A more suitable coat of arms for England

[DreadLindwyrm]

Basically I agree with claim, but we also should have in mind that three lions is the best known CoA of England and, to be honest, lions is just popular heraldry figure. I can imagine that such heraldry symbol could appear not for the normans, but just for another feodal.

The best option, as for me, set dragon as CoA pre-norman period and give for any ruler (or at least non-anglosaxon ruler) of England design to change the CoA on three lions.

P. S. And, of course, I would be glad if the same option will appear for Rus too.

The reason for those particular three lions though is very particular to a Plantagenet ruled England.

An England that hadn't held Aquitaine could well have stuck to just the two Lions it had had passed down via the connection with Normandy, rather than combining the two Norman and one Aquitainian lion into the Plantagenet associated coat of arms. Conversely an independent double duke of Normandy and Aquitaine could equally well have united the two in the same way. It isn't really right for a Norman conquest era England either.

Without it, we could well have seen a very, very different setup, maybe retaining the single Lion Rampant as used by Henry II, or the counter rampant lions as apparently used by RIchard I.

And yes, I know it's the iconic "real world" English arms, but we spent more time under France quartered with England than we did with England alone. We only dropped the French/English quartering in 1707, and only eliminated France from the arms in 1801.

 

[SigurdStormhand]

Basically I agree with claim, but we also should have in mind that three lions is the best known CoA of England and, to be honest, lions is just popular heraldry figure. I can imagine that such heraldry symbol could appear not for the normans, but just for another feodal.

The best option, as for me, set dragon as CoA pre-norman period and give for any ruler (or at least non-anglosaxon ruler) of England design to change the CoA on three lions.

P. S. And, of course, I would be glad if the same option will appear for Rus too.

The Lions are the symbol of the House of Anjou - as already noted, the three lions are for the three primary Angevin Domains.

The iconography is quite specific, just like Capetian France.

 

[Fulgrim]

The Lions are the symbol of the House of Anjou - as already noted, the three lions are for the three primary Angevin Domains.

The iconography is quite specific, just like Capetian France.

In that case it will be unfair if only England get new historical CoAs. Let's start from HRE with doubleheaded eagle from XIV century, France with Capetian fleur-de-lys for Carolings, Rus with personal sigil of Vladimir in modern Ukrainian colours.
Every country has mistakes in its symbols.

And one more point, what if not Wessex will unite England? In that case dragon will be inappropriate too.

 

[DreadLindwyrm]

In that case it will be unfair if only England get new historical CoAs. Let's start from HRE with doubleheaded eagle from XIV century, France with Capetian fleur-de-lys for Carolings, Rus with personal sigil of Vladimir in modern Ukrainian colours.
Every country has mistakes in its symbols.

And one more point, what if not Wessex will unite England? In that case dragon will be inappropriate too.

Just because other symbols are bad is no reason not to correct others as the opportunity - and sensible times to do - come up.

A white *dragon* banner rather than a wyvern would at least be a more general Anglo-Saxon symbol, and although not perfect, it's certainly better than backprojecting the Plantagenet Lions by up to 4 centuries.

Should the others be fixed? Ideally yes.