A new economic system .... please

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SchwarzKatze

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The Economy system is good and not complex. I don´t discuss it. If you wanna have a complexer one play Hoi 2 and 3. Point!

The only thing the Devs could change is the Trade System. Instead of Civ-Industry you can trade with other Ressources (like Oil, Steel or so). If you don´t have Ressources, they get Civ or Mil-Industry instead.
I wouldn't say it's good. It suffers from exponential growth of factories and near the end game you will have countries with over a thousand factories while simultaneously fielding several million soldiers. In previous iterations, having more divisions slows down economic growth because there's a maintenance cost separate from reinforcement/upgrade.
 
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DystopianAlphaOmega

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True: Democracy provided ask the pace if the war goes on too long and is not going well. Some historians say that the UK, if the US had not entered or had entered late, would have given up. (Which then if they had given up I doubt the US would have entered the war, or rather they would have provoked Japan to have a CB) So I think that if the war goes badly, democracies should have increasingly serious protests to the point of strikes against the war. If Stalin, Hitler, Mussolini or Hiroito can resist until the enemy literally enters their home, democracies do not.

There is very little evidence to show this. In fact, most of the major nations of WWII showed they were willing to fight on to the brink despite massive losses and desperate situations - Germany, Japan, UK, USSR all qualify under this. Only countries with weak governments collapsed/surrendered very quickly (France and Italy), one of which was fascist and the other democratic.

Dissatisfaction with the war was a very real concern for all nations, but especially for the fascist nation Germany. Hitler was worried he might lose support of the German civilian population like what had happened in WWI and so went out of his way to keep up the living standard of Germany proper as long as was possible (even at the expense of further economic mobilization and looting the rest of Europe, alienating local populations). This was at the same time while democracies were going without luxuries, pushing austerity, and moving to more complete economic mobilizations. Also remember that Germany had to fear potential assassinations from the military if dissatisfaction with the state of the war grew to bleak. HOI III did this decently, with fascists needing less consumer goods compared to democracies while at peace while democracies required less consumer goods while at war.
 
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Vlad123

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I remember, that in the UK people after the fall of France went down the street ... to ask for an end to the war: Poland no longer existed, France was KO. The war was "lost". Churchill was "thanked" after the war with a good kick in the butt. Many British historians say "yes hitler would have dominated Europe, but the UK would probably have maintained the empire (perhaps even kept its grace thanks to the German help, hitler wanted in his dreams, that the UK was a" sister nation "of Germany , with the UK ruler of the seas and land Germany) more or less intact (except for some concessions to the axis). Regarding Italy, this happened because Mussolini, at the beginning of the war had promised "a few hundred deaths and a short war ". The war instead:
-wrought thousands of deaths.
- it was long and hard.
-It was lost!
If the UK had also lost Malta, Gibraltar, Cairo / Egypt. I doubt the Indian soldiers would have continued to fight for a "defeated" nation and therefore problems in india (so either send the soldiers against the Indians or send them against axis power) that almost certainly would have rebelled. I don't know the relationship with the other dominions (which had a more or less autonomous government). I know that strategically "is nothing" but psychologically losing Malta, Gibraltar and Egypt ... is a serious blow. I am surprised that in the forum you underestimate the psychological factor, when in reality it is very important.
 

Zeprion

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Money yes, that's a good idea, but I don't think this game should give you the ability to expand your resources sector without stopping in a region, that could lead to a lot of possible exploits. Both in multiplayer and singleplayer.
 

DystopianAlphaOmega

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I remember, that in the UK people after the fall of France went down the street ... to ask for an end to the war: Poland no longer existed, France was KO. The war was "lost". Churchill was "thanked" after the war with a good kick in the butt. Many British historians say "yes hitler would have dominated Europe, but the UK would probably have maintained the empire (perhaps even kept its grace thanks to the German help, hitler wanted in his dreams, that the UK was a" sister nation "of Germany , with the UK ruler of the seas and land Germany) more or less intact (except for some concessions to the axis). Regarding Italy, this happened because Mussolini, at the beginning of the war had promised "a few hundred deaths and a short war ". The war instead:
-wrought thousands of deaths.
- it was long and hard.
-It was lost!
If the UK had also lost Malta, Gibraltar, Cairo / Egypt. I doubt the Indian soldiers would have continued to fight for a "defeated" nation and therefore problems in india (so either send the soldiers against the Indians or send them against axis power) that almost certainly would have rebelled. I don't know the relationship with the other dominions (which had a more or less autonomous government). I know that strategically "is nothing" but psychologically losing Malta, Gibraltar and Egypt ... is a serious blow. I am surprised that in the forum you underestimate the psychological factor, when in reality it is very important.

While opinions were still in flux, I wouldn’t say the British population was marching through the streets demanding an end to the war in 1940. If anything it was government factions that were the bigger defeatists/proponents of peace.

Churchill’s defeat in 45 was due to a number of factors, none of which included his victory in the war. Attlee has been a member of the war cabinet, Labour offered massive new spending, Churchill still had some baggage from the government’s failure to build “a country fit for heroes” as promised after WWI, and fatigue with the Conservative party after a 10 year Parliament as well as parts of the party still being tainted with appeasement. And Churchill was not only refused resignation from party leadership, but was able to leverage his immense political popularity into a major comeback over the next two elections.

While the war was going badly, it wasn’t completely lost when the Italian government collapsed. Much like the French government they could have fought on if they had so desired for some time.

Anyways, I again reject your assertion that democracies are so much more inherently inclined to giving up in such total wars. Even if some voters have doubts, elections often aren’t held in the thick of conflict anyways. Democracies were often more reluctant to get into wars to begin with and in the timeframe after that which HOI IV depicts could be worn down over many years in more limited conflicts where there was little press censorship and not total commitment to the war (see colonial independence wars and Vietnam for instance), but these have little bearing on WWII.

As to your points about if Italy captured the Med, we’ve already discussed this in two or three threads and at some risk of digressing off topic, but the war would hardly be lost for Britain, the Indian Army isn’t going to mass mutiny without a lot more happening (and localized revolts could be quickly dealt with through force or promises of autonomy post-war), and the dominions aren’t going to be leaving the war while the UK is still in it. As for psychological blow, sure it’ll hurt, but far less (from a military and morale perspective) than the fall of France.
 
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Metz

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You should be able to stockpile resources, actively produce consumer goods that need to be rationed, and create supply depots near your front to avoid the exploit of capitals being surrounded in order to cut all supply.
 

Vlad123

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You should be able to stockpile resources, actively produce consumer goods that need to be rationed, and create supply depots near your front to avoid the exploit of capitals being surrounded in order to cut all supply.
In hoi2, if i remember exist the located warehouse...why paradox remove the good feature can are present in OLD game?
 

Hoi Neuling

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The Devs wanna test new Elements and new Features. You have to see that Hoi 2 and 3 were produced in the beginning and Mid 2k´s. Hoi 4 were comming in 2016 and get improved more and more with the Patches and DLC´s.

And older usefull working Features get in too from Hoi 2. But they have to be usefull, not complex like in Hoi 2 and 3. That´s why Hoi 2 and 3 were Storekeepers from normal Players.

But 1 good thing from Hoi 2 and 3 were the Trading from Materials. Some have more of that and others from that. Germany for example could trade Steel to countrys which have Rubber and Oil for example. Yep, exactly that was the great feature from Hoi 2 and 3. You save Civ-Industrys for your must have Buildup, esp. in Countrys which have Colonies, which they need or Countrys which have need on Ressources.

It must not be 1:1 but fair. That´s what the Trade-System needs.
 
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