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Stellaris Dev Diary #54 - Ethics Rework

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Now that 1.4 is out, we can finally start properly talking about the 1.5 'Banks' update, which will be a major update with an accompanying (unannounced) expansion. As of right now we cannot provide any details on when 1.5 will come out, or anything about the unannounced expansion, so please don't ask. :)

Today's topic is a number of changes coming to ethics in the 1.5 update. Everything in this diary is part of the free update. Please note that values shown in screenshots are always non-final.

Authoritarian vs Egalitarian
One of the things in Stellaris I was never personally happy with was the Collectivism vs Individualism ethic. While interesting conceptually, the mechanics that the game presented for the ethics simply did not match either their meanings or flavor text, meaning you ended up with a Collectivist ethos that was somehow simultaneously egalitarian and 100% in on slavery, while Individualism was a confused jumble between liberal democratic values and randian free-market capitalism. For this reason we've decided to rebrand these ethics into something that should both be much more clear in its meaning, and match the mechanics as they are.

Authoritarian replaces Collectivist and represents belief in hierarchial rule and orderly, stratified societies. Authoritarian pops tolerate slavery and prefer to live in autocracies.
Egalitarian replaces Individualist and represents belief in individual rights and a level playing field. Egalitarian pops dislike slavery and elitism and prefer to live in democracies.

While I understand this may cause some controversy and will no doubt spark debate over people's interpretation of words like Authoritarian and Individualist, I believe that we need to work with the mechanics we have, and as it stand we simply do not have good mechanics for a Collectivism vs Individualism axis while the mechanics we have fit the rebranded ethics if not perfectly then at least a whole lot better.
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Pop Ethics Rework
Another mechanic that never quite felt satisfying is the ethics divergence mechanic. Not only is it overly simplified with just a single value determining if pops go towards or from empire ethics, the shift rarely makes sense: Why would xenophobe alien pops diverge away from xenophobe just because they're far away from the capital of a xenophobic empire? Furthermore, the fact that pops could have anything from one to three different ethics made it extremely difficult to actually quantify what any individual pop's ethics actually mean for how they relate to the empire. For this reason we've decided to revamp the way pop ethics work in the following way:
  • Each pop in your empire will now only embrace a single, non-fanatic ethic. At the start of the game, your population will be made of up of only the ethics that you picked in species setup, but as your empire grows, its population will become more diverse in their views and wants.
  • Each ethic now has an attraction value for each pop in your empire depending on both the empire's situation and their own situation. For example, enslaved pops tend to become more egalitarian, while pops living around non-enslaved aliens become more xenophilic (and pops living around enslaved aliens more xenophobic). Conversely, fighting a lot of wars will increase the attraction for militarism across your entire empire, while an alien empire purging pops of a particular species will massively increase the attraction for xenophobic for the species being purged.
  • Over time, the ethics of your pops will drift in such a way that it roughly matches the overall attraction of that value. For example, if your materialist attraction sits at 10% for decades, it's likely that after that time, around 10% of your pops will be materialist. There is some random factor so it's likely never going to match up perfectly, but the system is built to try and go towards the mean, so the more overrepresented an ethic is compared to its attraction, the more likely pops are to drift away from it and vice versa.
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So what does the single ethic per pop mean in terms of how it affects pop happiness? Well, this brings us to the new faction system, which we will cover briefly in this dev diary, and get back to more in depth later.

Faction Rework
One thing we feel is currently missing from Stellaris is agency for your pops. Sure, they have their ethics and will get upset if you have policies that don't suit them, but that's about the only way they have of expressing their desires, and there is no tie-in between pop ethics and the politics systems in the game. To address this and also to create a system that will better fit the new pop ethics, we've decided to revamp the faction system in the following manner:
  • Factions are no longer purely rebel groupings, but instead represent political parties, popular movements and other such interest groups, and mostly only consist of pops of certain ethics. For example, the Supremacist faction desires complete political dominance for their own species, and is made up exclusively of Xenophobic pops, while the Isolationist faction wants diplomatic isolation and a strong defense, and can be joined by both Pacifist and Xenophobe pops. You do not start the game with any factions, but rather they will form over the course of the game as their interests become relevant
  • Factions have issues related to their values and goals, and how well the empire responds to those issues will determine the overall happiness level of the faction. For example, the Supremacists want the ruler to be of their species and are displeased by the presence of free alien populations in the empire. They will also get a temporary happiness boost whenever you defeat alien empires in war.
  • The happiness level of a faction determines the base happiness of all pops belonging to it. This means that where any pop not belonging to a faction has a base happiness of 50%, a pop belonging to a faction that have their happiness reduced to 35% because of their issues will have a base happiness of only 35% before any other modifiers are applied, meaning that displeasing a large and influential faction can result in vastly reduced productivity across your empire. As part of this, happiness effects from policies, xenophobia, slavery, etc have been merged into the faction system, so engaging in alien slavery will displease certain factions instead of having each pop individually react to it.
  • Factions have an influence level determined by the number of pops that belong to it. In addition to making its pops happier, a happy faction will provide an influence boost to their empire.
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We will come back to factions in greater detail in a later dev diary, going over topics such as how separatists and rebellious slaves will work, and how factions can be used to change your empire ethics, but for now we are done for today. Next week we'll be talking about another new feature that we have dubbed 'Traditions and Unity'. See you then!
 
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Sad to see the classical liberal option go away, and our choices basically being reduced to two different kinds of totalitarianism. Monarchy vs. socialism. But I guess that's why we have mods, so we don't have to be restricted by the developers' political views.
 
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That would be even more of a confused mess and end up making pops far less distinct. This is a game, not real life, and abstractions are needed for good gameplay.
It worked in victoria didn't it? Also the democracy series has a system like that, and they have far more pops than you do.

And I like messes, they make things feel alive breathing evolving, not having a mess means everything just end up devolving into a numbers game... well look no further than eu4.
 
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A society like that would presumably have traits that make the attraction to government ethics very strong, cancelling out the increased attraction to egalitarian. It's not like every slave is instantly going to become egalitarian, it's just a factor.

HI Wiz! Does that mean that species traits can affect ethics atractions for each species (either by default or by modding)?
 
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I hope this time Paradox updates all events related to pop ethos.
Last time they changed a basic aspect of the game (climate type in 1.3), they failed to update all relevant events even now.
 
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Why adding conditions like unemployment? Because they are met, like... never. That's like adding condition "No ongoing research" or "No garrison on planet"
Happens in my playthroughs quite frequently. Not cripplingly so, but it's not unusual to have nothing worth putting on a tile, or to be saving up for more important things, or whatever.

There's more than one way to play the game.
 
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There should be a difference between how factions function in democratic and authoritarian systems. Democracies are likely to have a large variety of factions whereas authoritarian societies have it in their interest to limit the ability of their people to group into factions that could cause trouble for the ruling elite. Factions in an authoritarian systems ought to be less likely to form due to government limitations but more willing to push for change once they gain the traction neccesary. Of course I understand such factions could be meant to exist informally but still when public gatherings and freedom of speech are encouraged this tends to result to way more people willing to group for political purposes, than if there's a threat of repression.
 
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Sad to see the classical liberal option go away, and our choices basically being reduced to two different kinds of totalitarianism. Monarchy vs. socialism. But I guess that's why we have mods, so we don't have to be restricted by the developers political views.
Wrong kind of egalitarianism.
 
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Really nice ! One little question though :
For example, the Supremacist faction desires complete political dominance for their own species, and is made up exclusively of Xenophobic pops
Does this mean that you can have one xenophobe faction per species in your empire? It wouldn't make much sense If all xenophobe species were groupped together in the same faction, but it would easily create a lot of factions for the same ethos if there's one faction for each species that has xenophobe pops.
 
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HI Wiz! Does that mean that species traits can affect ethics atractions for each species (either by default or by modding)?

Yes, in multiple ways. For example, being around Repugnant aliens will make pops more Xenophobic.
 
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Really nice ! One little question though :

Does this mean that you can have one xenophobe faction per species in your empire? It wouldn't make much sense If all xenophobe species were groupped together in the same faction, but it would easily create a lot of factions for the same ethos if there's one faction for each species that has xenophobe pops.

You will not have supremacists from different species sharing a faction. That would make very little sense. They could be in the same isolationist faction though.
 
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Really nice ! One little question though :

Does this mean that you can have one xenophobe faction per species in your empire? It wouldn't make much sense If all xenophobe species were groupped together in the same faction, but it would easily create a lot of factions for the same ethos if there's one faction for each species that has xenophobe pops.

If that's so, one of my first goals will be making a Space Austria-Hungary that eats as much Xenophobe pops as possible and see how long it'll hold before exploding :D
 
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These changes are the first good step at making the galaxy of Stellaris more detailed and interesting.
I look forward to playing the game with these new changes!
 
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That's some pretty damn good ideas there.

I have but few minor issues:
- Pops get angry not because government acts in opposition to their ethics, but because it acts in opposition to the their faction. That's kinda roundaround? Unless its a cynical: "People don't know whether to get offended until they check if party they vote for is for it or against it", then I'd guess it'd make perfect sense.
- Please don't use this icon for authoritarian. Old collectivist was perfect in the way it symbolised hierarchical society. Or at least make it something funny, like pickelhaube?
- Currently unemployment makes pops turn authoritarian. Why not make it: "Under democracy unemployed pops turn authoritarian, under autocracy unemployed pops turn egalitarian"
- There needs to be "like whatever, man" faction, that includes 50% of your population (average number of people who don't ever vote), who don't care about policies. Yes, the filthy neutrals. Purging them gives you opinion bonuses with everyone else. But not enslaving. Too good for them.
- At least one of possible names for xenophobic/authoritarian faction has to be "%COUNTRYNAME% Deplorables"
 
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I notice that the icons for individualism and collectivism are completely gone, and have a question:

Are the old ethos gone forever, completely replaced by the new ones? Or have you made the distinction between, say, collectivist/authoritarian so that both ethos exist, they are just different. (Authoritarian gets all the slavery techs, collectivist gets the cooperative techs like ministry of benevolence, social welfare and frontier collectives)

I know I would certainly prefer to have both, since a player could choose to be say, authoritarian collectivist or egalitarian collectivist. Though it appears a small difference, the populous of both governments would be managed totally differently. Thoughts?
 
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I still can't decide on my opinion on this dev diary.

One thing that bothers me is that it again will just mean change in modifiers, not concept.

Are you going to implement riots? Like if majority of planet population is xenophobic and several aliens migrate to this planet - will this situation have a chance to trigger riots? Will there be clashes between Spiritualists and Materialists? I'm not talking about revolt vs 'federal government', I'm talking about internal struggle between pops with different ethos?
 
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I notice that the icons for individualism and collectivism are completely gone, and have a question:

Are the old ethos gone forever, completely replaced by the new ones? Or have you made the distinction between, say, collectivist/authoritarian so that both ethos exist, they are just different. (Authoritarian gets all the slavery techs, collectivist gets the cooperative techs like ministry of benevolence, social welfare and frontier collectives)

I know I would certainly prefer to have both, since a player could choose to be say, authoritarian collectivist or egalitarian collectivist. Though it appears a small difference, the populous of both governments would be managed totally differently. Thoughts?

They're gone. I'm not ruling out that they might return, but only if we have mechanics to actually support them.
 
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Concerned about the ethics drift.

Why would pops start without a fanatic version of traits if your empire starts as fanatics?
 
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