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Colossal_Elk

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Hello and welcome to the second 0.2.1 Elder Kings Developer Diary! Last time, we talked about the new Societies and their improvements over the old Guild system. In this entry, we’ll discuss another old feature which has seen significant upgrades: Lycanthropes and Vampires.


In terms of their basic abilities, Lycanthrope and Vampire characters are functionally the same as they have been in the past. Both are much hardier than ordinary mortals and cannot contract diseases, but are driven to prey on others, which can put them in danger quite often. Fortunately for these beings (and not quite as fortunately for their potential foes), they each enjoy an improved Combat Rating, which further increases once their conditions become known and they no longer are forced to suppress some of their abilities.

vytR3T8.jpg


Fort those Known Vampires and Known Lycanthropes (both standard and Benevolent variations), their traits have opinion modifiers so that characters of certain religions will be more tolerant of them, regardless of the outed character’s own religious affiliation.

nUFRJDv.jpg


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On the other hand, Vampire and Lycanthrope characters don’t just answer to other characters. They also answer to the common folk, who tend to be a superstitious and pessimistic lot. Even those rulers who are benevolent and never harm their subjects might eventually be falsely accused of doing something wrong, though a well-placed bribe will make these accusations go away. Otherwise, peasant unrest will simmer for quite some time.

SKZUMPF.jpg


Having a courtier who is known for their vampirism or lycanthropy will likewise generate peasant furor, which can be assuaged by imprisoning the supposed evildoer. You can, of course, leave them be – it’s altogether possible that they didn’t do anything to deserve the accusations they face – though this will, again, leave the commoners agitated.

ZahI3op.jpg


For reasons such as the above, it may not be the best decision to live openly as a Vampire or a Werewolf. Remaining silent is always an option. But this can be a stressful situation, especially for one who feels that he or she is deceiving friends and loved ones about their true nature. On occasion, a character who secretly lives as a lycanthrope or a vampire may get the idea to confess their nature to someone who they trust to keep their condition secret from the public.

WQDyTYL.jpg


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Someone who hears about another character’s vampirism or lycanthropy may simply dismiss the information as a poorly-executed practical joke. They could also take it very seriously; so seriously as to be appalled by the revelation before setting in motion a plan to out their former confidant, which can end very badly for either party.

zcgid02.jpg


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There’s also the possibility that they are not swayed by the news and are understanding of their ally’s condition or may even be interested in being turned as well!

YUh8kJV.jpg


If the character who found out is understanding of their confidant’s supernatural status, it is possible to take a decision to offer to turn them. They may not accept the gift of vampirism or lycanthropy, but it is always possible to make later offers to turn them in case they change their mind.

wjbrjOR.jpg


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Many of the traditional Vampire’s weaknesses (such as their need to regularly feed or lose their sanity) are addressed by Pure-Blooded Vampirism, which is unchanged from its earlier iteration. Lycanthropes now likewise have a means to exert greater control over their condition with some aid from Hircine and the mysterious Glenmoril Wyrd.

atH2RG7.jpg


It is possible that the Harbinger of the Companions receives an unusual plea for help. Accepting this call to arms can lead to the Harbinger being granted lycanthropy with the bonus of full control over their beast form from the moment they are turned, rather than needing to spend years honing their skills.

kLC8b4h.jpg


A greedy Harbinger can keep quiet about this, and a horrified Harbinger can simply end their life. But a Harbinger can also extend this unusual boon to the Circle of Captains.

RPWj5cX.jpg


If this occurs, each Captain has the option to accept or decline; declining does not mean that they lose their Circle rank. In fact, they could even be a future Harbinger. But any Shield-Brother or Shield-Sister who aims to join the Circle after this chain of events will have no choice but to accept the gift of lycanthropy if they wish to advance their career in the Companions.

cq22MtI.jpg


u7giLq5.jpg



Lycanthropy and Vampirism are, ultimately, conditions of Daedric origins. How fitting then, that our next Developer Diary will cover the topic of the Daedric Princes and, more specifically, how they interact with Nirn and its inhabitants.
 
Last edited:

LeSingeAffame

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Very interesting !
Are the different vampiric clans covered, like the Volikhar, the clans of Valenwood (with I think some vampires which can turn into mist ?), the ones in Morrowind, or are they all generic ?
I suppose that having Hircine's Ring will make you able to control your lycantrophy ?
 

Jackcaboose

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I can't wait for the next diary! I've always thought the new mechanics in JD will be interesting for the daedric princes. On topic, however, will there be any vampire/lycanthrope-related societies (other than the mentioned Companions)?
 

Colossal_Elk

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Very interesting !
Are the different vampiric clans covered, like the Volikhar, the clans of Valenwood (with I think some vampires which can turn into mist ?), the ones in Morrowind, or are they all generic ?
I suppose that having Hircine's Ring will make you able to control your lycantrophy ?

That is correct. Hircine's Ring does offer control over lycanthropy.

There are no vampire-specific clans or societies; ultimately it's because a character can only join one society at a time so we thought it made more sense to focus on core societies that everyone (or almost everyone) can be a part of.
 

lunelune2413

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About Daedric Princes. Will you find a way for them to not get murdered or killed by Disease within 100 years ingame? I did a 200 year AI only game on the latest SVN version and by the end, none of the Daedric princes were alive :/
 

LeSingeAffame

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About Daedric Princes. Will you find a way for them to not get murdered or killed by Disease within 100 years ingame? I did a 200 year AI only game on the latest SVN version and by the end, none of the Daedric princes were alive :/
If they are handled with the off-map empires, then I suppose it shouldn't be an issue anymore
 

EmperorG

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If they are handled with the off-map empires, then I suppose it shouldn't be an issue anymore

At the moment all have an off-map Empire title, all except Jyggalag who hangs around his chief priests court. I do hope they overhaul his religion, he's my favorite prince!
 

TheDarkMaster

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Are there events where someone can become suspicious of an innocent of being a vampire or werewolf as one? Getting an event where someone thinks someone else is a vampire loses a bit of the suspense if you know that means they always are one. The fun thing to do with this one would be if paranoid characters are both more likely to spot an actual hidden vampire/werewolf or suspect an innocent.

Any flavor events with vampires pretending to be getting older or passing themselves off as their child to avoid suspicion?

I suppose events tied to any immortal might also be relevant here, should someone be known as a benevolent vampire. For example, dynastic heirs upset that they won't inherit the crown or electors having nothing to elect as long as you live on and on and on.
 

Colossal_Elk

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Are there events where someone can become suspicious of an innocent of being a vampire or werewolf as one? Getting an event where someone thinks someone else is a vampire loses a bit of the suspense if you know that means they always are one. The fun thing to do with this one would be if paranoid characters are both more likely to spot an actual hidden vampire/werewolf or suspect an innocent.

Any flavor events with vampires pretending to be getting older or passing themselves off as their child to avoid suspicion?

I suppose events tied to any immortal might also be relevant here, should someone be known as a benevolent vampire. For example, dynastic heirs upset that they won't inherit the crown or electors having nothing to elect as long as you live on and on and on.

There aren't, but events like that have been discussed by the team in the past. Actually, when I first reworked vampirism and lycanthropy, I had half-finished an event chain specific to this very thing, but my scripting knowledge wasn't as extensive back then and I had trouble with the event targets and other scopes, and had to sideline it. I'm pretty sure I could go through and do it now, though I like to break content into phases so that if anything is riddled with bugs, it's easier to identify. Probably after most of the major work is done with the offmaps, I'll come back to the supernatural characters and give them some additional content.
 

Guthix

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This is so cool, dude! Will it be possible to have a child be a vampire? I want an army of horrifying tiny vampires!
 

Colossal_Elk

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This is so cool, dude! Will it be possible to have a child be a vampire? I want an army of horrifying tiny vampires!

Children can't be born as vampires, but a child may end up having slightly better health and martial/intrigue/learning if one or both parents is a vampire. They are however a lot more likely to be Sickly at birth. Lycanthropes have a similar bonus, though they don't get a learning bonus, their martial stat boost is better and the health bonus is far greater - they also don't have anything that negatively affects the health of their children.

Note that if one parent is a vampire and the other is a lycanthrope, that doesn't mean the child gets both bonuses - they'll either get one, or neither.
 

Guthix

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Children can't be born as vampires, but a child may end up having slightly better health and martial/intrigue/learning if one or both parents is a vampire. They are however a lot more likely to be Sickly at birth. Lycanthropes have a similar bonus, though they don't get a learning bonus, their martial stat boost is better and the health bonus is far greater - they also don't have anything that negatively affects the health of their children.

Note that if one parent is a vampire and the other is a lycanthrope, that doesn't mean the child gets both bonuses - they'll either get one, or neither.

I take it that decision was influenced by Agronak gro-Malog? I always found his situation really interesting and the fact that they never did anything else with half-vampires disappointing.

How about converting a child to a vampire and them staying a child? Like Babette or my potential army of specifically chosen tiny soldiers bent on conquering Tamriel.
 
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Colossal_Elk

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I take it that decision was influenced by Agronak gro-Malog? I always found his situation really interesting and the fact that they never did anything else with half-vampires disappointing.

How about converting a child to a vampire and them staying a child? Like Babette or my potential army of specifically chosen tiny soldiers bent on conquering Tamriel.

Agronak was the primary inspiration, absolutely. It stood to reason that if vampires can bestow some powers upon their offspring, so can a lycanthrope.

As for the second thing, I don't think there's any way for that to work, since AFAIK, the game relies on age number to determine who should get which events, decisions, etc., and so it wouldn't really function properly. It's like why the "long lived" races like Mer and Tsaesci have to have a lot of unique exceptions in our scripts since the game sees that someone is over 100 years old and would otherwise decide to start hitting that character with negative trait events, health debuffs and such to ensure that they die (and the mer wouldn't die of those things anyway since they all have the "immortal" tag in their racial traits).
 

Guthix

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Agronak was the primary inspiration, absolutely. It stood to reason that if vampires can bestow some powers upon their offspring, so can a lycanthrope.

As for the second thing, I don't think there's any way for that to work, since AFAIK, the game relies on age number to determine who should get which events, decisions, etc., and so it wouldn't really function properly. It's like why the "long lived" races like Mer and Tsaesci have to have a lot of unique exceptions in our scripts since the game sees that someone is over 100 years old and would otherwise decide to start hitting that character with negative trait events, health debuffs and such to ensure that they die (and the mer wouldn't die of those things anyway since they all have the "immortal" tag in their racial traits).
hmm... If I'm not mistaken, the guys over at the Warhammer mod have figured out a way to have child vampires receive unique events that are connected to a personal modifier received whenever they receive vampirism under a certain age. As I understand it, it's quite complicated and involves child vampires using a separate gfx_culture to normal vampires. That's all I really know, sadly.
 

Guthix

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Yeah, I think there's at least one character that starts as a child vampire in the Warhammer mod, but I don't remember the specifics...
Heloise in the mountains between Britannia and The Empire. She's a Necarch vampire, so she's basically a tiny shambling corpse with homicidal tendencies.