1.16: The Patch That Destroyed Russian Culture

[Lamahorse]

A lot of Russia Stronk. This culture change is a secret buff to the Russian region as any prospective conqueror is going to have problems getting all these cultures accepted. If German, French or Italian can be split this way, why shouldn't Russian?

 

[DanubianCossak]

A lot of Russia Stronk. This culture change is a secret buff to the Russian region as any prospective conqueror is going to have problems getting all these cultures accepted. If German, French or Italian can be split this way, why shouldn't Russian?

Thats a pretty good argument imo.

 

[DicRoNero]

I was quite surprised to see that, too.

It makes about as much sense as thinking that Russian military of the Imperial period was all about drowning the enemy in the bodies of your infantry. But that's what we have in ours NIs and we have to play with that in mind. Same gonna happen with culture.

Speaking from a pure gameplay perspective, though, for me that change means just few more cheap provinces to culture convert, as I obviously won't tolerate "Novgorodian" or "Ryazanian" culture nonsense, just like I don't tolerate "Belorussian" or "Ruthenian". And I'm entitled to my own views. As I see it, the only difference between Muscovy and Novgorod in "culture" of the relevant timeframe is that Novgorodian lands lay further to the north and were thus less affected by the invasion of the Tatar barbarians 200 year prior the game events. Hardly a solid justification to stick to a theory of significant cultural difference.

 

[Omegador]

A lot of Russia Stronk. This culture change is a secret buff to the Russian region as any prospective conqueror is going to have problems getting all these cultures accepted. If German, French or Italian can be split this way, why shouldn't Russian?

Joining Turko-Semitic rage thread, because that's probably more of an eyesore now that I think about it.
Ryazanian is just gross. Give more to Novgorodian and Uralic, keep Moscovite large, remove Ryazan culture.

 

[Omegador]

I was quite surprised to see that, too.

It makes about as much sense as thinking that Russian military of the Imperial period was all about drowning the enemy in the bodies of your infantry. But that's what we have in ours NIs and we have to play with that in mind. Same gonna happen with culture.

Speaking from a pure gameplay perspective, though, for me that changes means just few more cheap provinces to culture convert, as I obviously won't tolerate "Novgorodian" or "Ryazanian" culture nonsense, just like I don't tolerate "Belorussian" or "Ruthenian". And I'm entitled to my own views. As I see it, the only difference between Muscovy and Novgorod in "culture" of the relevant timeframe is that Novgorodian lands lay further to the north and were thus less affected by the invasion of the Tatar barbarians 200 year prior the game events. Hardly a solid justification to stick to a theory of significant cultural difference.

Agreed. Russia had 200k troops during Napoleonic invasion, and Napoleon&Friends had over 700k. In fact, Russia relied on mercenaries for quite a while before getting solid standing armies. It's China that really should have all the quantity ideas, as their troops are usually quite crappy in this era. I'm not upset. Just stereotypical. And, offtopic.

 

[DicRoNero]

Also, forming a major European tag (Russia, Germany, Italy) should instantly change your main culture to the one linked to your tag, and you should be given a bonus for culture conversion of the rest of the cultures within your Culture Union, since it's what more or less happened historically. Muscovite culture hardy makes sense in 18th century, you know.

Just saying.

 

[Kiyant]

Atleast Muscovite culture isnt in the Tatar group..........
(Turkish in Arabic group is dumb)

 

[funguide]

This is like the second thread today about Russian culture, stop this. Russian culture will get a russian tag probably when you form Russia; just like Hindustan gets Hindvi when you form Hindustan. Before you form Russia they are splitting up the culture in to the various groups that the OP says were "here and there" and non-existent; please we don't need nationalistic language on this forum. No one is mucking the name of Russia by simply changing the tags in a game.

 

[Shatterfury]

Novgorodian dialect/language was a real thing about Ryazanian I don`t know if it should or should not be in game.

If Ryazanian is actually meant to represent local differences than it`s welcome.

All our resident sovietlings need to grasp the fact that as long as all those new groups are part of the same culture group there is no such thing as a nerf.

I bet that Muscovy starts with Ryazanian as accepted given the amount of territory it has and once they swallow Novgorod their subculture will become accepted.

 

[rayyuri]

I don't know. But this has been their way in splitting French, Italian and Chinese cultures...

 

[AluminumSoldier]

Culture is a nebulous concept in this game to being with. While there are no historical reasons for this change, I think the gameplay reasons are sufficient. That said, I'm sure I'd be just as frustrated as OP is if I was Russian.

Also, the humor in the OP was really obvious. Shame on y'all for not recognizing it and jumping to the "crazy Russian nationalist" defense immediately.

 

[Oldpara]

Nevertheless. Also historically I do not see your problem. They just display regional flavours now.

I don't think that "regional flavour" was something admired in Russia at any time in history

(in before: its a joke! )

 

[Shatterfury]

I don't think that "regional flavour" was something admired in Russia at any time in history

(in before: its a joke! )

In Soviet Russia joke makes you.

Da Comrade ?

 

[Omegador]

Culture is a nebulous concept in this game to being with. While there are no historical reasons for this change, I think the gameplay reasons are sufficient. That said, I'm sure I'd be just as frustrated as OP is if I was Russian.

Also, the humor in the OP was really obvious. Shame on y'all for not recognizing it and jumping to the "crazy Russian nationalist" defense immediately.

Can't wait to see Ryazanite nationalists rising up in Smolensk!

 

[frolix42]

If one were a Russian Nationalist, wouldn't they tend to consider Belorussian and Ruthenian to be subsets of "Russian" culture? Therefore to have a specific culture named "Russian" implies that Ruthenian and Belorussian are not Russian.

 

[giant_sloth]

I like how Ruthenian is the only "Russian" culture now
Well, besides ByeloRUSSIAN!

 

[Omegador]

I like how Ruthenian is the only "Russian" culture now
Well, besides ByeloRUSSIAN!

That's why Ruthenian should become Kievan, Volhinyan, and Zaporozhian...

 

[Ternega]

That's why Ruthenian should become Kievan, Volhinyan, and Zaporozhian...

Remember, gameplay would suffer from that. Making Ruthenia impossible to accept isn't a good thing, since it would nerf Lithuania, and consequently Poland, thus sending Russia/Ottomans on a rampage in Eastern Europe.

 

[Omegador]

Remember, gameplay would suffer from that. Making Ruthenia impossible to accept isn't a good thing, since it would nerf Lithuania, and consequently Poland, thus sending Russia/Ottomans on a rampage in Eastern Europe.

That's exactly why Zaporozhian Cossacks rebelled. Lithuania shouldn't have a problem. PLC might, if they fail to take Humanist ideas. Unfortunately, Kiev is main tag for Ruthenian, causing Zaporozhian cores to disappear before 1650's and therefore preventing Zaporozhie from ever breaking off without Ruthenian separatists creating Kiev cores.

 

[Ternega]

That's exactly why Zaporozhian Cossacks rebelled. Lithuania shouldn't have a problem. PLC might, if they fail to take Humanist ideas. Unfortunately, Kiev is main tag for Ruthenian, causing Zaporozhian cores to disappear before 1650's and therefore preventing Zaporozhie from ever breaking off without Ruthenian separatists creating Kiev cores.

Well Cossack rebellion can happen if polish Cossack estate rebels, for good or ill game cant perfectly simulate history and principality sized cultures aren't really logical from either gameplay (too small) or historical (too similar compared to other cultural splits) standpoints. If they wanted historical Zaporozhian rebelion they could have achieved it with events (and I'm not sure if they exist or not).