• Victoria 3 - Sign up now!

    The journey begins, sign up now and get a special in-game item when the game is released.


  • Crusader Kings III Available Now!

    The realm rejoices as Paradox Interactive announces the launch of Crusader Kings III, the latest entry in the publisher’s grand strategy role-playing game franchise. Advisors may now jockey for positions of influence and adversaries should save their schemes for another day, because on this day Crusader Kings III can be purchased on Steam, the Paradox Store, and other major online retailers.


    Real Strategy Requires Cunning
  • Crusader Kings II Expansion Subscription

    Subscribe to the CK II Expansion and enjoy unlimited access to 13 major expansions and more!


Victoria 3 - Dev Diary #5 - Production Methods

DD5 Thumb.png


Hello again and happy Thursday! Today we will be taking a deeper look inside Buildings to explore Production Methods. These determine the functions of the building, its inputs and outputs, and what employee types it requires to operate.

Many management games let you upgrade a building to increase its efficiency or expand its functionality. In these games, after the upgrade investment has been paid the impact is permanent and nearly always superior in every way to the building's previous functionality. But in Victoria 3 there are no actions without reactions, and novel innovations don't just make buildings better with no side effects. Improving industrial processes over time is to be expected, but in some cases those improvements might require goods as input that the country has scant access to, while others permit the output of a new type of end product at the expense of the old one. As a result, buildings in Victoria 3 require more flexible upgrade paths than what's afforded by permanent, linear, “no-brainer” improvements.

All buildings have several categories of Production Methods, usually between 2 and 5. Only one is active at any given time in each category. Most categories fall into one of these types:

Base: governs the general "tech level" and efficiency of the building, produces goods typical for the building type
Refining: reduces output of typical goods in favor of output of specialized or luxury goods, sometimes adding a special input
Automation: adds industrial goods as input to reduce the building's unskilled workforce requirement
Ownership: determines who owns shares in the building; typically governed by Laws

With the right technologies Food Industries can make Groceries from both Grain (Bakeries) and Fish (Canneries). They can also refine Grain and Sugar into Liquor (Distilleries). With advanced technologies Food Industries can be partially automated, drastically reducing the need for unskilled labor. Simple Food Industries are operated by Merchant Guilds (Shopkeepers), while more advanced and profitable Food Industries are owned by Capitalists who reinvest some of their dividends.

dd5_1.png

As one example, an Iron Mine's base Production Method determines if miners use only picks and shovels or if they also use some sort of engine-driven pumping mechanism. There are several different pumping technologies which also determine what fuel is used. The more advanced the pumping mechanism the more deposits can be accessed and the faster Iron can be mined, but the more Coal or Oil is used in the process. With higher tech pumps comes a requirement for more Engineers and Machinists to be on-site to control and oversee its operation. This creates more demand for qualified workers and also opens up a number of better paid positions to those Pops who meet the qualifications.

The revolution in chemical sciences of the era also enabled the use of explosives in mining, which is a secondary Production Method category used only in mines. Once Nitroglycerin is invented, it can be used in mines to generate even more minerals, at the expense of Explosives produced by the Chemical Industry but also with a higher rate of workplace accidents. By researching less volatile Dynamite, even more minerals are extracted at the expense of even more Explosives, with the additional benefit that far fewer workers will blow themselves up on the job.

Once invented, portable Steam Donkey engines can be deployed at mining sites to drastically reduce the amount of manual labor required just for hauling. This costs the building some money in the form of Coal and Engines, but reduces the amount of money they have to pay in wages. Perhaps more importantly it frees those Laborers up to do other work in other buildings if the state is running low on workers. But if wages are already very depressed it might not be a great idea to purchase expensive industrial goods just to increase the unqualified labor pool further, so this might not be a no-brainer decision for a player to make.

In most countries, simple mines are owned and operated by Merchant Guilds at game start. These are small-time purveyors of the goods produced represented by Shopkeepers. Once mines start to industrialize, Capitalists step in to take over ownership. In most cases these Capitalists will come from Shopkeepers promoted to these newly created positions, but some might come from other Pops in the state, even other Capitalists in buildings not quite as lucrative as these new mines. There are fewer Capitalists than Shopkeepers but they draw a higher wage, and more importantly they will reinvest some of their earnings into the country's expanding industry depending on how much profit their workplace is generating for them. As new ideas spread across your society you might be able to make the mining industry publicly traded instead of privately held, and later on in the game perhaps even nationalize them to be run by government bureaucrats or turn them into cooperatives where profit is split between workers.

dd5_2.png

Production Methods aren't limited to consuming and producing goods. Government Administrations employ Bureaucrats and Clerks who use Paper to produce Bureaucracy, one of the game's Capacities that let you govern more people and extend more state services to them. Railways consume Engines and a fuel such as Coal to produce both Transportation and Infrastructure, the former which is sold on the market and the latter which allows the state to support more buildings without loss of Market Access. Universities employ Academics that let the state guide research and development of new technologies and ideas. Virtually any kind of currency, modifier, or effect can be produced by Production Methods in buildings and can be applied in a variety of ways to the country, state, or even the building itself.

A basic Government Administration consumes 10 Paper and produces 50 Bureaucracy per fully-staffed level, but each additional level beyond the first adds a +2% Throughput bonus due to economy of scale. This increases both consumption of Paper and output of Bureaucracy, yielding more productivity from each of the Pops that work the building.

dd5_3.png

This of course adds a tremendous capacity for modding in new Buildings and Production Methods! Embassies that increase your Influence, but which can also be configured to consume Wine and Meat at state expense to increase the speed at which you Improve Relations? Shantytown Temples that can only be built on coastlines, that consume Fish and create jobs for pops qualifying for the Deep Ones profession, increasing state mortality but also the weekly rate of the global cthulhu_rising counter? We can't wait to see what madness you unleash!

If tweaking multiple Production Methods across several categories on every single building in the game sounds a bit complex compared to linear building upgrades - you're right! Thankfully we've built a number of tools to help with this process. Foremost among these are the Buildings panel, where you can get an overview of all buildings in your country organized by major and minor type. For example you could get an overview of all Rural buildings, or all Furniture Manufactories, or all Ports. If you have buildings of the same type in several different states, you can break it down further to view the individual building. On each level you can see how profitable the building is and adjust its Production Methods. You can even set all Production Methods for a certain building type to a specific setting all across your country with one click.

From the Buildings panel you can get a birds-eye view of all industries in your country and see at a glance how they’re doing financially. You can change Production Methods on an individual building or on all of them at once. You can even expand buildings directly from this screen if you so choose, or click on one to get an in-depth view of its balance sheet and workforce.

dd5_4.png

To minimize the requirement for mental math we have also created prediction tools that give you a breakdown of what to expect from choosing a certain Production Method, based on profitability predictions taking adjusted production and consumption into account, and summarizing which new job positions will be created and which will disappear. While it may on the surface seem obvious to just enable the Production Methods that make the buildings more profitable, keep in mind the societal effects as well - are there enough Pops in the state that qualify for the more advanced jobs this new process requires? Will the wage for these new jobs be sufficient to entice those Pops to switch professions? Will you inadvertently create a whole new class of well-to-do Machinists that may have pro-labor union sentiments? Or will the increased profits not lead to higher wages in the building because they're already competitive and fully employed, and will simply result in more dividends for the shareholders which will be funneled into increased luxury consumption? Which you choose might depend on your population’s social mobility, what politics you favor in your country (a socialist uprising may not be in your plans!) and whether you're able to supply luxuries yourself without benefiting your rival. More profitable domestic industries are never bad, but should be far from the only consideration when building your society.

Predictive tooltips will explain the anticipated impact on the building’s Balance as a result of changes in production, consumption, and wage requirements, as well as the changes in employment that could also impact the country’s politics over time. You will also be forewarned if there aren’t enough qualifying Pops to take on any new professions created, as this could limit your industry’s effectiveness.

dd5_5.png

That is all for this week. We will return to discussing more economic intricacies later, but for the next little while we'll be exploring domestic politics - starting next week when Martin will be presenting Interest Groups!
 
  • 321Like
  • 245Love
  • 21
Reactions:

lachek

Victoria 3 Lead Designer
35 Badges
Feb 19, 2013
97
7.601
  • Cities in Motion
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Sengoku
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Pride of Nations
  • Magicka 2
  • 500k Club
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Surviving Mars
  • Surviving Mars: Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Prison Architect
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Magicka
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
This comment is reserved by the Community Team for compiling upcoming developer responses from this thread.

Everything looks wonderful and like a huge improvement from the second game! Keep up the good work guys! One thing I wonder is will these ownership laws be locked behind certain government types? Can we have cooperations as a non-anarchist country for example? Another one is how much do these ownership laws interact with other game mechanics. For example does nationalising every single mine owned by foreigners or bourgeoisie provoke responses from those interest groups and owner country of the foreign factories?
Generally ownership types are locked behind different laws, yes, and you can probably expect capitalists that have been 'made redundant' by the government to not take that lying down.

I can't wait to see how this model of technological progress turns out in the game! Change will finally have costs as well as benefits, hopefully.

Will there be any costs (i.e. time, money) to changing production methods, or can they be changed at will? It would be weird if you could suddenly convert all of a state's canneries into breweries without any actual penalties.
Yeah, there will be a cost for changing production methods, though we're still iterating on that part so not ready to explain exactly how it works.

Cool diary today!

Just wondering though, are there mechanisms to model mines being discovered or running out of easily mined metals?
We have resource depletion only in a few select cases, I think it would be interesting but probably not something we'll have in a widespread way on release (there is full support for it in the code though, if modders want to make iron etc depletable)

how are wages for workers determined?
Wages are set by each privately owned building independently by balancing trying to achieve full employment with trying to minimize wage costs. The short version of the logic is that each week a building that require labor will check if it can afford to raise wages to attract more workers, and will only do so if it's able. The effect of this is that qualified labor shortage will drive up wages for as long as buildings can afford to pay, while a healthy supply of Peasants will keep wages depressed and dividends high.

Government wages are based on an average of private industry wages across incorporated states but can be controlled to a limited extent by the player.

So could this system be used to, for example, make car manufacturers produce jeeps and tanks during wartime ?
Easily.

How does it work on the other side? When will a qualified POP drop their work at one place to go to another place?
When a job is being offered that pays more than they currently make + a small margin.

Will there be artisans ?, the industrial revolution is about factories taking the jobs of artisans and turning them into Capitalists or Workers destroying the middle class in the process.

If you need new production methods to create better jobs for more prepared pops, some of this will be lost.
Shopkeepers are middle class pops that are made obsolete in large numbers when you switch away from the early production methods, which is how we simulate this effect.

Can Production Methods change how workers are paid for their jobs? For example, a farmer on a privately-owned farm simply selling product and taking the profit, whereas in a crop-lien type system the landowners take a large percent of the product and sell that for profit, while the sharecroppers are left with whatever's left, or in a system that employs landless laborers those laborers are paid either a wage or a piece rate? And of course, slavery simply denying wages or profits to the slaves.
I'm unsure if this entirely answers your question but you can set up any pop type working in a building to get a share of the profits, and who gets a share and how much is set by the production methods.

Is the predictive tooltip accounting for the building being understaffed, or is the balance change calculated considering the bulding will be fully staffed?
It's assuming full employment, since that's what the building will drift towards eventually if all goes well for it.

This is the first dev diary that I've seen that is simply amazing in its detail of treatment and sophistication of concept. Wow.
So here's a question. When captalists displace shopkeepers from ownership of a business, do those shopkeepers get pissed off sometimes and begin to riot and burn the new business and its equipment? Sure hope so! Where are the Luddites, I ask you! :D
In general, pops whose jobs are made obsolete by changes in technology or laws should be angered by it, especially if they used to own the industries that have been taken over by others.

I used qualify when I don't necessarily mean that. A POP that is a bureaucrat type probably won't be allowed to (like the game restricts them from) take a job that is not specifically for a bureaucrat type POP. Like a capitalist won't go for a machinist position even if for some weird reason a machinist will pay more than a capitalist.
This isn't how the Victoria 3 Qualifications mechanic works actually, a Capitalist might very well qualify to take a (higher-paying) Machinist job. "Qualifications" is taken to mean "could this person possibly be offered this job"? More on the Qualifications system in a future DD, it has a bit more nuance to it and is not actually a binary thing.

As a result the initial question is legit, it's possible for a middle or even upper strata Pop to take a mining job that pays better even though there's a risk of dying. In actuality, if these Pops are willing to do that they're in pretty dire financial straits.

On ownership, does publcially traded means they're owned by all the capitalists, or by banks? Are things like big industrialists and nexuses of finance interest groups? Is there an economic version of an interest group that may try and monopolize?

And is there a halfway between government run and co ops like yugoslavia? Does ideology change how government run firms work, the war economy in the US during WWII and the soviets aren't quite the same? Is there corporatism?
As a catchall answer to the questions about private ownership vs publicly traded, how this works isn't something we're ready to answer at this stage.

A stupid question, but what do the green numbers at the top right corner of each production method mean?

At first I thought it was the level of the production method's tech, but then I noticed it's used in the "bird's eye" national overview... So is it the number of building using a specific PM?

I'm confused...
Current number of options to choose from.

What about wages in a command economy?
Buildings orient themselves financially the same way under Command Economy as other economies, with the difference that all buildings are considered subsidized. So a building that's very profitable on its own doesn't burden the treasury, but any "profits" would (by default) be siphoned off by the Bureaucrats in charge. Meanwhile, buildings that can't carry their own weight will require regular (automatic) cash infusions from state coffers.

Technically, a capitalist is defined by its relationship to the means of production, it's weird to imagine a capitalist work alongside to other worker, qualified or not. They admin or just possess.
They will change Profession in the process, to be clear.

I haven't been able to read a lot of the replies here, so I don't know if it was answered, but would it be possible for me to, say, keep the ownership at merchant guild level while improving the tools, methods and other improvements to generate greater profit and still be relatively competitive?
If you wanted to keep the merchant guilds in charge, the only real way to improve your productivity would either be to maintain artificial scarcity of the produced goods or focus on acquiring vast amounts of raw resources to ensure they have super-cheap inputs, with the latter probably being the more realistic option. So basically, you could have a huge section of your population making handcrafted clothes from cheap cotton and that would probably be reasonably profitable and employ a lot of moderately prosperous middle-class shopkeepers, but in terms of goods production per head it'd lag behind more industrialized countries.

will localized conditions effect output of buildings ? (for example the copper mountain in sweden producing either more or higher quality copper than say other mines) and will buildings that operate for long periods of time get higher efficiency due to experience ?
Buildings don't currently gain experience as such, but State Traits can impact Buildings in their state in various ways, creating local differences in viability and competitiveness. This is in addition to the resource potentials that determine how large industries of various types you can build there, of course.

Not to be naggy again but are their any, any at all, planned changes for the UI/GUI? Eg scaling or a "old version" (vic2). I really really don't like the look of this UI, while I'm sure I'd get used it to, it's really holding a lot of my hype up as a result.

Regardless, great work devs, the actual gameplay mechanics look really cool. Have we got a Political parties dev diary upcoming?

The UI is a constant work in progress. There are even things depicted in this Dev Diary that have been tweaked in the latest dev build of the game.

Constructive feedback on what you would like to see improved is always welcome!

Can aristocrats own mines and factories?
At the moment no, but I have been personally toying with the idea that maybe they should under certain economic systems. No promises that this will be in release though. The main problem with aristocrats owning mines at the earliest methods is that it doesn't transition in the same logical way as capitalists buying out and taking over merchant guild operations, and also ownership of mines is something that varied quite a bit between different countries so it wouldn't be accurate everywhere either.

Will it be able to mod in more than one private owner pop type for a building?
e.g. a Capitalist pop and a "Foreign Investor" pop simultaneously owning a mine and splitting dividends between them.
Yes, and in different proportions if desired. So for example, you could have have a Production Method where Capitalists own 5 shares each while Engineers own 1, meaning the dividends are split 5:1 between them.

Complex => good
if it is Victoria. That is why we asked for Vicky3 for years. because it was the most complete / complexe simulation of paradox games.
So please, don't be afraid to do the things more realistic, even if it makes it a bit less accesible to everyone.
Fully agreed with Complex => Good for Victoria! We still want to build tools to make the feature accessible and manageable though. You should be spending your time making informed, meaningful choices, not have to crunch dozens of numbers in your head or press 37 buttons to execute on your intentions. In the words of our Product Manager, "complexity is not the same as complicated" :)

these type of models should also be available to other government forms.
At the moment we're erring on the side of restricting ownership quite strictly, not by government form specifically, but rather by your country's various economic laws. We want the economic laws to feel very distinct and have big impacts on the population, and if we were to permit most of them under all systems this impact wouldn't be felt as strongly. Of course these are balancing decisions and may change before release.
Pashahlis said:
could I as China flood the market with really cheap goods as I have such a big, unemployed population that it depresses wages down, thus reducing the production cost of the good, thus making the sell price of the good cheaper while still retaining a profit, thus outcompeting goods produced in European countries and putting them out of business?
Yes, assuming the main production cost you have are wages, China's relatively large population will help keep that part of the manufacturing expense down. But if you don't have easy, cheap access to the input goods you need you might not be able to sustain manufacturing the goods cheaply enough to compete with countries that use more technologically advanced, less labor-intensive methods. And then of course there's the additional cost to moving product out of your market, which we'll talk about another time.
Pashahlis said:
Does this mean that making inputs for one type of industry cheaper will result in higher wages for the workers in that type of industry as they can now put aside more money for wages, thus making all the pops start working in that industry, thus starving my other industries of workers, all because I aquired some cheap inputs for a particular industry? This only works if the industry in question has enough employment capacity through buildings of course. So in that csse upgrading the buildings could be bad?
Yes, assuming as you say that the industry has large enough capacity to absorb all those other workers, it could put other industries out of business as a result. Of course, since this means the supply of the goods those industries produced will decrease while demand will remain high (or even get higher as the mega-industry pays such high wages that Pop wealth and thereby demand increases overall) this should eventually approach an equilibrium where all industries are utilized to some extent.
Pashahlis said:
As in, Sweden has such a large quantitiy of wood that it the wood price in Sweden is much cheaper than in lets say Britain, thus making the production cost of lumber and subsequently furniture be very cheap, thus being able to flood the British market with very cheap furniture and thus outcompeting and putting British furniture business out of business?
Yes.
Pashahlis said:
How can I as a player counteract that then?
We'll cover that in a future Dev Diary focused on Trade, but there are ways to protect yourself from predatory trade practices.
Pashahlis said:
I know that its moddable to have automobile factories function as tank factories through a change in production method, but is that modelled in Vanilla, too?
We're playing around with some things surrounding civilian factories contributing to the war effort. We'll see.

My guess is that this will be modeled by Shopkeepers working in Urban Centers generating Service.
Your guess is correct.

I have a question about a specific couple production methods:

Will the first production method for steamers involve taking in clippers as inputs and "converting" them into stem ships (like in real life)?

Likewise, will the first automobiles be horseless carriages? Will artillery go from using iron or bronze as input to using steel as input?

And perhaps most importantly: will factories (as well as POPs) begin to use electricity?!

I am very excited for all of the potential use cases for production methods.
Don't know the answer to the first questions but yes steel eventually replaces many iron inputs and electricity is used by factories later on :)

Regarding Economy of Scale and the realistic benefits of centralization v. decentralization: generally we want to encourage centralization through the mechanics because decentralization is already indirectly incentivized through the Infrastructure mechanics (which we haven't talked about in detail yet) and EoS makes for a good strategic counterbalance to that. Since we have no hard caps on the number of different building types you can have in each state you're free to decide if you want to build 1 level 10 Textile Mill in one state or 10 level 1 Textile Mills in 10 states. Without a solid reason to centralize, states don't tend to develop the same kinds of distinct identities which also causes the political gameplay to suffer. So we assume that many (not all) buildings benefit from building tall.

what role do the sub-sectors of a state actually play in economic terms? Everything happens at the state level. What happens if the state is divided?
A single state region (e.g. Piedmont) has access to a number of resources (arable land, mining potential, etc) that represents how much it can be exploited and in what ways. A subsection of that state region (e.g. French Piedmont) only gets access to some of those resources, limiting how many jobs can be created there and thereby how large and wealthy the state can get.

The distribution of the population is then also simulated accordingly? For example, I have wood in one sub-sector and build a lot of furniture factories. So is that sub-sector then the city, the population and the furniture factories? If France then takes this sub-sector, will Paris get the factories?
Depending on the resources transferred in the split different types of buildings would also be transferred, along with the Pops attached to that building.

It's worth noting here that state regions split only under relatively rare circumstances. Most of the time when territory changes hands it's entire states (which could be a sub-state) from one country to another.

the low infrastructure of the outback is not a limit on how well it receives that administrative input
Not going to get deep into details about this yet, but while low infrastructure is not a limit on how well Bureaucracy is utilized, it does impact the ability for remote Government Administrations to buy Paper from the market at a good price. In effect, without an incentive to centralize, the optimal play strategy would be to construct fully self-sufficient local economies by constructing a variety of building types in every state. This would mean lacking Infrastructure wouldn't matter.

This is a valid strategy for a number of reasons, but we don't want fully distributed industry to be overwhelmingly optimal as this is neither fun nor realistic. Economy of Scale bonuses simulates how centralization can be beneficial (assuming the Infrastructure is there to optimally deliver input and distribute output goods), makes it easier for the player to keep track of which of their states do what, and makes for more interesting political gameplay, without invalidating a more decentralized strategy or artificially limiting the number of building types by "slots" or similar. We think it works pretty well.

How big are the states? This makes me a bit scared that territorial changes when they happen will be more of the big and sudden kind rather than gradual.
State size varies since they're intended to mostly follow historical cultural/legal/administrative boundaries rather than be based on geography or target size. Territorial changes where a state changes hands can very well be big and sudden, yes. That is fully intentional, since the game is not about slow and steady expansion of territory but rather slow and steady growth inside your borders and major upheaval as one potential outcome of conquest. Of course the Pops in the states always change over time, though.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • 44Like
  • 8Love
  • 3
Reactions:

Pbhuh

Colonel
79 Badges
Sep 12, 2017
949
1.737
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Magicka 2 - Signup Campaign
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Magicka 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Magicka 2: Ice, Death and Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Surviving Mars
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Victoria 2
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Divine Wind
Can we get a map dev diary thing as soon as possible? So we can assist the developers in getting more accuracy into the Release of the game or is the developmetn of the game already halted?

I remember with Ck3 that I tried to help the developers get more map accuracy but that it was already too late and development was already halted.
 
  • 68
  • 34Like
  • 19
Reactions:

General Martos

Recruit
103 Badges
Jun 24, 2017
3
17
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Tyranny - Tales from the Tiers
  • BATTLETECH
  • Surviving Mars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Surviving Mars: Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Prison Architect
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Victoria 2
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Pride of Nations
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
This looks absolutely amazing. Thank you Paradox. Can't wait to get my hands on this game.
 
  • 10
  • 7Like
Reactions:

Kaspar Osraige

Corporal
Mar 25, 2019
37
404
Everything looks wonderful and like a huge improvement from the second game! Keep up the good work guys! One thing I wonder is will these ownership laws be locked behind certain government types? Can we have cooperations as a non-anarchist country for example? Another one is how much do these ownership laws interact with other game mechanics. For example does nationalising every single mine owned by foreigners or bourgeoisie provoke responses from those interest groups and owner country of the foreign factories?
 
  • 28Like
  • 8
  • 1
Reactions:

Bunnytob

Not promoted on merit
14 Badges
Sep 17, 2017
2.851
611
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Semper Fi
Interesting...
 

BoomKidneyShot

Colonel
53 Badges
May 5, 2015
869
505
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Victoria 2
Cool diary today!

Just wondering though, are there mechanisms to model mines being discovered or running out of easily mined metals?
 
  • 4
  • 3Like
Reactions:

LucasG21

Second Lieutenant
71 Badges
Feb 23, 2017
110
143
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Prison Architect
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Empire of Sin - Premium Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Victoria 2
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Knights of Pen and Paper 2
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
I can't wait to see how this model of technological progress turns out in the game! Change will finally have costs as well as benefits, hopefully.

Will there be any costs (i.e. time, money) to changing production methods, or can they be changed at will? It would be weird if you could suddenly convert all of a state's canneries into breweries without any actual penalties.
 
  • 5Like
  • 2
Reactions:

Wizzington

Game Director (Victoria 3)
Moderator
41 Badges
Nov 15, 2007
12.009
101.933
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • Sengoku
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • March of the Eagles
  • Majesty 2
  • Magicka
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Deus Vult
  • East India Company
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Divine Wind
  • For The Glory
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Prison Architect
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
Everything looks wonderful and like a huge improvement from the second game! Keep up the good work guys! One thing I wonder is will these ownership laws be locked behind certain government types? Can we have cooperations as a non-anarchist country for example? Another one is how much do these ownership laws interact with other game mechanics. For example does nationalising every single mine owned by foreigners or bourgeoisie provoke responses from those interest groups and owner country of the foreign factories?
Generally ownership types are locked behind different laws, yes, and you can probably expect capitalists that have been 'made redundant' by the government to not take that lying down.
 
  • 47Like
  • 22
  • 2
Reactions:

Wizzington

Game Director (Victoria 3)
Moderator
41 Badges
Nov 15, 2007
12.009
101.933
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • Sengoku
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • March of the Eagles
  • Majesty 2
  • Magicka
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Deus Vult
  • East India Company
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Divine Wind
  • For The Glory
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Prison Architect
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
I can't wait to see how this model of technological progress turns out in the game! Change will finally have costs as well as benefits, hopefully.

Will there be any costs (i.e. time, money) to changing production methods, or can they be changed at will? It would be weird if you could suddenly convert all of a state's canneries into breweries without any actual penalties.
Yeah, there will be a cost for changing production methods, though we're still iterating on that part so not ready to explain exactly how it works.
 
  • 41
  • 29Like
  • 2
Reactions:

GottaGoBoom

Recruit
10 Badges
Mar 5, 2017
7
12
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Victoria 2
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Prison Architect
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Island Bound
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
second
 
  • 28
  • 12Haha
  • 1Angry
Reactions:

DerLux

Recruit
66 Badges
Jul 10, 2017
3
12
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Tyranny - Tales from the Tiers
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Cities: Skylines Industries
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Prison Architect
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
I really like the idea of managing different production methods for my buildings. It's good that they tought about the amount of micromanaging one would have to do while playing as a large nation, e.g. Russia, and added a tool for better overview.
 
  • 3
  • 2Like
Reactions:

Make Victoria 3

Colonel
29 Badges
Feb 19, 2018
841
287
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
So if one has the equivalent of the state capitalism law will buildings that the state constructed be owned by the state as they should be or still get privatised like in vicky 2? Also are there options to purchase even profitable private companies by the state?
Edit: The blue boxes in the picture that shows building in the US are for ownership.
 
Last edited:
  • 4Like
Reactions:

Samitte

Colonel
123 Badges
Feb 2, 2012
1.099
2.006
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Victoria 2

MrMineHeads

Corporal
22 Badges
Feb 18, 2016
26
26
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
Very very exciting stuff! I am loving the complexities and ability to mod the entire process. Cool beans indeed!

One question though, how are wages for workers determined?

Edit: I lied, I have two questions. How exactly do publicly traded companies work? Are you going to need stock exchanges to facilitate the trade of their shares? Are all POPs allowed to own shares? Are international POPs allowed to own them? Will we see some sort of share price for a company or something?
 
  • 4Like
Reactions:

MajorBandgeek

Private
47 Badges
Jan 26, 2016
24
58
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Victoria 2
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Darkest Hour
Wow! what a great Dev Diary! One thing that strikes me is that it feels like the game is working on creating broader categories that then through player choice are specialized/named. Like with Food industries covering both Liquor and Groceries rather than building a Distillery building and then a Grocer. Which I think I love! I do hope we have some way to "name" certain buildings so that way we can both add our own flavor to our games, but also give ourselves signifiers as to what every building we have is specializing in. All in all can't wait for next Thursday!
 

Wizzington

Game Director (Victoria 3)
Moderator
41 Badges
Nov 15, 2007
12.009
101.933
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • Sengoku
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • March of the Eagles
  • Majesty 2
  • Magicka
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Deus Vult
  • East India Company
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Divine Wind
  • For The Glory
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Prison Architect
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
Cool diary today!

Just wondering though, are there mechanisms to model mines being discovered or running out of easily mined metals?
We have resource depletion only in a few select cases, I think it would be interesting but probably not something we'll have in a widespread way on release (there is full support for it in the code though, if modders want to make iron etc depletable)
 
  • 41Like
  • 26
  • 18
Reactions: