Hi again folks! It's a big day today with the release of the Common Sense expansion for EUIV! Naturally, we are releasing a patch for CKII in tandem, in order to keep the save game converter up-to-date.

Patch Notes here:

Spoiler

- Updated government calculation to be up to date with EU4 1.12
- Fixed the localisation issues on Mac and Linux with country names
- Ibadi is now its own main religion like it should be

NOTE: We are aware of an issue on Mac and Linux caused by EU4's recent engine upgrade, which broke EU4's ability to find the exported games from CK2. For now, you have to manually copy the exported save from eu4_export/mod to EU4's mod folder but this will be fixed ASAP by the EU4 team.

Now then, this time I thought I'd talk about the internal dynamics of the nomadic hordes. As I mentioned last time, Nomads use population and manpower rather than relying on levies and taxes from Holdings, so they tend to have a lot fewer normal vassals than other realms. To compensate for this, Nomad hordes rely on a variable number of member Clans instead. The Clans are similar to regular vassals in some respects, except that they also employ Manpower and Population (oh, and you are allowed to play as a vassal Clan too, of course), and each Clan has a special opinion called Clan Sentiment of the other Clans, separate from that of its chief. As a horde grows, it will be encouraged to increase the number of member Clans. Likewise, you can have too many Clans for the amount of available land.

Effective management of the Clans takes some effort due to their infighting and Sentiments. We have added a new screen to give you a proper overview of the situation. Red lines between the Clans indicate an ongoing "Blood Feud" and green lines a "Blood Oath". A Clan can only have one "blood brother" Clan, but many feuds. Feuds are started either by simple declaration, or by raiding one of the other Clans in the realm... Yes, even though you might all be serving same Khan, nothing stops you from raiding a fellow Clan's land! Blood Oaths are similar to marriage alliances; they last as long as both of the Clan Chiefs are alive, but they are only type of alliance that allows you to call another Clan to war in internal wars (and that includes the Khan!) Blood Feuds are much more persistent and can only be settled with a payment of blood money... or by the other Clan's extinction.

Another twist to the Oath and Feud status is that actions taken against one Clan will affect the Sentiment of its enemy or blood brother, as appropriate. For example, an oath-bound Clan will also become hostile to whomever is raiding you, and will dislike any clans you are in Feud with for as long as the Oath lasts. Feuding parties are allowed to freely declare outright wars against each other, fighting over the grazing lands in a single county.

Clans can be a bit tricky to manage, not just because of their own infighting but also because they don't follow any system of laws like the Feudal realms do; they are more about frankly expecting and demanding things from their Khan. If they view the Khan as weak and pathetic they are quite prone to attempt to have him replaced with another Clan chief (usually through membership in a special Faction.)

Apart from proposing Blood Oaths and declaring Feuds, the Khan also has access to a number of special actions against the other Clans. He can demand that they split in order to maintain balance within the tribe, or even absorb them; unless they refuse, of course! Clans are also free to adopt the religion of another Clan, should they like it better for some reason (steppe nomads are fairly open-minded about religious matters.)

I am sure there is more I should mention about Clan management, but since I really need to get back to work, I'll leave you with this. Next time; Tributaries, Nomad succession and dynamic mercenaries!

 

[Dirt McStain]

I think Pdox is making a delineation between nomad hordes and "regular" nomads. Since Bedouin nomads weren't hordes per se, they're still either missing or tribal in CK2. At best, if they do get added, we'd probably end up with a situation that we got with non-Norse pagans, who are basically Norse-lite with a lot of the fun and unique mechanics/events missing. However, this makes sense to a certain degree since you didn't see berserking Suomenuskos river raiding deep into western Europe and establishing Finish states in Sicily and Normandy. I wouldn't want to see Bedouin Camel Lords getting all of the horde mechanics that they end up establishing Saharan horde empires that raid deep into Europe. In the end, they'd have to be horde-lite, which may end up just not being that much fun.

 

[riadach]

Wait what map? The Alans should be nomadic in the earlier start dates at the very least, they are the last iranic nomads on the steppes.

Look at the bottom left here. There is a nomad shield, but there's a christian shield below it (which I assume now are feudal shields since shields now denote government type), which may mean Alans are feudal.

 

[SBolshevik]

Shields still represent faiths most likely, besides, that is Derbent, Alania is that area just north of it which is its liege. Those could be Armenians for all we know, especially since it's 769.

 

[tkamin]

Hi again folks! It's a big day today with the release of the Common Sense expansion for EUIV! Naturally, we are releasing a patch for CKII in tandem, in order to keep the save game converter up-to-date.

You claim that converted is up to date, while not fixing the game breaking groups, like countries having no-technology after conversion. The issues was reported months ago (https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/2-3-2-converter-issues.829916/) with full reproduction step and even fix (use of nomad instead of nomad_group to refer a technology). Just making the mod load and start the game does not mean that the product is working.

Do you even plan to fix the converter? I am will not be asking for having money back, as I received at as preorder bonus, but this DLC is constantly broken since RoI. And I count only major bugs like missing province mapping or no-technology groups, not a plague of wrong icons, missing localizations, wrong culture/tag mapping.

 

[Maizel]

Will this be CKIIs last expansion?

 

[riadach]

Shields still represent faiths most likely, besides, that is Derbent, Alania is that area just north of it which is its liege. Those could be Armenians for all we know, especially since it's 769.

Why are formerly tengri shields being used to represent Zoroastrian heresies then?

 

[SBolshevik]

Why are formerly tengri shields being used to represent Zoroastrian heresies then?

Still, those aren't Alans in Derbent, the Alans are nomadic it seems.

 

[Thure]

Will this be CKIIs last expansion?

Why should it be?

 

[Zohtun]

Will this be CKIIs last expansion?

The devs mentioned at least another 3, so I doubt it.

 

[Maizel]

Why should it be?

Im all for more expansions Just wondering.

 

[toroltao]

The devs don't even know when they're going to be done with CK2. I'd assume it's a very popular product and as long as people are buying their DLCs, they'll keep making them. Basic business sense.

 

[Talq]

Im all for more expansions Just wondering.

The devs don't even know when they're going to be done with CK2. I'd assume it's a very popular product and as long as people are buying their DLCs, they'll keep making them. Basic business sense.

This is the answer you need.

 

[TheDungen]

Not nessecerily, sooner or later they'll reach a point when it's just not possible to add any more dlc, that's when they'll need to start working on ck3.

 

[gorillacakes]

Not nessecerily, sooner or later they'll reach a point when it's just not possible to add any more dlc, that's when they'll need to start working on ck3.

After such a long development cycle I hope they take a break and finally start work on Rome 2!

 

[riadach]

After such a long development cycle I hope they take a break and finally start work on Rome 2!

If CK2 had a decent mechanic to represent Byzantium administration, technically they could do it on this engine.

 

[Deth_Glitch]

If CK2 had a decent mechanic to represent Byzantium administration, technically they could do it on this engine.

Lol, next start date?

 

[toroltao]

Not nessecerily, sooner or later they'll reach a point when it's just not possible to add any more dlc, that's when they'll need to start working on ck3.

And when will they reach that point? After fleshing out the other pagan religions? After Tibet? After China? After Southeast Asia? After Japan?

I could list at least 5 DLCs based on region, religion, culture alone. That's at least another year's worth of new content.

 

[TheDungen]

And when will they reach that point? After fleshing out the other pagan religions? After Tibet? After China? After Southeast Asia? After Japan?

I could list at least 5 DLCs based on region, religion, culture alone. That's at least another year's worth of new content.

They'll reach that point when they feel the need to redo core mechanics. And adding regions will expedite this faster since they'll realise the limitations of the main system when these more diverse cultures and systems are added. The new goverment type system is a good addition but it's really only a band aid on the problem. If it wasn't for backwards compability they'd probably be able to do it so much better. They won't make a new base game just for one such issue ofcourse but as they start getting more things that they say "We'll do that when we make the sequel" they'll draw closer to actually making the sequel.

 

[starwarsfan541]

It is what we are aiming for

Thank you, I am really excited to mod this stuff.

 

[riadach]

I hope there will be more diverse raiding mechanics as a result, as well. Hordes shouldn't be limited to just raiding their neighbours.