Miral said:
And so begins the in-fighting over the scraps, though the British clearly have the upper hand having been the main effort in the advance.
Quite. The British will not necessarily have to surrender what they occupy and with more troops on location than other powers, should have the right to dictate terms.
Vincent Julien said:
Good luck on that one. I'm sure the French will find it an emimnently sensible approach.
The French rejoinder is that the Allied war effort should be regarded as a whole, and that efforts in one theatre should be rewarded by gains in another.
Vincent Julien said:
Well, if you take Constantinople, the Anatolian coast, and Cilicia - which should not be a great problem with the Turks in the shape they are - then I think you'll be in a relatively strong position.
What's the Ottoman navy like at the moment? Indeed, is it yet living?
P.S, please please please give Thrace to the Greeks, even if Constantinople is ultimately filched for the Evil Empire.
The Ottoman Empire's navy has been progressively destroyed during the years of warfare in episodes that I considered too insignificant to chronicle. All that needs to be known in the context of operations against the Dardanelles in 1917 is that it is no match for the armada assembled under Beatty.
Curzon will want to keep his options open surrounding the future of Constantinople and Thrace if the operation is successful and the Straits occupied, although I think that it might be safe to say that the chance of it becoming Russian are diminishing...
Internationalisation? American? Greek? British? Ottoman? Hmm..
Lord E said:
Splendid update Allenby. Great to see Curzon able to make a much better declaration than in real history, hopefully the Middle East won’t be such a trouble area in this timeline, especially if the British are able to keep it under control.
I think a second Gallipoli operation is a very bold choice, but seeing as this time it is Allenby and Beatty that are going to command I have great faith in the Allied commanders, and I am sure they can succeed where people have failed before them. I trust that Allenby will not let us down
Can’t wait to see a successful attack.
They can study the two amphibious operations launched in 1915 that were spectacular, albeit brief, failures.
Curzon may have made what is regarded here as a better declaration, but he would still curse the fact that his Cabinet colleagues forced him into it in the first place. Of course, it was not worth breaking up the government for the purpose of opposing the scheme.
Sir Humphrey said:
Great update. Looks like the Middle East could be very different, or perhaps it could emerge as totally stuffed up in RL. That remains to be seen, and for that matter the reading of the tea leaves will have to be read.
Placing Beatty in charge of the naval side of things? Would that not be the same as asking a jockey to ride a bullock roughshod?
:rofl:
Arguably so, although it has obviously been decided by the government that the scheme of forcing the Dardanelles requires a naval commander of pluck and daring instead of a man who will tentatively probe and go nowhere.
El Pip said:
He's a hero of the navy, who else would you send?
Well Jellicoe obviously but he needs to stay with the Grand Fleet to keep an eye on the North Sea and ze Germanz Navy (whats left of it ).
No I think Beatty will do just fine, an operation where speed and surprise are important is right up his street. Impetuousness not studied caution are required here!
Quite so, Pip - especially when the British have such a preponderance of capital ships and the availability of French and Greek vessels to use first if operational necessity requires it.
Jellicoe, having won his plaudits, is now in charge of what could best be regarded as an observation force.
Lord_Robertus said:
Wow, looks like the operation is being given a lot of might. Forward Allenby and Beatty to victory!
(I just pray those Dreadnoughts don't hit mines and sink....)
Considering how quickly naval technology is bounding forward, some of the best dreadnoughts in Beatty's fleet might well be obsolete in a few years...
The most precious resource is most likely to be the men manning the vessels as opposed to the ships themselves.
VILenin said:
Interesting update, Allenby. Those are three mighty concepts for Curzon to integrate into a single sentence; I rather suspect they will coexist less peacefully in reality.
I see little chance of Turkey withstanding the forces arranged against her. I do forsee, however, some diplomatically hurt feelings when Britain changes the peace.
Y'know the peace agreement might not change much at all from how it has been projected in Allied agreements - after all, Lloyd George comes from the Gladstonian tradition of hoping to spite the unspeakable Turk at every opportunity.
Whether Palestine shall be a war-torn nightmare or a beacon of civilisation in the future is something that I have not quite decided yet.
VILenin said:
Very good update, Allenby! I hope the Ottoman Empire does not end up going the way of A-H in OTL, fracturing into multiple weak successor states that just invite someone to gobble them up. Hopefully your pigheaded "allies" will, in time, bow to Britain's superior dictates for peace. And I second VJ on the matter of Thrace - give it to the Greeks! Russia's claims on Constantinople might prevent the justful restoration of that city to Greece, but then again, if they collapse in the intervening months then their claims can be safely ignored.
Thank you!
Another Hellenophile! No doubt hoping to see Adrianoúpoli and Konstantinoúpoli on the map of the Near East soon enough.
Then of course, there is Smyrna, which has a big Greek population - but giving that to Venizelos would begin to violate the integrity of Anatolia. A complex set of questions with no easy answers.
