A Cry of the Heart

[Nosferatu]

Hello folks! Just a few things I am worrying about. PLEASE, I know you are swedish genius and everybody knows. But don't spoil a great idea of this game. I see that the lame AI can be a DOOM of this game. Can you tell me oh mighty heroes of Norse:

Will the AI will be capable of using all of the game's features? I remember the terrible expirience of Europa Universalis 1 and 2, where AI was uncapable of using mercenaries and pirates, it was uncapable of moving slider of domestic policy once per a decade, it was uncapable of using loans. The same thing was in For the Glory game. In Crusader King's the AI was uncapable of changing laws manually (without the events). The games were brilliant but the lame and incompetent AI spoiled everything. Some features were like a legal cheats against AI.

If it will be the choice to introduce some strange and unbalanced thing, which will be inavailable for the AI will you choice will be to introduce it in the gameplay or not?

Thanks in advance for the answers. Hopefully, it will be a dream game because the dream team is in place.

 

[Safehold]

In Starcraft 2, I seem to remember the patched AI actually copied optimal build orders and setups from platinum plus players. Thereby stealing human ingenuity using scripts and what not. It's not really AI of course, but a simulacrum built by writing adaptive scripts sourced off the best of Human Players. Sort of like programming a chess program to beat Grandmasters.

 

[zukodark]

Hello folks! Just a few things I am worrying about. PLEASE, I know you are swedish genius and everybody knows. But don't spoil a great idea of this game. I see that the lame AI can be a DOOM of this game. Can you tell me oh mighty heroes of Norse:

Will the AI will be capable of using all of the game's features? I remember the terrible expirience of Europa Universalis 1 and 2, where AI was uncapable of using mercenaries and pirates, it was uncapable of moving slider of domestic policy once per a decade, it was uncapable of using loans. The same thing was in For the Glory game. In Crusader King's the AI was uncapable of changing laws manually (without the events). The games were brilliant but the lame and incompetent AI spoiled everything. Some features were like a legal cheats against AI.

If it will be the choice to introduce some strange and unbalanced thing, which will be inavailable for the AI will you choice will be to introduce it in the gameplay or not?

Thanks in advance for the answers. Hopefully, it will be a dream game because the dream team is in place.

First off, EU 1 and 2 was a long ago. They have come far since then. In Eu 4, for instance, I think the AI is good, while not perfect (which would be too much too expect from any game). I think they are getting further each game.

 

[Draculdraconis]

First off, EU 1 and 2 was a long ago. They have come far since then. In Eu 4, for instance, I think the AI is good, while not perfect (which would be too much too expect from any game). I think they are getting further each game.

I agree. PDX has come a far way with the AI and I hope they keep up the trend of improving AI between games and expensions

 

[King Ari]

Yeah those games were released ages ago, the eu4 AI seems to be the most recent, and IMO it does its job quite well. It can be challenging and throw you some curve-balls at times but overall I think it does a pretty good job of using the features and making the single-player experience engaging. Pretty much what everyone else is saying. I can't disagree with you, any single-player strategy game needs an AI that can make the game interesting for the player, but I have high hopes for what the people at PDS can achieve.

 

[Safehold]

One of the easier ways to improve AI is to consider game mechanics in relation to AI from the beginning, same as they do with the multiplayer net code.

The production omni queue in various 4x games... modern AI does not know how to make dynamic decisions there, and "automation" isn't going to fix that.

The choices are too broad and the "optimal" decision isn't something a computer can figure out, unless it can do 1000 simulations against a human first.

AI Wars has the reputation of being very challenging, because the AI plays "asymmetrically", in the sense that they have certain advantages designed to make use of AI calculation while the humans are the "insurgents" and must rely on creativity and timing instead of numerical superiority.

 

[Nosferatu]

I think it does a pretty good job of using the features and making the single-player experience engaging

So are you trying to tell that the AI in the games above mentioned is capable of utilizing all of the game's features and there were no things like mercenaries in EU2 that was completely forbidden for the AI? I am not talking if the AI can use something good or bad, I just trying to understand if it can use all of the games features somehow. In EU 2 for example the AI was COMPLETELY uncapable of utilizing mercenaries and loans. What about EU 4? (I passed EU3 and EU4)

 

[Safehold]

CK2 used mercenaries pretty well, usually to boost their manpower in invasions since they can compare their total levy vs the enemy's total levy. But that's because the levy system was simplified enough for the ai script to check that without running into a situation where a human might have to make a value judgment.

In other cases, such as being invaded by a larger empire that has only sent a portion of their levies, the defending AI might not use mercenaries, whereas a human player would in order to ambush and trap a fragment of the enemy's army, dividing and conquering.

 

[nicochrish]

So are you trying to tell that the AI in the games above mentioned is capable of utilizing all of the game's features and there were no things like mercenaries in EU2 that was completely forbidden for the AI? I am not talking if the AI can use something good or bad, I just trying to understand if it can use all of the games features somehow. In EU 2 for example the AI was COMPLETELY uncapable of utilizing mercenaries and loans. What about EU 4? (I passed EU3 and EU4)

He is talking about the EUIV AI, which you did not mention in your original post. The examples you gave are all pretty outdated, so I'm not sure how they're relevant to Stellaris...

 

[Daddl]

I would highly recommend you not to worry about any feature in this game at all if your references are more than 11 year old games which were propably envisioned and maintained by a team of around 3 people with no budget at all. Paradox is a little bit bigger and more professional now, you know, just a tiny tiny little bit...

 

[Lys91]

PDX AI problem now days among other thing tend to rise from the tension between playing well and playing as a "realistic" country (and some players complaining about coalition mechanics even though they make total sense...). I am pretty sure the dev could make the AI better, but it would take some of the fun out of the game.