(1.31.4) High AE for retaking cores in a defensive conquest war

[Hypnotoad]

Hi,

I started a fresh Byzantium campain in 1.31.4 (beta) but this probably applies to 1.31 in general. I wasn't sure if i should bug this or if it's WAD in the new expansion,
but as you can see in the screenshot i will get 84 AE for demanding my cores back from the Ottomans. This was a war they started with conquest CB.
This is insanely high AE and it never used to give such high numbers for demanding back cores.

Anyone else also experience this?

 

[Hypnotoad]

Just to add to this post. I also have 100 spy network on the Ottomans, which means -10% AE, so in reality the AE is higher.

 

[fleetothemoon]

This is pretty standard. As far as I remember, defensive wars has never given you a discount on retaking cores since EU3. This is why when playing countries like France, you are better off declaring a Reconquest War than waiting for the Surrender of Maine event, even though the latter being a defensive war, is pretty much almost impossible to lose. In other words, you taking those land will give about the same amount of AE as if it was a normal conquest war... and naturally, you will accumulate the most AE from the nation you are taking those land from.

If you want to avoid AE, then you should take less land and retake them via a reconquest war later.

Personally, I wouldn't be bothered by this at all. What is Ottoman going to do? Form a solo coalition against you?

 

[namewhichisnottakenyet]

This is pretty standard. As far as I remember, defensive wars has never given you a discount on retaking cores since EU3. This is why when playing countries like France, you are better off declaring a Reconquest War than waiting for the Surrender of Maine event, even though the latter being a defensive war, is pretty much almost impossible to lose.

If you want to avoid AE, then you should take less land and retake them via a reconquest war later.

Personally, I wouldn't be bothered by this at all. What is Ottoman going to do? Form a coalition by themself against you?

Or, since you don't get AE reduction for reconquering your cores this way anyway, take non-cores, release Bulgaria and Eretna as vassals from a single core, secure a strait over the Bosphorus and utterly destroy the Ottomans in an offensive reconquest war next time.

 

[Hypnotoad]

Exactly, it didn't bother me, i just took the land anyway. But i'm pretty sure there should be a discount for taking cores, even in defensive conquest wars.

 

[fleetothemoon]

Exactly, it didn't bother me, i just took the land anyway. But i'm pretty sure there should be a discount for taking cores, even in defensive conquest wars.

I think there should be too. Or even better, give a Stellaris-system where defender can select the CB they want... but that would probably require redesigning the entire cb system.

 

[Livigy]

You do get a discount for ae in a defensive war so it is still good to take land, just not your cores. A reconquest war is 25% ae for your cores where a defensive war is something like 75% of normal ae.

 

[TeutonicTortoise]

Exactly, it didn't bother me, i just took the land anyway. But i'm pretty sure there should be a discount for taking cores, even in defensive conquest wars.

The discount is purely down to the war type. If ottos declared a reconquest on you then lost you can use their CB against them for reduced AE and no diplo points. This is the same reason why if a player is France they should always declare their own offensive war on England and not use the maine war since there England declares a restore union war on your so when they lose and you try to take your cores its not reduced

 

[Oglesby]

I am curious if you used cede or return core? I remember seeing differences depending on which I used in some of my wars.

 

[Godd_Howard]

Retaking core land should be the same AE and warscore cost for defensive wars.

 

[Oglesby]

Retaking core land should be the same AE and warscore cost for defensive wars.

as...
(you didn't finish your thought)

 

[Godd_Howard]

as...
(you didn't finish your thought)

as with offensive wars. I had it in there but then I edited it out with something else for some reason :/

 

[RMS Oceanic]

Retaking core land should be the same AE and warscore cost for defensive wars.

Because it's a conquest war, that's the costs you'd encur even if you're the one who attacked with a Conquest CB. It needs to explicitly be a reconquest war to benefit from the reduced AE.

In fact there's always been a little annoyance I had that one can't combine both a conquest and reconquest war. In Reconquest, even if you have a claim on the province, taking it costs diplo points. I'd love some form of both, so you can feed a vassal its cores while also taking some land for yourself.

 

[Oglesby]

as with offensive wars. I had it in there but then I edited it out with something else for some reason :/

'offensive war' too vague...

It is currently the same as an offensive conquest war.

 

[lambda x.x]

Also keep in mind that the AE that gets displayed in peace deals is now the "max AE gain" whereas before it was the "base AE," so when you say "compared to before," if you are referring to pre 1.31 patches, then that's a major factor to consider.

 

[Hypnotoad]

Also keep in mind that the AE that gets displayed in peace deals is now the "max AE gain" whereas before it was the "base AE," so when you say "compared to before," if you are referring to pre 1.31 patches, then that's a major factor to consider.

Thanks, this is what i too realised after a while playing the latest patch.

 

[Manwe_Sulimo]

Also keep in mind that the AE that gets displayed in peace deals is now the "max AE gain" whereas before it was the "base AE," so when you say "compared to before," if you are referring to pre 1.31 patches, then that's a major factor to consider.

So what does the difference mean?

 

[lambda x.x]

So what does the difference mean?

Relations - Europa Universalis 4 Wiki

eu4.paradoxwikis.com

Was accurate as of 1.30. I personally believe something changed in 1.31 which made AE more localized (that is, less AE to nations who are super far) -- maybe the distance factor cap changed (used to cap at 500 distance, that is, 500 distance got same AE as 1000 distance), but it should at the very least be close to accurate for 1.31.

The highest AE (usually on the nation you're taking land from, but not always, for example due to culture) is almost always higher than the base AE.

 

[Manwe_Sulimo]

Interesting, if that means that its less likely to get a global Sunni coalition from the Maghreb to Malaysia by taking some land in Africa I would be very happy about it, because that is so ridiculous.

 

[alexandereuiv]

Ofcourse you get high AE. Otto used conquest CB, not re-conquest CB.