A Short Confederate Question

[DoomBunny]

Somewhat of a what if here, and one that is rather short and important yet overlooked.

What would an indendent Confederacy actually be called? Obviously the answer is the Confederate States etc..., but what would be the shorthand? Americans are called, well, Americans. But if there are two Americas...?

 

[Imperator1993]

I would say we'd probably be called Confederates, seems like the most simple one.

 

[DoomBunny]

That was my first thought, but that doesn't really fit with existing names. I can't think of a single nationality described by its type of government rather than the country itself, which is why I asked this question.

 

[Sarmatia1871]

I would say we'd probably be called Confederates, seems like the most simple one.

Yeah, this does seem the most logical, even if there aren't really any precedents for that sort of name.

Although would also imply that those from the remainder of the US would be called "United Statesians" or similar.

 

[MrTrt]

Yeah, this does seem the most logical, even if there aren't really any precedents for that sort of name.

Although would also imply that those from the remainder of the US would be called "United Statesians" or similar.

Well, that's the case in Spanish. It's more common to call the country "Estados Unidos" ("United States") rahter than "America". And the demonym is "estadounidense", which essentially means "united statesian".

If you think about it, calling the people from the Soviet Union "soviets" is also weird. It's just a matter of getting used to it.

 

[Geriander]

Yeah, this does seem the most logical, even if there aren't really any precedents for that sort of name.

Although would also imply that those from the remainder of the US would be called "United Statesians" or similar.

Unionists and Confederates sounds better and as MrTrt mentioned, it wouldn't be any stranger than Soviets.

Edit: Maybe Yankee and Dixie would become the common terms.

 

[bz249]

Well, that's the case in Spanish. It's more common to call the country "Estados Unidos" ("United States") rahter than "America". And the demonym is "estadounidense", which essentially means "united statesian".

If you think about it, calling the people from the Soviet Union "soviets" is also weird. It's just a matter of getting used to it.

Ok if the people of the Soviet Union are soviets, than what about the people from the United Kingdom?

 

[Sarmatia1871]

Ok if the people of the Soviet Union are soviets, than what about the people from the United Kingdom?

British, because the full title is "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland," and the designator comes from a different part of the name (and no-one pays attention to Northern Ireland).

Union of Soviet Socialist Republics doesn't really have any other easily distinguishable terms you can use in it other than "Soviet."

 

[Ming]

I suspect that in the Anglophone world Northerner and Southerner would win out and we'd have non North-Americans complaining over it the same way they complain about using 'American'.

 

[DarthJF]

Edit: Maybe Yankee and Dixie would become the common terms.

That's what I would expect to happen.

 

[L'Afrique]

That's what I would expect to happen.

Dixie is not used like that though, in the past or now. You can be a Yankee or Yank but not a Dixie or even a dixie person. I'm southern and I've never seen "Dixie" used in that way outside of the Vicky games. Dixie or Dixieland is an affectionate term for the south and that's about it.

 

[SeekTruthFromFx]

North Korean/South Korean
North Vietnamese/South Vietnamese
North American/South American

Of course, that assumes that both sides still thought of themselves as Americans. But given the official names, I think that's likely.

Caveats:
- diplomatic circles and Communist media would talk carefully about "the United States" just as they use "the DPRK" today
- as mentioned above, Yankees and Dixielanders in informal situations ("Of course I know how to do my own laundry, I'm a Yankee, you idiot!") and sports commentary
- Spanish/Portuguese speakers would still wish to make political points about the meaning of América by pointedly using other terms

 

[L'Afrique]

North Korean/South Korean
North Vietnamese/South Vietnamese
North American/South American

Of course, that assumes that both sides still thought of themselves as Americans. But given the official names, I think that's likely.

Caveats:
- diplomatic circles and Communist media would talk carefully about "the United States" just as they use "the DPRK" today
- as mentioned above, Yankees and Dixielanders in informal situations ("Of course I know how to do my own laundry, I'm a Yankee, you idiot!") and sports commentary
- Spanish/Portuguese speakers would still wish to make political points about the meaning of América by pointedly using other terms

Very much agree that dixielander would be used, not dixie, for people. "That Dixie guy" sounds like "I just saw this England dude at the bar" or "Remember that crazy Japan?" The first works if you mean the national sports team and the latter in meme-talk in a polandball or something, but no one would use it for a person even as slang.

Also, "confederado" was already a term in Mexico and the southwest during the war so it's very likely it'd survive and maybe spread to modern spanish terminology.

 

[SeekTruthFromFx]

Very much agree that dixielander would be used, not dixie, for people. "That Dixie guy" sounds like "I just saw this England dude at the bar" or "Remember that crazy Japan?" The first works if you mean the national sports team and the latter in meme-talk in a polandball or something, but no one would use it for a person even as slang.

That's correct for English usage in our timeline, but of course the CSA might have decided to try to create an alternative national identity for itself, in which case Dixielander > Dixies is an obvious contraction, especially as English already has "pixies" (was that ever used as a slur in the Civil War?).

These things can change quickly. When was the last time you heard someone on TV talk about Nipponese, British North America, Ottomans, Kampucheans, Czechoslovakians, Ryukyans, Rhodesians...? This is a PDX forum, so you can look up the tags in your game folders!

 

[Eusebio]

Southrons.

 

[Abdul Goatherd]

That's correct for English usage in our timeline, but of course the CSA might have decided to try to create an alternative national identity for itself, in which case Dixielander > Dixies is an obvious contraction, especially as English already has "pixies" (was that ever used as a slur in the Civil War?).

These things can change quickly. When was the last time you heard someone on TV talk about Nipponese, British North America, Ottomans, Kampucheans, Czechoslovakians, Ryukyans, Rhodesians...? This is a PDX forum, so you can look up the tags in your game folders!

Doubt it. Southerners already had strong identities as Virginians, Carolinians, Georgians, etc., they'd be unlikely to embrace another label too quickly. They'd likely go with something awkward and anti-septic like "Southerner" or "Confederate", and that'd be the end of that.

Speaking of weird demonyms, what was someone from the Papal States called?

 

[wingo]

That's correct for English usage in our timeline, but of course the CSA might have decided to try to create an alternative national identity for itself, in which case Dixielander > Dixies is an obvious contraction, especially as English already has "pixies" (was that ever used as a slur in the Civil War?).

These things can change quickly. When was the last time you heard someone on TV talk about Nipponese, British North America, Ottomans, Kampucheans, Czechoslovakians, Ryukyans, Rhodesians...? This is a PDX forum, so you can look up the tags in your game folders!

...Czechoslovakians...

Not as long ago as you might think

 

[Sarmatia1871]

Speaking of weird demonyms, what was someone from the Papal States called?

I don't think there was a specific term. If you're writing about someone from there in a modern historical work, you would either refer to them as "from the Papal States," use an adjective based on whichever bit of the Papal states they were from (Umbrian, Romagnese, etc...), or just go with "Italian", depending on which is most relevant to the context.

 

[DoomBunny]

Doubt it. Southerners already had strong identities as Virginians, Carolinians, Georgians, etc., they'd be unlikely to embrace another label too quickly. They'd likely go with something awkward and anti-septic like "Southerner" or "Confederate", and that'd be the end of that.

Speaking of weird demonyms, what was someone from the Papal States called?

I think this might be a similar case to the Holy Roman Empire where a lot of people just ended up being called German anyway? So Italian, but in a cultural rather than national sense?

I'd be interested to know otherwise however.

 

[Abdul Goatherd]

I don't think there was a specific term. If you're writing about someone from there in a modern historical work, you would either refer to them as "from the Papal States," use an adjective based on whichever bit of the Papal states they were from (Umbrian, Romagnese, etc...), or just go with "Italian", depending on which is most relevant to the context.

Roman, Umbrian, etc. I've heard. "Italian" wouldn't do if it is in Italy - if anything, it would insinuate someone from the north (Lombard Kingdom of Italy) rather than the Papal States.

I expect that might end up being the solution with our CSA fellows. They will be Virginian, Carolinian, etc. or "from the Confederate States".