A Call for Civility: Please, no more Nationalist threads...

[unmerged(4989)]

I have to say that I am dismayed by the amount of nationalist threads that have popped up in these threads lately debating how many cores certain revolters get in Vicky. First it was the Polish, then the Finns. It seems to me that if some of these posters got their way IRL, Poland would be everything between the Oder and the Volga up to Latvia, then Finland would start.

I understand that most of these are not intended to be nationalistic as such, but inevitably nationals of the nation at whose cost these territories must come rightfully come to their country's defence. At which point either the original poster or another national of that country defend the inclusion of that territory in their country, usually through the use of some obscure General's claim a hundred plus years ago. Somewhere around page 3 or 4, the discussion dithers into namecalling and hairpulling.

I love my country too. So does (I suspect) everyone on this forum. But when you make a claim or propose an action that is guaranteed to generate an extreme reaction, as these do--intended or not, I personally beleive that all discussable qualities to your post is lost. Therefore, I humbly suggest that if people beleive that certain nations should get more claims than they have, either make the mod or suggest it in one of the modding (not the general discussion) forum. Please.

 

[Ehrenbourg]

Fully agree with you...with reservation

Agree...it is wise

...BUT was so funny (no offense intended - just distanciation) , for an age of nationalism chrome - to see nationalistic reactions :rofl:

in EU, you perhaps could have had some argument with a British player blaming "your ungratefulness after we saved your... from big bad papist frogs, you unbreed disrespectful colonials" or something alike - would gladly change us from recent irl reciprocal political bashing (while at last getting more moderate tone, though..)

so bad.... but you are wise, can get out of control - better to stop..fully support you on this one

 

[unmerged(23737)]

*applause* to this thread *Wilhelm bows*

Excellent remarks and i will tell(though everyone should now) that there is a difference between nationalism and patriotism!

 

[Derek Pullem]

I guess after the endless Balkan ethnicity and territorial disputes of EU2 most of us old timers just switch off (or wait for the thread to head to the History forum / OT)

 

[unmerged(4989)]

Agree...it is wise

...BUT was so funny (no offense intended - just distanciation) , for an age of nationalism chrome - to see nationalistic reactions :rofl:

in EU, you perhaps could have had some argument with a British player blaming "your ungratefulness after we saved your... from big bad papist frogs, you unbreed disrespectful colonials" or something alike - would gladly change us from recent irl reciprocal political bashing (while at last getting more moderate tone, though..)

so bad.... but you are wise, can get out of control - better to stop..fully support you on this one

Yeah, I seem to remember some very fire and brimstone English nationalism in the EU forums. Ah, well, que cera cera. Part of the fun of having a game like this that appeals to so many people around the world.

A side note, Ehrenbourg, for your amusement to show how ridiculous the France-bashing got over here. I went, some time right before the Iraq invasion, to get a French coffee press at a local department store. I asked the clerk if he had a "French press." The friend I was with said jokingly, "It's a Freedom press now." I sarcastically said, "Oh, right. Do you have freedom presses?" So the clerk goes to his manager and asks "Do we have freedom presses?" I laughed, then left the store. :wacko:

 

[unmerged(12603)]

Im an american, but im around 1/8-1/4 polish, I agree that these threads are getting rediculous, rather quickly. If anything i would say present some actual historical information to johan, and leave it at that. He can make the decisions as he sees fit for game balancing and other reasons.

 

[EasilyConfused]

Yeah, its new to me because I don't have EU2. There arent' too many nationalist sentiments in HOI, because nobody's about to argue the case for Nazi Germany.

 

[Slacker22]

I have to say that I am dismayed by the amount of nationalist threads that have popped up in these threads lately debating how many cores certain revolters get in Vicky. First it was the Polish, then the Finns. It seems to me that if some of these posters got their way IRL, Poland would be everything between the Oder and the Volga up to Latvia, then Finland would start.

There's a problem with this? Screw the Russians. :rofl:

Seriously, yeah, those threads got a smidge on the intense side.

 

[unmerged(14689)]

There's a problem with this? Screw the Russians. :rofl:

Why you ***** ****** ****!!!!

I'm gonna *** **** ***** ***!!!!

Oh, and yes, I too hate those nationalist threads! Be gone, nasty threads! :rofl: :rofl:

 

[Gwalcmai]

que cera cera

Now some italian nationalist should come annoy you for your bad italian.

 

[hildoceras]

but ... we haven't yet discussed the case of Liechtenstein and its claims on Austrian and Swiss lands ...
you're not fun

 

[Syt]

I agree that nationalism shouldn't have a place in discussions on these fora. IMO disputed core provinces are best dealt with by giving them to both nations, e.g. if there's an argument if a province belongs to country A or country B then make it a core for both of them and solve the issue in the game.

 

[Montemurro]

Now some italian nationalist should come annoy you for your bad italian.

IIRC 'que sera sera' is Spanish

 

[Spruce]

well I would like to oppose, I gues I've got the right to do that ,

I have some sympathy with the "nationalistic" threads because they are started by people who love their country very much,

Imho EU2 had a more dynamic system of cores making it a better suited engine. F.e. when you start as Muscovy, you'll have few cores and when you go with the flow you'll end up as Russia with a massive amount of cores,

And yes Victoria is historical more static compared to EU2.

Some countries lack cores - like Belgium should have cores on Northern France provinces, and Maastricht and Luxemburg (about that last one I'm not sure), I'll not argue on that otherwise some of you would call that "nationalistic",

Cores are claims - agreed by "A PART" of the international community at the beginning of the 19'th century, now that's a rather vague an subjective criterium. I know, and we all know the line has to be drawn somewhere by Paradox,

Bottomline is that I do have sympathy for those "Nationalistic" posters that are awarded with a nice stigma.

Altough I agree that arguing and being insultive is not the way to solve this question. Let's all being constructive and if the arguments are sound, why not make a mod.

People who know their history well and post about it on these forums - with arguments and being polite - shouldn't be treated like "nationalistics".

In this world today there seem to be patriots and nationalists? That's the "perception" imho,

And by the way, I checked the Poland map - 1772 - before the country was cut in bits and pieces - before I made this post,

so I believe they are entitled to put the Victoria cores into perspective,

 

[Spruce]

I agree that nationalism shouldn't have a place in discussions on these fora. IMO disputed core provinces are best dealt with by giving them to both nations, e.g. if there's an argument if a province belongs to country A or country B then make it a core for both of them and solve the issue in the game.

agreed, but where are the Belgian cores on North France and Maastricht,

 

[unmerged(23981)]

I would be utterly dismayed if I wouldn't have a chance to read about real Pan-bushmannic Uglu-Zulu national claims
You ppl wanna take all the flavor and spices out of history ?!
Dring yer stone-col' mug o'ale an' argue fer yer due nationaliztic claimz!

j/k :rofl:

 

[Old Joe]

ah, when i just want to start "Real Russian national provinces" thread

 

[unmerged(19226)]

re Charles V

I have to say that I am dismayed by the amount of nationalist threads that have popped up in these threads lately debating how many cores certain revolters get in Vicky. First it was the Polish, then the Finns. It seems to me that if some of these posters got their way IRL, Poland would be everything between the Oder and the Volga up to Latvia, then Finland would start.

My posts in thread concerning Polish real provinces have nothing to do with any kind of nationalism.

If discussion about changes in cores of a state in one of the future patches is wrong idea for you and for other people I would say it's not wrong idea for me.

Historical correctness is one of the best aspcets of Paradox games but there are some controversial/incorrect solutions, too.

Why only make mods to change this? Why don't discuss about some changes in one of the future patches?

 

[Derek Pullem]

Because they have very little impact on the game, cause immense amounts of friction on the boards and alot of effort on Paradox's part to try to determine the "right" solution when faced with incontravertible proof from two diffferent sources with completely different conclusions

 

[unmerged(14180)]

What i haver never understood about these national threads is why they are here?

It is moddable. Yes that is right, if you wish to give Poland/Finland/Ethiopia cores on the rest of the world, do so, its quite easy.

Look in the country file(need wordpad or excel) find the cores numbers that you want to be part of your hegemonistic nation, then add them to your country file in the Campaign DB.

Im sure someone else can help you with this as well.

If its moddable, i never complain about it.