[1.14.2, no Cossacks, RNW] - Did Australia/NZ stop being a colonial region? If so, why?

[pommiebastard]

Been playing with the Random New World (which, for all its quirks, is a HUGE improvement on what we had before), and in a current game I've been busily colonising my home proto-continent as a High American Nahuatl Empire.

So, I thought, let's get into the Asian side of things, and the closest jumping-off point was through New Zealand.

I've completed 5 Cores there, but no sign of a Colonial Nation forming. Then I look carefully at the remaining provinces in NZ (and a bunch in Australia) and none of them show the "Colonial Australia" notification, whereas all the various fantasy regions in the New World do show which colonial region they're in.

Hmm, thinks I, that's strange. Must have been switched to no longer be colonial. Oh well, I'll turn them into a Trade Company then.

Err, Nope. No option to make a Trade Company. So I'm just stuck with a bunch of 75% autonomy provinces, which I can't do anything much with.

Firstly, is this working as designed, or is it a bug/glitch?

Second, if it is working as designed, what was the reasoning for it?

Third, if it is going to be left this way, could it please be changed so that Aus/NZ can form a Trade Company, if they aren't a Colonial Region?

Otherwise, it just feels like that whole area got relegated to "junk" status.

 

[Peachrocks]

I formed a colony of Australia with Morocco, so I suspect certain continents or tech groups can't do it... or something... or it's a bug. You can never really know why something doesn't function like it used to.

 

[pommiebastard]

@Peachrocks - interesting - this is with 1.14.2, yes? Did you have RNW active? Wondering if it's something to do with how the dynamically generated colonial regions in that are handled that it loses the only non-New World colonial region....

 

[Cathal341]

There's probably a mix of things going on there, like bugs and wierd mechanics.

 

[gdj]

It´s not a bug, it´s a documented design glitch (so to speak). As of 1.14. tags in America are blocked from forming CN in America, north and south. It was possible to do so before under vertain circumstances.

It had the (unintended?) side effect that american tags cannot form any CN, not even in Australia. Apparently this was taken over in RNW settings as well.

I´m sure it will be patched out with next hotfix.

 

[Wizzington]

This is basically WAD, if your capital is in a colonial region you can't form CNs, which is supposed to stop dumb stuff like Colombian Colombia.

As there's currently no real way of distinguishing 'Australia is a different continent from North America, but so is South America' it also stops CNs in Australia. It's probably not ideal, but I also don't think it's a big deal at all.

 

[Cathal341]

This is basically WAD, if your capital is in a colonial region you can't form CNs, which is supposed to stop dumb stuff like Colombian Colombia.

As there's currently no real way of distinguishing 'Australia is a different continent from North America, but so is South America' it also stops CNs in Australia. It's probably not ideal, but I also don't think it's a big deal at all.

A possibile solution would be to remove the Austrailian Coloinal region and have it like the rest of Asia/Africa as a Trade Company.

 

[PhroX]

This is basically WAD, if your capital is in a colonial region you can't form CNs, which is supposed to stop dumb stuff like Colombian Colombia.

As there's currently no real way of distinguishing 'Australia is a different continent from North America, but so is South America' it also stops CNs in Australia. It's probably not ideal, but I also don't think it's a big deal at all.

I have to admit, I dislike this change and not just because of Australia. I had a RWN game where I was playing Navarra and relocated to a large continent in the north west, and there were a whole bunch of smaller islands in the south and east, including one I'd colonised as a stepping stone to my eventual homeland. It would've been perfect for me to set up a colonial nation in those islands (from a roleplay/immersion perspective), as they were a considerable distance from my continent, and thus it makes sense for them to be administered locally, but of course, as I had my capital in the new world, I couldn't....

 

[gdj]

A possibile solution would be to remove the Austrailian Coloinal region and have it like the rest of Asia/Africa as a Trade Company.

No way. Sorry, but that´s imo not even worth a discussion considering how trade companies are modelled, and the fact that it is only available for western tech nations for no reason whatsoever.

 

[tkamin]

This is basically WAD, if your capital is in a colonial region you can't form CNs, which is supposed to stop dumb stuff like Colombian Colombia.

As there's currently no real way of distinguishing 'Australia is a different continent from North America, but so is South America' it also stops CNs in Australia. It's probably not ideal, but I also don't think it's a big deal at all.

Wouldn't solution that will check that you will not be able to form CN if:
1. Your capitial is part of colonial region
2. Your mother colonial region has land connection with the colonial region when your are colonizing (including is the same)
Fix the problem?

 

[Glanzor]

There is a bug in the current version that removes the colonial region from Australia in a RNW.
You cannot create colonial nations in Australia no matter where your capital is, New World or not, in a game that has a RNW.
However, in any game with a standart New World it works fine.
You can check that by looking at rthe colonial region map mode.
Despite what Wiz said, that is not WAD and has been reported and ackowledged as a bug before: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...al-regions-in-old-world.894649/#post-20300770

 

[londoner247]

This is basically WAD, if your capital is in a colonial region you can't form CNs, which is supposed to stop dumb stuff like Colombian Colombia.

As there's currently no real way of distinguishing 'Australia is a different continent from North America, but so is South America' it also stops CNs in Australia. It's probably not ideal, but I also don't think it's a big deal at all.

I thought it had been confirmed elsewhere, Wiz, that the script for the Random New World had disable Australia as a Colonial Region so, even if your capital is not in a Colonial Region, a CN will not form there at the moment. Is that correct (and a bug to be fixed)?

 

[Wizzington]

I thought it had been confirmed elsewhere, Wiz, that the script for the Random New World had disable Australia as a Colonial Region so, even if your capital is not in a Colonial Region, a CN will not form there at the moment. Is that correct (and a bug to be fixed)?

If RNW removes australia CN, that's a bug.

 

[londoner247]

If RNW removes australia CN, that's a bug.

I think it is a bug then, at least based on a @LittleFido post on this thread: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...al-regions-in-old-world.894649/#post-20300770

Of course, you have more important things to hotfix right now!

 

[hwoosh]

It's probably not ideal, but I also don't think it's a big deal at all.

It is a big deal.

Or at least, a medium-sized deal. Wouldn't the solution suggested above by @tkamin be a more robust way of handling this, in the long run?

(Especially for modders, who might want to be able to produce worlds with continents whose nations can create colonial subjects in each other. This is strictly impossible under the current system...)

 

[Incompetent]

A possibile solution would be to remove the Austrailian Coloinal region and have it like the rest of Asia/Africa as a Trade Company.

Arguably parts of the Americas (definitely Hudson's Bay, maybe some or all of the Caribbean) would make more sense as trade companies from a historical perspective, but none of this applies to Australia. Given the technology available in the EU4 era, it has no value as a source of trade goods and is purely a settler colony.

 

[IIWW]

If RNW removes australia CN, that's a bug.

Then I look carefully at the remaining provinces in NZ (and a bunch in Australia) and none of them show the "Colonial Australia" notification, whereas all the various fantasy regions in the New World do show which colonial region they're in.

According to this it either removes colonial region from Australia, or it is an intereference bug.

 

[pommiebastard]

This is basically WAD, if your capital is in a colonial region you can't form CNs, which is supposed to stop dumb stuff like Colombian Colombia.

As there's currently no real way of distinguishing 'Australia is a different continent from North America, but so is South America' it also stops CNs in Australia. It's probably not ideal, but I also don't think it's a big deal at all.

Hi Wiz,

I'm curious if being unable to distinguish in this way is definitely the case, just based on my experience with colonising in this new version with RNW.

When doing so within the RNW, all my colonies are treated as "same continent" - I pay Admin to Core them, but they can go down to 0% Local Autonomy. This despite being on separate tiles with open sea between them, separate colonial regions, separate trade nodes, separate hemispheres (from right down south all the way up to north).

When doing so outside the RNW (in NZ), my colonies are treated as "different continent" - they are automatically Cored, but they are limited to the floor of 75% Local Autonomy.

This suggests to me there definitely is a difference that the engine is able to identify, so that it treats them this way. Unless it's a consequence of this possible bug with Australia not being identified as a Colonial Region with RNW enabled - if fixing that means that Aus/NZ are treated like the other colonial regions in the New World (i.e. cost Admin to core, but then can go down to 0% LA), then that would be a good alternative.

It just feels wrong if they can't form a Colonial Nation, can't be added to a Trade Company, and are stuck as overseas provinces with 75% Local Autonomy, without any way to improve the situation.

 

[Pandita]

You shouldn't have to core your colonies...

I also have this precise bug with respect to Australia - my 7 provinces there are all treated as overseas cores of mine (Russia). The only colonial regions are in the RNW.

 

[Ashantai]

Having a nation with a capital in the RNW or America also disables Australia as a colonial region which it shouldn't.