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A few considerations on unlockables, time and other stuff.

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Victor Cortez

Victor Cortez

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Hello everybody,

Timeline Progression VS Detailed Hour Progressions:
I'm referring to the difference between CIM1 and CIM2. In CIM1 time progresses through different eras, whereas in CIM2 the focus is on the day itself.
I've appreciated a lot the CIM2 system, and I considered it an amazingly brave move by CO, but ultimately I don't think it works very well, especially not in a city builder.

According to the trailer, CSL is going the CIM1 way (the date reads: 2026), and I really hope so. Starting your city in a bygone era (as far back as CO/PI funds allow - I understand that it's a heavy burden on the budget) is so much better as it gives you ways to improve your city in way you wouldn't expect. So, even starting in the '50 and carrrying on until 2050 would be a way better choice than sticking to one year and having a detailed day.

Seasons and regions would be a good plus too, imagine managing a city with heavy snow. But that might be too much.


Timed Unlock VS Research:

Old SimCities would unlock new stuff at a specific date, whereas the last one forced you to do some Research. I personally prefer going the research path as it gives you more freedom and it's more challenging. Just make it so that it's somehow realistic. Should I be able to build a Windplant 2.0 only after I've build 10 Windplant 1.0? No. Should I be able to build a Windplant 2.0 only after I've build research facilites etc? Yes. Maybe make it so that researches can be bought with the city's finances (researching should be cheaper and slower).


Paradise City VS Politics:

In most city builders (all of them, as far as I know), you're supposed to build a perfect city. And all the people want the same thing. You might go a different route, but you'd only do so out of role playing madness or curiosity. What the game wants you to do is one thing only: Paradise City.
That's not realistic and it's frankly quite boring.

I hope CSL goes the political way and incorporates some mechanics from other games (prime example would be the Democracy series). My ideal city is very different from yours, or maybe some things are in common for everybody, while others are very different.
Different people groups should be present in the city (again, think of the Democracy series), and every now and then elections take place. Let's say you were the conservative party and you made a mess of the enviroment, the green party gets elected and it has some bonues (cheaper parks!) etc. It wouldn't be as crazy as Victoria, but it could add lots of flavour.
There could be achievements for political stability and whatnot.

Opinions?
 
Victor Cortez said:
Hello everybody,

Timeline Progression VS Detailed Hour Progressions:
I'm referring to the difference between CIM1 and CIM2. In CIM1 time progresses through different eras, whereas in CIM2 the focus is on the day itself.
I've appreciated a lot the CIM2 system, and I considered it an amazingly brave move by CO, but ultimately I don't think it works very well, especially not in a city builder.

According to the trailer, CSL is going the CIM1 way (the date reads: 2026), and I really hope so. Starting your city in a bygone era (as far back as CO/PI funds allow - I understand that it's a heavy burden on the budget) is so much better as it gives you ways to improve your city in way you wouldn't expect. So, even starting in the '50 and carrrying on until 2050 would be a way better choice than sticking to one year and having a detailed day.

Seasons and regions would be a good plus too, imagine managing a city with heavy snow. But that might be too much.


Timed Unlock VS Research:

Old SimCities would unlock new stuff at a specific date, whereas the last one forced you to do some Research. I personally prefer going the research path as it gives you more freedom and it's more challenging. Just make it so that it's somehow realistic. Should I be able to build a Windplant 2.0 only after I've build 10 Windplant 1.0? No. Should I be able to build a Windplant 2.0 only after I've build research facilites etc? Yes. Maybe make it so that researches can be bought with the city's finances (researching should be cheaper and slower).
Click to expand...

I agree! I love CIM time progression! I think that the day/night cycle is needed to give the realism of rush hours, etc... But the time progression need to be in months and years
 
Totally agree! I like the idea of having Democracy series inspired mechanics in the game. It could add something special to the game, something that other city-builders lack. The research system in for example SimCities is unrealistic but adds to the gameplay, and that is probably the main reason why they have it. Research should be both realistic and good for gameplay. Maybe you can build universities and insitutes in your city. Then as meantioned, pay a monthly amount to the university or institute and give them funds to conduct research.
 
I think research thing is pretty unrealistic. Research is more of a country scope or even the whole world. But I'd like some restrictions so you won't build skyskraper in a village (in case of manual non-zonal build). Maybe also a level of builder industry should restrict how much and how fast you can build. Inviting builders from other cities should make structures cost more.

As for timeline it can be a very interesting concept as older time not only have it's own possibilites but also needs of citizens and country/world. At the beggining of the century there were much less private cars so it was unnecessary to pay for wide roads, there were much more demand for industry than offices. But than time changes and you have to change your town too. Or make it deserted like Detroit.

Yeah... and of course there should be "war" disaster.

And citizen protests when you try to change small nice touristic city into industrial capital. Protests that can reduce your support so you lose elections and gameover.

And of course everything of this should not be in release but in turning on/off DLC's or mods. ;)
 
Uglyr said:
I think research thing is pretty unrealistic. Research is more of a country scope or even the whole world.
Click to expand...

That's what I meant when I said:

Maybe make it so that researches can be bought with the city's finances (researching should be cheaper and slower).
Click to expand...

Yes. I wasn't very clear.


What I mean is: if you have universities and research centres, you should be able to research the new stuff yourself, but since cities do not exist in a vacuum, like you said, you should be able to "purchase" new stuff.



Sorry to say but I just learned that there won't even be a day-night cycle in the game, so we can pretty much leave out any weather.

A big dissapointment if you ask me.
Click to expand...

It's early for disappointments :)
Let's see where the game goes and then we will decide.

I don't need a day-night cycle if the rest of the game is ok.
 
Lakenstaken said:
Sorry to say but I just learned that there won't even be a day-night cycle in the game, so we can pretty much leave out any weather.

A big dissapointment if you ask me. :(
Click to expand...

Weather and day/night cycle is on the wishlist though, so it's not out of the picture just because it won't be there at launch! :) Taking into consideration we're looking at a EUIV/CK2 similar DLC program (mixing free and paid) you might very well see it as a free addition in the future.
 
TotalyMoo said:
Weather and day/night cycle is on the wishlist though, so it's not out of the picture just because it won't be there at launch! :) Taking into consideration we're looking at a EUIV/CK2 similar DLC program (mixing free and paid) you might very well see it as a free addition in the future.
Click to expand...

I trust in you CO and PI. I know that you will give us tons of DLC's with all stuff we want :D
 
TotalyMoo said:
Weather and day/night cycle is on the wishlist though, so it's not out of the picture just because it won't be there at launch! :) Taking into consideration we're looking at a EUIV/CK2 similar DLC program (mixing free and paid) you might very well see it as a free addition in the future.
Click to expand...

Good to know. I really hope day/night and seasions/weather will be a part of the game someday.
 
Lakenstaken said:
True but im trying to be realistic, the DLC's we've seen so far in CiM 1 and 2 are only more buildings and vehicles so I think there is a low chance of that ever happening, but ofcourse we never know.
Click to expand...

It all depends on how well the game goes and what the players want. I am pretty sure we're planning for more extensive stuff than more assets, due to the inherent modding support adding such things naturally :)
 
Victor Cortez said:
Hello everybody,

Timeline Progression VS Detailed Hour Progressions:
I'm referring to the difference between CIM1 and CIM2. In CIM1 time progresses through different eras, whereas in CIM2 the focus is on the day itself.
I've appreciated a lot the CIM2 system, and I considered it an amazingly brave move by CO, but ultimately I don't think it works very well, especially not in a city builder.

According to the trailer, CSL is going the CIM1 way (the date reads: 2026), and I really hope so. Starting your city in a bygone era (as far back as CO/PI funds allow - I understand that it's a heavy burden on the budget) is so much better as it gives you ways to improve your city in way you wouldn't expect. So, even starting in the '50 and carrrying on until 2050 would be a way better choice than sticking to one year and having a detailed day.

Seasons and regions would be a good plus too, imagine managing a city with heavy snow. But that might be too much.


Timed Unlock VS Research:

Old SimCities would unlock new stuff at a specific date, whereas the last one forced you to do some Research. I personally prefer going the research path as it gives you more freedom and it's more challenging. Just make it so that it's somehow realistic. Should I be able to build a Windplant 2.0 only after I've build 10 Windplant 1.0? No. Should I be able to build a Windplant 2.0 only after I've build research facilites etc? Yes. Maybe make it so that researches can be bought with the city's finances (researching should be cheaper and slower).


Paradise City VS Politics:

In most city builders (all of them, as far as I know), you're supposed to build a perfect city. And all the people want the same thing. You might go a different route, but you'd only do so out of role playing madness or curiosity. What the game wants you to do is one thing only: Paradise City.
That's not realistic and it's frankly quite boring.

I hope CSL goes the political way and incorporates some mechanics from other games (prime example would be the Democracy series). My ideal city is very different from yours, or maybe some things are in common for everybody, while others are very different.
Different people groups should be present in the city (again, think of the Democracy series), and every now and then elections take place. Let's say you were the conservative party and you made a mess of the enviroment, the green party gets elected and it has some bonues (cheaper parks!) etc. It wouldn't be as crazy as Victoria, but it could add lots of flavour.
There could be achievements for political stability and whatnot.

Opinions?
Click to expand...

These are some good suggestions, I especially like the last one. Democracy is a good example. Another one should be the Tropico series which its factions. Thirt would be Victoria, where different types (classes) of POPs react differently and have different opinions about various issues.
 
From what I've read, the idea is that there will be individual simulation units. Conceptually at least, that system can be adapted so that different sims care about different things--some wealthy sims will tolerate noise pollution if they can gloriously live in the city center, while other wealthy sims want suburban mansions. Naturally, a city oriented towards a particular kind of living will tend to attract more of that kind of sim. That way it should be possible to design different cities (or districts) which are all viable, but in which you have to make tradeoffs if you want to satisfy everyone.
 
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