30-days-of-supply ... where?

[notger.heinz]

Picking up something from the beaches-thread: The manual says, units have their own 30-days-worth of supplies they carry with them, but in game, I fail to see it.

Or rather: Is this supply attackable by logistical bombing?

Because, when invading Britain, my troops were unable to move due to being out of supply, though it was only around one week into the invasion and they had been supplied properly beforehand. They had moved into a territory which was bombed down to 0 infrastructure by the AI and the tool-tip said they were out of supply.

Does bombing put units immediately out of supply and destroy their 30-days-reserve or was the 30-days-reserve simply unable to travel into the bombed-out territory and was left behind?

 

[unmerged(151058)]

You can see all supplies on the map. When a unit enters a new province you'll notice some supplies move along with it, that's its very own 30 days supplies. So, yes, all supplies including the mystical 30 days supplies can be bombed away.
I'm not sure about low-inf, from what I've seen I think a unit's supply stack moves into a 0 inf province just fine.

 

[Scryder]

There definitely seems to be some oddities with regards to the 30 days supply. In my current USA game, as soon as Germany surrendered, countries like Austria and Czechoslovakia reformed, and my troops in that territory, who were fully supplied the day before immediately ran out of supplies and fuel . I feel the only way to get them out, other than a slow walk out at 0KPH, is to declare war on both!

 

[unmerged(151058)]

Were you allied with them?

 

[Scryder]

Were you allied with them?

Me? No, they were both German puppets. I can declare war on them as my neutrality is low enough, and this is what I'm contemplating doing.

 

[unmerged(151058)]

Nothing to do with the supply system then, troops in foreign territory aren't supplied unless allied or puppet.
Try strategic redeploy to the border.

 

[Scryder]

Thank you falanf, SR to the border helped get them out eventually. Appreciate the help.

----
I think this happens because of the surrender event. I remember reading that someone had this happen to them when the Vichy event triggered as well.

I have a theory why this might happen. Could it be because when a country is formed by these events, there is no date associated to it? So as far as the game is concerned, those countries existed forever, and since you never requested transit rights (from these non-existent countries at the time) your troops loose all supply. As far as the game is concerned, your troops should not be there. Any thoughts?

 

[Alex_brunius]

I have a theory why this might happen. Could it be because when a country is formed by these events, there is no date associated to it? So as far as the game is concerned, those countries existed forever, and since you never requested transit rights (from these non-existent countries at the time) your troops loose all supply. As far as the game is concerned, your troops should not be there. Any thoughts?

No I'm pretty sure its because of the following:

Only the owner of a province can have supplies in them. Thus as soon as the owner changes, so does the ownership of the supplies. This can also be observed if your units are engaged in a long defensive battle that they ultimately lose. The province will change ownership right away and your retreating units are instantly out of supplies.

 

[Scryder]

No I'm pretty sure its because of the following:

Only the owner of a province can have supplies in them. Thus as soon as the owner changes, so does the ownership of the supplies. This can also be observed if your units are engaged in a long defensive battle that they ultimately lose. The province will change ownership right away and your retreating units are instantly out of supplies.

But then shouldn't the 30-day supply rule be working in this case? Or are your troops supposed to lose all supplies, both when retreating and when province changes hand? I can understand that this could be the case for the former, as troops might not be able to transport all supplies when in a hurry retreating. But it makes no sense for the latter...

 

[loki100]

I must admit I've been getting confused both with troops dropping out of supply when the province they are retreating from is overrun and the seeming depth of some supply dumps when I encircle something.

I just rationalise the first as represented the chaos of a retreat and the second as a little frustrating.

 

[Johan]

Or rather: Is this supply attackable by logistical bombing?

yes

 

[DazKaz]

What it needs is a slider like the current one for supply only more useful, that represents the amount of the 30 days supply that the unit is currently holding.
Maybe with increments (30 of them) so that the player can assess the level that the individual unit is carrying.
At the moment if you have a big stack there is no way of assessing what individual units will take with them when they move out of the stack. Will it be 30 days or 5?
If they take all their 30 days when they move out what will be left for the others?
For a game that has used the supply system as one of its main selling points, it does a very bad job at giving the user the right information to be able to use it effectively.

 

[unmerged(180021)]

I lost my supply in China, when Xanxi surrenders and I got Beijing and that big port south of Benjing. AI put up a supply depot north of that port. Then AI put up a supply route from main Japan (Nagasaki) to that port, but only 2 ships carrying supply. I dont know if it should be so if I had just puppetted those bastards. Beijing was also totally out of supply. I had my planes there, but none could fly as they didnt get any supply.

I had all Japan forces there in China. And it needed supply around 200 per day, but I got only 35. And you cant chance that. In HOI 2 I could send as many ships I wanted, to where I wanted. But in this new game you cant. I could send ships as a supply convoy to Iwo Jima or whatever God knows islands there, but not to my biggest port in China.

I try to do all tricks I could imagine to get that supply coming in, but whatever I did that never happened. Frustated I quit the game and deleted it from my computer.

It is nothing more frustating that to see your men dying because those byrocrats in main HQ has no brains and I cant put upp a own depot where ever I want it to be. Easy solution would be a separate unit "Supply Depot" and that works like beacon to AI where to dump supplies.

In my so far wargame history from 1984, I have seen only one wargame that had working supply model. That was those Atomic Games battleground series. Oh boy, I loved those games. Why ? Well I am a Finn, and we are masters to cut supply. Thats the key how we beat those owerhelming russian back in 1939 and 1944. We call them "Motti" and I would like do it also in a simulation game like HOI was.

Please, fix this supply problem. Otherwise, dont hype on this games supply for customers like me.

 

[unmerged(151058)]

Read one of the countless japan guides. The only unintuitive issue there is that as soon as you secure a port in the north supply flow through manchuko stops, so using all your forces there is a mistake.

 

[Tsambo]

I lost my supply in China, when Xanxi surrenders and I got Beijing and that big port south of Benjing. AI put up a supply depot north of that port. Then AI put up a supply route from main Japan (Nagasaki) to that port, but only 2 ships carrying supply.

There is a way to go round that problem which occurs when you annex Shanxi. You edit your saved game file and you delete the port south-east of Beijing. With this trick your troops start slowly to get supplied from North Korea again!! By that way you can supply whole armies in China.

 

[notger.heinz]

yes

Thx for the answer, I appreciate that!
Well, good decision. I think log bombing will now become my favourite.

 

[unmerged(3221)]

That one word comment by Johan

Is this supply attackable by logistical bombing?
yes

is very important for players to note. If you logistically bomb a province down to zero infra, which is ridiculously easy to do, then you can not use that province for invasion or even for normal moves.

 

[unmerged(151058)]

Yes, I notice AI (especially Japan AI in southern guangxi) often appears to be doing nothing with a superstack because it sits in a 0 inf province..

 

[quetzilla]

The 30 days supply are not stored in some magical location offscreen, they are literally there on the map if you look in supply mode. Units will carry this supply with them as they move around. If the supply line from home gets cut or diminished, then the amount used becomes more than the amount supplied from home and this number will go down. If a unit that is out of supply gets put back in supply, it will NOT immediately regain the 30 day supply, it will have to wait until enough supplies are shipped from home to build back up to the 30 day amount that it would normally carry with it. You can see this a few ways:

1) when you place a unit on the map from production, it will magically add 30 days worth of supply to whichever province you placed it in. (place it in an unsupplied province and check supply mode)

2) If a unit is out of supply at a naval base, transport an identical but fully supplied unit to the naval base province. The supply in that province will go up with the supply from the new unit. Now, if you transport the original out of supply unit to a different province, it will TAKE the 30 day supply with it, leaving the new, originally fully supplied unit with no supply.

 

[Modestus]

2) If a unit is out of supply at a naval base, transport an identical but fully supplied unit to the naval base province. The supply in that province will go up with the supply from the new unit. Now, if you transport the original out of supply unit to a different province, it will TAKE the 30 day supply with it, leaving the new, originally fully supplied unit with no supply.

That is a little odd would it not be a lot wiser for every unit to have its own 30 days supply (a fuel tank of supplies) that gets refilled when you are stationary and depleted when you move.