1.09 Wish list

[Yenzen]

- Disallowing plot wars in medium CA would absolutely murder gameplay as a vassal. Do you think even centralized kingdoms and empires were free of internal strife between the lower vassals?
- Councilors ability are factored directly into state score along with the ruler. The spouse is halved. It entirely possible for a ruler to remain a bachelor and lead well.
- Religion is a factor in how much the other faction likes you. However keep in mind that catholic-muslim marriages were not unheard of. I can agree that the marriage game might be good if it was a bit tougher, I just fear it'd screw with the AI (that's already much too glad about lowborns)
- It now is, I believe, as of 1,08 a jailed character will convert. A zealous character dislikes you enough not to be willing to convert even with gifts.

- Too many limitations and difference between the muslims and they will cease being a threat alltogether, which isn't a good gameplay goal. But alright, the crazy invasions of Greece and Italy should not just happen 25-50 years into the game.
- More titles existing was also true of the rest of the world.

- About the norse: It's just that.. they get wiped out very quickly in most games.

- An prestige hit wont stop the AI. Maybe just making it mechanically impossible for the AI to do it and give players a penalty. The AI should be forced to only use the "arrange marriage" list a player sees, since they at least tend to be within 2 levels of the seeker.

 

[BritNavFan]

- Disallowing plot wars in medium CA would absolutely murder gameplay as a vassal. Do you think even centralized kingdoms and empires were free of internal strife between the lower vassals?

I would be fine with it "murdering" gameplay as a vassal, if it did that, which it doesn't. I want to get distinctive games, different playing experiences, if I play as a ruler of a large country vs. playing as a ruler of a small country vs. playing as a vassal in a centralized state vs. playing as a vassal in a decentralized state. And I'd be totally OK with allowing these wars or not being an option. But it's not an option, the stupidity is forced on you if you want to play the game, and if there's a way to mod it out, that way's not obvious at all.

While there was internal strife, the ruler wasn't magically incapable of intervening. But yeah, you feel that it's realistic for a subordinate ruler in the Byzantine Empire to blind the Empress, and the Emperor and his guards and his troops literally couldn't do anything about it because of some magical force field protecting the vassal's troops. Understood.

- Councilors ability are factored directly into state score along with the ruler. The spouse is halved. It entirely possible for a ruler to remain a bachelor and lead well.

It's ALWAYS badly sub-optimal to not get your ruler married. But go ahead, leave your ruler unmarried in a MP game if it's such a viable option.

- Religion is a factor in how much the other faction likes you. However keep in mind that catholic-muslim marriages were not unheard of. I can agree that the marriage game might be good if it was a bit tougher, I just fear it'd screw with the AI (that's already much too glad about lowborns)

I'm well aware that Christian-Muslim marriages, and Christian-Pagan marriages, and Muslim-Pagan marriages all existed in this period. But they weren't quite as trivial to arrange as they are in the game. And the AI already messes it up: the AI doesn't seem to consider Christian-Muslim marriages at all (maybe it does but I haven't seen it), whereas as a Byzantine player it's trivially easy to forge an alliance with the Fatimids by marrying an Imperial Princess to their heir, a strategy that the AI doesn't seem to consider and that the real-life Byzantines didn't consider until they were in dire straights in the 14th Century.

- It now is, I believe, as of 1,08 a jailed character will convert. A zealous character dislikes you enough not to be willing to convert even with gifts.

Sure, and that could be improved further. A cynical character might change without gifts, or even just by seeing which way the wind is blowing before they're asked to convert. The zealous characters of the period shouldn't convert even if jailed.

- More titles existing was also true of the rest of the world.

Not to nearly the same extent as in the African areas. Greece alone has more titles than everything from Aswan to the Horn of Africa.

- About the norse: It's just that.. they get wiped out very quickly in most games.

And that you can't play as them, so fluff that's only visible to a player playing as the Norse can't be a very high priority. But it's not a difficult improvement to make, either.

 

[Sleight of Hand]

Game mechanics

• The single most annoying thing for me: if you are at medium Crown Law or above, this spam of absurd private wars among your nobles shouldn’t exist. It’s bizarre. It’s very unrealistic. The whole point of the feudal system was that the liege was obliged to come to their vassal’s aid, so what’s this magical force preventing the liege from intervening? Just make it so that the plots that result in those private wars don't trigger, or get cancelled, if the realm is at medium+ Crown Law. Or whatever. At least make it easily moddable.
• At the moment, your ruler's wife gives you bonuses that AFAIK you can't get any other way. You should be able to select a councilor to give you these bonuses (whether your ruler has a wife or not), if you wish. Historically there were rulers who were lifelong bachelors yet very competent (e.g. Emperor Basil II). This should be possible in-game.
• Religion should be a factor in arranging marriages.
• Distance should be a factor in arranging marriages.
• A character’s characteristics should influence their willingness to change religion. Being jailed should be one more modifier in that situation.

History and politics

• The Baqt (the peace treaty between the Muslims of Egypt and the Christians of Nubia) should be represented. An easy way to do this would be to.disallow the “Holy War” CB between Muslims and Miaphysites.
• Nerf the Fatimids. The "Muslim Invasion" CB should be harder to use as well (not necessarily cost more, but have more restrictions on that use.) As far as I can tell, the historical "Muslim Invasions" happened when the invaded were in chaos because they couldn't get themselves organized. There was nothing special about the Seljuks' CB at Manzikert, and if the Byzantines had honoured the peace treaty Romanos accepted, Manzikert would not have been a history-changer the way it was. But instead, the Byzantines refused to honour the peace treaty, and at the same time spent more effort on in-fighting than they did on fighting the Seljuks. This was good fortune for the Turks, but it wasn't something they could have planned.
• The Sunnis and the Shi’ites should see each other as heretics.
• Pagans who are horse nomads, such as the Cumans, shouldn’t get the “warrior cult” building. The Cumans had armies of cavalry, not infantry.
• Tengri and African pagans should have multiple wives.
• Each of western and eastern Africa could use several more provinces. These were large areas with a lot of subject nobles in each, not just a few duchies’ worth.

Fluff

• Norse pagans should worship several gods, say Odin, Thor, Frey, and Freyja, rather than two versions each of Odin and Thor. Their “holy book” should be the Poetic Edda, not the Sagas. Making the Sagas a “holy book” is like making the Bayeux Tapestry a holy book.
• If a woman who is not of Greek culture becomes Basilissa, the player should have the option to rename her, because the Byzantines did that.

+1

Paradox, please listen to this man!

 

[liamgamer55]

Retinue and faction balancing

Fixed succession laws

 

[hannibal_barca]

Add frontage or further tweak the combat further

 

[Talq]

I would be fine with it "murdering" gameplay as a vassal, if it did that, which it doesn't. I want to get distinctive games, different playing experiences, if I play as a ruler of a large country vs. playing as a ruler of a small country vs. playing as a vassal in a centralized state vs. playing as a vassal in a decentralized state. And I'd be totally OK with allowing these wars or not being an option. But it's not an option, the stupidity is forced on you if you want to play the game, and if there's a way to mod it out, that way's not obvious at all.

While there was internal strife, the ruler wasn't magically incapable of intervening. But yeah, you feel that it's realistic for a subordinate ruler in the Byzantine Empire to blind the Empress, and the Emperor and his guards and his troops literally couldn't do anything about it because of some magical force field protecting the vassal's troops. Understood.

QFT. Leaving aside the stupidity of private wars at high crown authority, that you:
a) can have close relatives (or even good councillors) imprisoned, demoted or killed, and
b) can't change succession laws,
because a couple of pissant vassals are fighting each other AND YOU CAN'T INTERVENE is just silly.

The succession laws bit is the most annoying, because the problem isn't apparent until 50 years into the game ('oh you didn't realise, you're meant to sit at 10 counties or engage in some bizarre workarounds or no primogenature for you!')

 

[tompalmer]

Kinsguard, hostages, Monastic orders, cathedrals events

 

[Zmieczemiogniem]

- Trade system with trade goods.
- Naval combat
- Allowing for culturally dependent province+title names.
- Privileges, allow a duke certain privileges such as attacking a foreign power or have his titles inherited by foreigners, or guarantee a title to always stay within a certain dynasty. Relations bonus as a result.
- Tyranny, allow a monarch to impose tyranny on his vassals, such as limiting a title to certain religions or cultures, take away the privilege to fight other vassals, etc. Province revolt increase and/or relations malus as a result.

That's all for now.

This.

The bolded ideas are some of the greatest I've ever heard. There should have been a mod for this AT THE LEAST, like yesterday.

 

[Gowain]

I'd really like to see a kidnapping intrigue option. It would give more cloak-and-dagger-minded players increased flexibility in how the game is played.

Oh, and finally implementing a way to get the Pilgrim trait in-game would be pretty cool. It's just sitting there, all lonely-like.

 

[DCyDe]

Naval combat above anything else,

besides: Theocracys/College of Cardinals, Republics, Pagans

 

[Zireael]

QFT. Leaving aside the stupidity of private wars at high crown authority, that you:
a) can have close relatives (or even good councillors) imprisoned, demoted or killed, and
b) can't change succession laws,
because a couple of pissant vassals are fighting each other AND YOU CAN'T INTERVENE is just silly.

The succession laws bit is the most annoying, because the problem isn't apparent until 50 years into the game ('oh you didn't realise, you're meant to sit at 10 counties or engage in some bizarre workarounds or no primogenature for you!')

I agree that vassals shouldn't be able to fight in any way under High Crown Authority.

My wishlist for 1.09 will come as soon as I'll dust my old wishlist and update it.

 

[Teutonizer]

Destroing holdings
For example county of Rome, it's sticking with temples because the papacy, and if I become Roman Emperor - it's...annoying

 

[Wallain]

Destroing holdings
For example county of Rome, it's sticking with temples because the papacy, and if I become Roman Emperor - it's...annoying

Or just change them into something else.

 

[Teutonizer]

Or just change them into something else.

Well...in some point I mean it

 

[markmid]

1, Optional HRE Event pack to make it a bit more unpredictable, less blobby, even more fun for players in the HRE as its a popular place to play.
2, Pagan Religious Tweaks or events to wet the appetite for potential Pagan DLC, look how popular the Norse mod is, its in a lot of mods now.
3, A few provinces to the East for a potential DLC so we can follow Alexander a bit further from Greece
4, Could do something more with africa now the sprites are in etc, open up a bit more of the grey.

Any of these I would buy most certainly or enjoy in a patch.

On a side note to the first posts I would call more suggestions respectful not unrespectful , we are here putting our free time into discussing something we enjoy, which means someone's done a great job to get us here.

 

[theKing1988]

Game mechanics

• The single most annoying thing for me: if you are at medium Crown Law or above, this spam of absurd private wars among your nobles shouldn’t exist. It’s bizarre. It’s very unrealistic. The whole point of the feudal system was that the liege was obliged to come to their vassal’s aid, so what’s this magical force preventing the liege from intervening? Just make it so that the plots that result in those private wars don't trigger, or get cancelled, if the realm is at medium+ Crown Law. Or whatever. At least make it easily moddable.
• At the moment, your ruler's wife gives you bonuses that AFAIK you can't get any other way. You should be able to select a councilor to give you these bonuses (whether your ruler has a wife or not), if you wish. Historically there were rulers who were lifelong bachelors yet very competent (e.g. Emperor Basil II). This should be possible in-game.
• Religion should be a factor in arranging marriages.
• Distance should be a factor in arranging marriages.
• A character’s characteristics should influence their willingness to change religion. Being jailed should be one more modifier in that situation.

History and politics

• The Baqt (the peace treaty between the Muslims of Egypt and the Christians of Nubia) should be represented. An easy way to do this would be to.disallow the “Holy War” CB between Muslims and Miaphysites.
• Nerf the Fatimids. The "Muslim Invasion" CB should be harder to use as well (not necessarily cost more, but have more restrictions on that use.) As far as I can tell, the historical "Muslim Invasions" happened when the invaded were in chaos because they couldn't get themselves organized. There was nothing special about the Seljuks' CB at Manzikert, and if the Byzantines had honoured the peace treaty Romanos accepted, Manzikert would not have been a history-changer the way it was. But instead, the Byzantines refused to honour the peace treaty, and at the same time spent more effort on in-fighting than they did on fighting the Seljuks. This was good fortune for the Turks, but it wasn't something they could have planned.
• The Sunnis and the Shi’ites should see each other as heretics.
• Pagans who are horse nomads, such as the Cumans, shouldn’t get the “warrior cult” building. The Cumans had armies of cavalry, not infantry.
• Tengri and African pagans should have multiple wives.
• Each of western and eastern Africa could use several more provinces. These were large areas with a lot of subject nobles in each, not just a few duchies’ worth.

Fluff

• Norse pagans should worship several gods, say Odin, Thor, Frey, and Freyja, rather than two versions each of Odin and Thor. Their “holy book” should be the Poetic Edda, not the Sagas. Making the Sagas a “holy book” is like making the Bayeux Tapestry a holy book.
• If a woman who is not of Greek culture becomes Basilissa, the player should have the option to rename her, because the Byzantines did that.

There should be fewer incentives to marry lowborns. There was nothing in reality comparable to the "Genius" trait: no observable characteristics that said "this commoner's children would be awesome rulers".

This! You are indeed a most genius mano

 

[unmerged(527492)]

Also, an abolish liege title faction would be nice. It would be available at the autonomous vassal crown authority. The AI should join it if they have a relatively similar rank to their liege. So Kings in autonomous vassal Empires should threaten to dissolve the Empire, Dukes in Kingdoms, Counts in Duchies. It's basically a hybrid of lower crown authority and independence factions.

I think it would add a nice possibility of Empire and Kingdom collapse being mirrored by a loss of legal status as a government. If the HRE implodes because of widespread vassal revolt, it makes sense that the resulting independent folk wouldn't recognize the Holy Roman Emperor as a legitimate title anymore.

 

[Hootieleece]

Game mechanics

• The single most annoying thing for me: if you are at medium Crown Law or above, this spam of absurd private wars among your nobles shouldn’t exist. It’s bizarre. It’s very unrealistic. The whole point of the feudal system was that the liege was obliged to come to their vassal’s aid, so what’s this magical force preventing the liege from intervening? Just make it so that the plots that result in those private wars don't trigger, or get cancelled, if the realm is at medium+ Crown Law. Or whatever. At least make it easily moddable.
• At the moment, your ruler's wife gives you bonuses that AFAIK you can't get any other way. You should be able to select a councilor to give you these bonuses (whether your ruler has a wife or not), if you wish. Historically there were rulers who were lifelong bachelors yet very competent (e.g. Emperor Basil II). This should be possible in-game.
• Religion should be a factor in arranging marriages.
• Distance should be a factor in arranging marriages.
• A character’s characteristics should influence their willingness to change religion. Being jailed should be one more modifier in that situation.

History and politics

• The Baqt (the peace treaty between the Muslims of Egypt and the Christians of Nubia) should be represented. An easy way to do this would be to.disallow the “Holy War” CB between Muslims and Miaphysites.
• Nerf the Fatimids. The "Muslim Invasion" CB should be harder to use as well (not necessarily cost more, but have more restrictions on that use.) As far as I can tell, the historical "Muslim Invasions" happened when the invaded were in chaos because they couldn't get themselves organized. There was nothing special about the Seljuks' CB at Manzikert, and if the Byzantines had honoured the peace treaty Romanos accepted, Manzikert would not have been a history-changer the way it was. But instead, the Byzantines refused to honour the peace treaty, and at the same time spent more effort on in-fighting than they did on fighting the Seljuks. This was good fortune for the Turks, but it wasn't something they could have planned.
• The Sunnis and the Shi’ites should see each other as heretics.
• Pagans who are horse nomads, such as the Cumans, shouldn’t get the “warrior cult” building. The Cumans had armies of cavalry, not infantry.
• Tengri and African pagans should have multiple wives.
• Each of western and eastern Africa could use several more provinces. These were large areas with a lot of subject nobles in each, not just a few duchies’ worth.

Fluff

• Norse pagans should worship several gods, say Odin, Thor, Frey, and Freyja, rather than two versions each of Odin and Thor. Their “holy book” should be the Poetic Edda, not the Sagas. Making the Sagas a “holy book” is like making the Bayeux Tapestry a holy book.
• If a woman who is not of Greek culture becomes Basilissa, the player should have the option to rename her, because the Byzantines did that.

There should be fewer incentives to marry lowborns. There was nothing in reality comparable to the "Genius" trait: no observable characteristics that said "this commoner's children would be awesome rulers".

The only thing I would add is OVERHAUL/NERF Retinues:Allow Dukes and above recruit 1 Retinue Unit per Castle in Personal Desmesne.Thus not trivializing Mercenary's and Holy orders by 1200AD.Make the Military Organization Tech like Legalism Tech higher tech level larger Retinue.(level 1=1 per castle,Level 2=1.5,Level 3=2/castle,etc.) and up the costs by 50%.

 

[snoopdogg]

A grant independence option/ offer to transfer vassalage to equal level rulers maybe is about all I can think of. I like my empire pretty and neat.

 

[Zireael]

I'd love regnal names and some sort of AI expansion preference to prevent ahistorical blobbing and cadet branches and the Pope being elected from existing clergy.