1.5 Stopping the Big Blue Blob

[Iamdead7]

Austria game with little to no direct conquesting cause of the AE, eventual goal of uniting the HRE somehow.

France is hard to stop as is, but with -100 Great Power Modifier, you can only pull in so many allies, and a France/Bohemia alliance completely wrecked an alliance of Castille with PU Aragon, me with PU Hungary, Milan, Naples and several HRE states. In addition, England is losing the isles to Scotland, so even without the -100 modifier I'm not sure I could actually stop them. How do I defeat the Big Blue Blob?! The several other games I've played in 1.5 have seen France expand pretty much unstopped as well, though I was in less of a position in them to do anything about it. I also forgot to mention that France controls Ireland as well O_O

 

[sigeena]

Once HRE passes the 6th reform, you can go on a vassalisation spree within the HRE. And with the 7th reform, the HRE can wipe France easily.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Gouge ahead-of-years in military inefficiently and hit them at a break point such as tech 12.

It's not unlike how luck of the Irish is very doable if you go in with tech 5 longbows + Scotland while England is even a little sapped. Techs > ideas, especially early.

Here are some major break points:

Unit:

Tech 10: 11 pips over 7.
Tech 12: 21 pips over 11 (this is completely, utterly ridiculous, and it's in Indian/Chinese/Ottoman also. Always looks to abuse tech 12 1st if possible).
Tech 13: Chambered demi cannons are so much better than previous artillery that they merit inclusion.
Tech 19: 28 over 23
Techs 26, 29, and 30 all have big spikes for western also.

Most military techs are pretty powerful, giving you width, tactics, and bonuses to shock and fire. Very few of them stand out particularly. Generally 2 techs is a pretty serious advantage such that your opponent would need a significant numerical advantage to win.

By far, the most overwhelming break point comes at 12 though. That jump is so enormous that if an Indian or Chinese group nation gouges military tech and gets there first, engaging them with tech 11 and military ideas will *still* get you your pants pulled down (even against Chinese, you'd be 11 pips tops against 18). If you need the oomph to tackle France, and can't set it up sooner, that's the time. Somewhat oddly, Muslim is unique in the "above Nomad" category in that they *don't* get that super unit at 12, for whatever reason. It makes them worse than Indian/Chinese in many cases IMO.

 

[pkderek]

Austria game with little to no direct conquesting cause of the AE, eventual goal of uniting the HRE somehow.

AE is hardly as strong as you all sensationalize, does not stop me from conquesting like I always have and exerting influence to 1/2 the HRE by 1500. Hungary and Eastern on the whole is not something you can count on, they're only good for siege fodder. You could try allying Poland if it has a PU with Lithuania, but be forewarned as they just act like a bigger Hungary; lots of worthless units that will get shredded by France.

What's your Burgundy situation? Did you inherit or PU them? Or are they still alive? Did BBB eat them? If you let that happen there is literally nothing stopping them now. Burgundy + vassal spam can easily match France, throw in your lot and you will win every time.

Adding on above post, tech 5 and tech 7 are pretty good to fight as well. New units are usually better (except Galloghsuck) and level 7 cannons are extremely unappreciated. Sure they aren't that great yet but having more things doing damage in Tirol or Sundgau is extremely important for winning a battle. You'll be surprised how fast they will die. Just don't go on the offensive in bad terrain. One bad battle can cost you not just the war but the game.

 

[Asturiano]

Austria game with little to no direct conquesting cause of the AE, eventual goal of uniting the HRE somehow.

AE is not that bad, do some conquesting and give the BBB some black eyes. It will fall eventually if you are playing as Austria. You should join Burgundy or Castilla against France. 100 years and a few wars and BBB is just a small blue patch.

Amusingly it will be as aggressive and arrogant as ever. Cute really.

 

[AnguyTheArcher]

Use AE and coalitions to your advantage. You can also guarantee Burgundy. France will expand, which means likely coalition of Burgundy, England, Castile, Aragon. I played as England (without continental holdings) and they declared on Provence and took just Barois, Maine and Anjou. The resulting coalition of me, Burgundy, Castile and my ally Portugal wrecked the France totally. After that Aragon jumped on them and their situation is so dire, that now I'm planning war against Burgundy - to maintain balance of power and force them to give some French cores back.

 

[Iamdead7]

France got Wars of Religion event due to half their provinces going protestant, and after 20 years of rebels, Spain and I dogpiled onto them semi successfully. Crazy that one event basically saved us all from being overrun this game.

 

[Linx MP]

In my experience the trick to stopping France is to cripple them early. Taking a number of rich provinces either by releasing, for instance, Champagne or taking the provinces for yourself very early keeps France below their critical mass and stops them from ever blobbing.

 

[AurochsAway]

In the early game, every single French province can be released bar Isle-de-France. As Austria you can just diplovassalise (almost) everything France spews out.

 

[delpiero1234]

Last night I fought my first war in my current Savoy game against France. France was allied to Hungary and Denmark, which inherited Norway and Sweden, and I was allied to Bavaria, Castile (+Aragon in PU) Bohemia and Trier. The could have went better but I managed to kill many French in the mountainous border between France and Aragon. At the end I only managed to force-release Berry but the next war is coming for sure : -)

So how do you beat France in 1.5?
1. You and your allies should have an the same size of the one of the French and its allies.
2. Split your stacks in the Mountains near Aragon (best place to defend is the province Bearn? in my opinion)
3. Have a general with at least shock 4 (better shock 6)
4. Once the French attack one of your stacks in the mountains send all your other stacks to that province (they should all arrive in Bearn within 15-20 days)
5. Watch the French army get slaughtered by terrain penalties
6. Besiege the Provinces with terrain penalties
7. Once the French forces reunite defend again in the mountains and watch them get slaughtered.
8. Release as many nations from France as you can
9. Wait until the Truce expires and attack them again. Proceed with step 1

Very important is that you attack France before other nations' cores expire. You want to release these nations and diplo-vssalize them. You could also take for example one province of Toulouse and release Toulouse as your vassal and in the next war you demand that France returns Toulouse's other cores.