SO FKN GLAD i didnt buy this game! i regreted it until a few days ago but now that i see germany´s lame ass tactics, russia blitzing germ at warstart and japan pushed off the mainland (soon anyway), i feel zero regret whatsoever!

thank you for making an AAR that makes me want to kick the game in the balls!

Eugenioso, you are missing the point, if you wanted a History Game go to HOI2 or read a book! The potential here is great and I am enjoying playing. They will keep tweaking the AI at Paradox and make it even better.
 

MastahCheef117

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looking forward to the push to Berlin!! (even if it a few years to early....)

The rape of Berlin is never too early; I did it as Russia in HOI2 by June 1940 with France and Britain assisting me! Plus I litterally destroyed the German navy by myself ;)
 

loki100

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Keep going, this is good info and I like the running commentary in the Kremlin! This will be very interesting to see the developments. :D

Hopefully there will be an update soon, I miss Stalin already. :rolleyes:

looking forward to the push to Berlin!! (even if it a few years to early....)

The rape of Berlin is never too early; I did it as Russia in HOI2 by June 1940 with France and Britain assisting me! Plus I litterally destroyed the German navy by myself ;)

Me three! :rolleyes:

many thanks for the comments - whilst away I did a bit of thinking as I'd started melding a save game to the Barbarossa scenario - I may return to that project later as it could be interesting. However, have also decided to run with this as it stands. I think, with some care, if I can keep the US neutral till it suits me, there is real scope for a variant on the usual USSR-USA conflict, especially if I can get Mexico on my side. My guess is the additional leadership I can extract from Germany and France with benign occupation policies will give me the research clout to at least have a navy that can escort convoys etc by 1943-4.
 

loki100

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STAVKA Military Review 2 Dec 1941

Despite the stunning successes of the opening week of Zapad, Soviet forces are now becoming slowly bogged down along the pre-war German-Polish border. The relative speeds of Kirponos' and Zhukov's sectors has led to three problems:

a) Kirponos is now trying to hold too much of the front, the result is that his Shock Armies are only just catching up with the armour and the tanks are now too spread out to manage quick breakthroughs;
b) The pockets, esp in Zhukov's sector, have netted a lot of German POWs, but took time to reduce, this, combined with the original mis-placement of 3 Tank Army means his formations are only now reaching the front and are too bunched together;
c) Supply!

Accordingly both sectors are ordered over to the defensive for now, with only limited attacks to improve the Soviet position at Danzig. A fresh offensive is now in planning for 20 December.

In Zhukov's sector, the main issue is the intermingling of formations, the need to bring 3 Tank Army into action and that 1 Tank Army is too spread out:



Kirponos, in a way has the opposite problem, he has had almost no problems clearing out the pockets (I now think that JS may have been right a few posts back - relatively there was too much power in this part of the offensive), but his Southern Flank is becoming snagged up on the ongoing battles in Slovakia and N Hungary.



Meanwhile in the Arctic, the main problems are supplies and the length of time it is taking to reduce the German positions on the Swedish-Finnish border. Accordingly, any further breakout will have to wait till 34A clears the border, 33A can take its time in reducing the German armour in the far north as they are no threat. Sweden has been liberated as a Soviet puppet regime and 28 A at Stockholm is slowly expanding its position. The Germans have launched a naval counterattack at Lulea which is not helping!



The Balkan sector is developing slowly, but the main forces in Hungary have stopped the German offensive and are now pushing north - this now has some urgency as the German formations in E Slovakia are causing Kirponos difficulties. Offensive operations into Croatia and Greece as well as in Hungary will continue and Yugoslavia will be liberated once Croatia has surrendered.



At the end of the meeting, Stalin turns on Zhukov and tells him first to sort out how to properly use the heavy armour of 3 Tank Army and second, 'to get there' soon.

In a wider sense, despite the lack of major counterattacks, Soviet casualties have been horrendous. I'm currently allocating around 60 IC just to reinforcements and a number of Infantry divisions are at 20% organisation. At least German strategic bombing has slowed down, but again a number of PVO squadrons are shredded and will take an age to rebuild.

The 'problem' with the 3rd Tank Army seems to be twofold. One is that right at the start all the other tank armies went in on the tips of the border salients, 3 TA was launched into the base of a salient - with hindsight it would have been better to have use rifle armies there to hold the Germans and then envelop them. The second is the lack of speed of the early KV1/2s. They are like lumbering beasts, in combat those units take almost no losses (org or manpower), but they take an age to get to where they are needed.

One solution is that I'm picking up a lot more leadership so am trying to improve their stats overall.
 

PrawnStar

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This is what I was curious about a few posts back; how long does a given offensive last before running out of steam and needing to regroup.

Very interesting, very informative and very enjoyable AAR!
 

loki100

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Looks like there are great opportunities in the south to consolidate and drive North into a weaker underbelly? :rolleyes:

This is what I was curious about a few posts back; how long does a given offensive last before running out of steam and needing to regroup.

Very interesting, very informative and very enjoyable AAR!

It was interesting running that offensive, time, distance and supply were bigger problems than the German resistance - you have a real feeling of being at the end of an elastic band. Even against quite weak resistance, I gave up a couple of advanced provinces so as to pull the armour from the line, and consolidate and reorganise. If the Germans had had a reserve on hand, I could have lost most of my gains in the final week, so a given offensive I think has a 3-4 week life span, and I'm up to date with my supply techs and did a fair bit of infrastructure upgrading in the Soviet Union. Also as my armour outran the infantry, I couldn't keep them as concentrated as I wanted so ended up in all sorts of small skirmishes with retreating German units.

It looks like all my supplies are coming down a single route to Minsk and then fanning out.

If I'd kept it going, I was going to end up with substantial attritional losses in my best units - I don't mind leaving rifle divisions in combat just to pin the Germans but not the tanks.

Problem in the South is two fold. One I don't have that much more strength than the Germans do, esp as Italy has got feisty over its Balkan holdings. So I can't create the force for a real knock out blow, although I've kept on the strategic offensive - also, again, supplies are a nightmare. I've got an open road to the Adriatic and I can't move.

I've more or less collapsed the German front in the Arctic, so that should soon just be a case of occupying Narvik and pushing steadily south.

Still just putting the finishing touches to the next offensive - and also, don't know where from, a mass of German formations have turned up ...
 

loki100

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Politburo 17 December 1941

The Soviet leadership, with the exception of Stalin, were both heartened and sobered by the outcomes of the Zapad offensives. Even after a 2 week delay and pulling some formations out of the line, something like 10 Rifle Divisions were only fit for reserve duty (organisation still under 20%), and reinforcing formations was consuming something like 50-55 IC, in part due to heavy losses in the PVO formations.

With this in mind, a 2 stage offensive was planned as the next stage of knocking Germany out of the war.

Essentially the formations in Scandinavia were to push south into Denmark now the border battles were mostly resolved in our favour and most remaining German units were retreating south. The Balkan fronts were split into a holding group facing the Italians around Tirana, where neither side could really muster the strength for a proper offensive, but in the north, Bratislava and Zagreb were in the grasp of the Soviet armies and their capture would remove even more formations from the German OOB.

In the centre, the plan again was conceptually fairly simple. Zhukov's Minsk district would commence offensive operations on 20 December and Kirponos would follow several days later. Much against Stalin's will both commanders were given 'desirable' (the thick black lines) and 'acceptable' (dotted lines) as their objectives.

Soviet intelligence was now quite good even deep into Germany and a sizeable force was detected in Berlin. The hope was this would be deployed against Zhukov, who in addition to the Shock and Tank Armies, was able to allocate one Infantry army to each province, plus keeping two back as immediate reserves - this time the front line units would not deal with the pockets.

This might either draw the remaining(?) German strength into a battle near our current front line or open the way for Kirponos to make deep gains, especially now his Southern flank was secure.



Although the war in Europe was nowhere near over, Soviet thinking had shifted beyond the immediate matter of Germany and its allies.

Production and research needs were undergoing some subtle shifts. For the first time, a modest degree of attention was being given to the VNF and the interest in strategic rocketry was gathering pace. The feeling was the British empire was extremely weak, and in the vacuum of a German collapse, the scope for major Soviet gains existed.

Equally a new naval base was in preparation in the extreme east of the Soviet Union, the scope to use this for an invasion of North America (either Canada or the USA) was under serious, if secondary, consideration.
 

loki100

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Operation Thalmann

Following the lessons of Zapad, Soviet operational planning underwent some changes and Zhukov's Thalmann offensive was to be the first test. The tank and shock armies were deployed much closer together and large parts of the front were being left to the Infantry armies to handle.

Critically, 2 Infantry armies (30A in the Danzig Front and 21A in the Torum Front) were held back, specifically to deal with pockets or to follow the main assault formations, this time the intention was not to allow the tanks to become so spread out.

The Danzig front deployed some 18 rifle divisions and it was planned this would overwhelm the German front, before the shock and tank armies went in. 1 TA and 3 TA would operate close together until they were clear of the German defense line - at that stage 1 TA would cut towards the Baltic to pocket any German forces in that area and 3 TA would push onto the Oder.

2 & 4 SA would then aim to pocket German troops in the South of Zhukov's sector and again the German front line would be held (or hopefully overwhelmed) by the 22 rifle divisions spread amongst the Torum and Warsaw Fronts.



Kirponos and the formations in Hungary would then attack on 22 December, hopefully with the German front badly shattered by Zhukov's opening offensive.

{Historians with access to the Soviet archives, noted that the planning map were overlain with a comment from Stalin - 'get to Berlin, or else you go to Kamchatka'}.
 

loki100

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TASS, 11am 10 January 1942

At 10am this morning Soviet troops of Chuikov's 4th Shock Army occupied Berlin. The German authorities had declared it an open city to avoid needless damage and casualties.



This, adds to the surrenders of Greece, Slovakia and Croatia in further bringing to an end German domination of Europe.

Soviet formations across Germany are continuing their offensives and press on to Hamburg, the Rhine, Wien and Munchen.
 

Eugenioso

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Keep going, this is good info and I like the running commentary in the Kremlin! This will be very interesting to see the developments. :D




Eugenioso, you are missing the point, if you wanted a History Game go to HOI2 or read a book! The potential here is great and I am enjoying playing. They will keep tweaking the AI at Paradox and make it even better.


fail comment i must say. you are saying that HOI2 is better than HOI3.

...

well, you are right
 

Eugenioso

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i have three words for that post with the pic:

Truly



Epic





FAIL
 

loki100

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Eugenioso

Actually that sort of thing happened a lot with HOI2 - it was v common once you pushed Soviet troops into the Balkans to see the German AI strip its Berlin defence and send troops off down south - it was rare to end up having to fight for Berlin.

Even with its flaws, I couldn't go back to HOI2 now - this, even in its current form, is just so much more fun and involving.

Without doing too much obvious - the game forces a real feel for how Soviet late war offensives developed - you just have to stop and re-organise and resupply, whether or not there is still any effective opposition in front of you, and this seems to take 2-3 weeks, during which time the AI can get up to some interesting mischief ... and you are well advised to be prepared to retreat from some of your more opportunistic final gains etc.

The pity is that Germany didn't prepare for war with the USSR - then this would be truely brilliant at a strategic as well as operational level.
 

loki100

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Disaster in Sweden

Stavka, 15 Feb 1942

Stalin is on the phone to Uborevich, after seeing this:



JS: Not only are you no longer on the offensive, you seem to have lost all that area in N Sweden it took you so long to conquer ..

and now you are going to lose Stockholm too?

U - does try to point out that Norway has almost been knocked out the war, and that the German breakout towards Finland has already been stopped

JS - is it too cold up there? ... first you don't understand what it means to be on the offensive, then you take 8 weeks over the border battles, and now you lose it all, I've just wound down 4 army and front commands so I have generals sitting around doing nothing - especially as I'm off purges for the moment. At least the Hungarians are on their way to rescue you.

Use 'local reserves' and get that breakout pinned down, and don't lose Stockholm.
 

loki100

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Earlier that evening

Before Stalin's hissy fit with Uborevich, the main session was involved with planning for the next stage of the Soviet offensive into Western Europe. Zhukov was left with control of Germany and ordered to occupy France and the Low Countries. After experience at the end of 'Thalmann' it was envisaged that there would be little sustained combat, more a struggle with the Soviet supply lines.

Kirponos was ordered to clear out S Germany and Austria, at which stage some of the formations of the Nurnberg Front would be reallocated to Zhukov. The Wien Front was ordered to attack into Northern Italy but to ensure some armour was deployed on the Vichy border. The Trieste Front would deal with the substantial Italian formations in the NE, and then form an occupation force for S Germany and N Italy.



Even before Germany was actually knocked out the war, Soviet strategic planning had moved on to consideration of 3 new targets. An attack into Persia would enable subsequent attacks on Iraq and into India (additional formations have been created in the Caucasus and Central Asia in preparation), equally, once Northern France was occupied, first Vichy and then Spain would be attacked. The occupation load would be eased by releasing Poland and Finland as soon as possible.

Stalin was indeed going to ride into Paris in a (not so shiny -given the amount of combat, but still curvy) T34, and Franco would be called to account for winning the Spanish Civil War.
 

loki100

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On research and spying

A short interlude while Stalin gets all dressed up for spring time in Paris ...

In the main I don't want large numbers of troops pinned down on garrison duty, so am trying to release countries once I've cleared them of German forces (the exception is Poland as I want to keep my supply lines as clear as possible), and, for two reasons am using 'Collaboration Govt' for occupied provinces - its keeping my revolt risk down quite nicely and, more importantly, I want the leadership more than the IC.

I'm now up to 41.45 leadership and this should increase even more once I occupy France. This means I'm finally able to balance research, diplomacy, officers and spies:



I've got two spy missions on the go - Venezuela (recently added) and my old project in Mexico. Both have the same goal, a strong pro-Soviet CP and then trash their national unity, and then see what happens. In Mexico the CP is up at 30% and should soon take over.

I've also got 2 diplomatic influencing activities. One is to bring Mao to the Comintern (extra VPs rather than any desire to end up in a war in China) and the other is my insurance policy with Mexico, where at the least I want to stop any drift to another faction.

I'm generating over 80 officers a day and that is just about compensating for my casualty rates - also helped a bit by clearing out a few redundant HQs.

As to research, I've now got teams working on all sorts of jet and rocket technologies and have started a nuclear project - at the moment just the theory tech. Otherwise, its the same as usual, make sure the Inf and medium tanks are up to date, sort out the industrial and supply techs, and work on theory.

I've finally turned some attention to the VNF. Even with a bit of a gap, I don't think I could ever build anything that would actually challenge the USN, so I've decided to go for a combination of destroyers, battleships, heavy cruisers and subs. This helps limit my research effort and should be enough for serious convoy and transport escort work. A load more TAC will also help with gaining some degree of control over critical sea areas. So I have 4 naval research teams at the moment - 1 each on subs, destroyers and BBs, and one researching some doctrinal techs.

But I think my best solution to the USN problem will be to invade Canada and gain the support of Mexico, before war starts with them. Then *all* I need to do is keep my convoys afloat.

In the meantime, the "Scandinavian crisis" was solved by one well placed para drop:



More medium term, I'm redeploying forces and adding new Soviet formations so as to take advantage of any German collapse and the impact on the British empire. I hope to be able to invade Persia by June and that opens up both Iraq (& the Middle East) and India, especially if there are not many UK formations left around.