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Stellaris Dev Diary #92: FTL Rework and Galactic Terrain

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today's dev diary is about Faster than Light travel in the Cherryh update, and it's likely to be a controversial one. When discussing, please remember to keep things civil, and I would kindly ask that you read the entire dev diary before rushing to post, as it's going to cover some of the questions and concerns we expect to see from the playerbase. Also, as posted last week, all of these changes are currently far away, and we cannot give more details on ETAs or the exact nature of the Cherryh update than we already have. Thank you!

FTL Rework
The single biggest design issue we have had to tackle in the Stellaris team since release is the asymmetrical FTL. While it's a cool and interesting idea on paper, the honest truth is that the feature just does not fit well into the game in practice, and blocks numerous improvements on a myriad of other features such as warfare and exploration, as well as solutions to fundamental design problems like the weakness of static defenses. After a lot of debate among the designers, we finally decided that if we were ever going to be able to tackle these issues and turn Stellaris into a game with truly engrossing and interesting warfare, we would have to bite the bullet and take a controversial decision: Consolidating FTL from the current three types down into a primarily hyperlane-based game, with more advanced forms of FTL unlocked through technology.

However, as I have said on the previous occasions when discussing this issue, one thing we would never consider doing is just slashing FTL types from the game without adding in something else to compensate their loss. That is what most of this dev diary is going to be about. However, before continuing with the details on the additions and changes we're making to FTL, I want to cover a couple of the questions I expect will arise from this:

Why are you removing FTL choices instead of building on them?
A lot of people have asked this question when we have brought up consolidating FTL types before, suggesting that problems such as static defenses can be solved by just adding more mechanics to handle each special case. I think the problem with this is best illustrated with defense stations and FTL inhibitors. One of the aims of the Starbase system is to give empires the ability to 'lock down' their borders, building fortresses that enemy fleets cannot simply skip past to strike at their core worlds, instead of having to create static defenses in every single valuable system.

With hyperlanes, this is a pretty simple affair: As hyperlanes create natural choke points, the only thing a hyperlane-stopping FTL inhibitor needs to do is to prevent enemy fleets from leaving the system once they enter it. The fleet can enter, it can retreat (via emergency FTL) and it can bring down the source of the FTL inhibitor (which might be a Starbase or even a planet) to be able to continue. This is quite easy to understand, both in terms of which system you need to defend to lock down your borders, and how it works when you are on the offensive.

Now let's add Warp to the mix. In this case, the single-system FTL inhibitor is useless because Warp fleets can just go over it, so we'll invent another mechanic: A warp interdiction bubble, stretching a certain distance around the system, that pull in any hostile Warp fleets traveling there to the system containing the FTL inhibitor, and force them to battle it or retreat. This is immediately a lot more messy: First of all, this bubble can't possibly affect Hyperlane fleets, because it could potentially pull them dozens of jumps away from their current location. This means that when fortifying your borders, you now need to not just make sure that every important chokepoint is covered, but also that your entire border is covered in warp interdiction bubbles.

But there's more: Add Wormholes as well, and you now have an FTL type where not only the 'bubble' type interdictor doesn't make intuitive sense (because Wormhole fleets make point-to-point jumps rather than traveling over the map) but if said interdictor works to pull Wormhole fleets out of position regardless of what makes intuitive sense, you end up with the same probem as with hyperlanes, where the fleet can get pulled out of range of its wormhole network and end up stranded even if it brings down the defenses. This means you pretty much have to invent a third type of interdiction type for Wormhole on top of what is already an overengineered and hard to understand system.

Finally, add the problem of displaying all these different types of inhibitors and interdictors on the map, in a way that the player can even remotely start to understand, and you end up with nothing short of a complete mess, where it's far better to just have static defenses protecting single valuable systems... and so we come full circle.

This is the fundamental problem that we have been grappling with when it comes to asymmetrical FTL: What works in a game such as Sword of the Stars, with its turn-based gameplay, small maps of usually no more than 3-6 empires, and 1-on-1 wars breaks down completely in a Stellaris game with real-time gameplay and wars potentially containing a dozen actors, all with their own form of FTL. The complexity collapses into what is for the player just a mess of fleets appearing and disappearing with no discernible logic to them.

Why Hyperlanes?
When discussing this, we essentially boiled down the consolidation into three possibilities: Hyperlanes only, Warp-only, and Warp+Hyperlanes. Wormhole is simply too different a FTL type to ever really work with the others, and not intuitive enough to work as the sole starting FTL for everyone playing the game. Keeping both Warp and Hyperlanes would be an improvement, but would still keep many of the issues we currently have in regards to user experience and fleet coordination. Warp-only was considered as an alternative, but ultimately Hyperlanes won out because of the possibilities it opens up for galactic geography, static defenses and enhancements to exploration.

Here are the some of the possibilities that consolidation of FTL into Hyperlanes creates for Stellaris:
  • Unified distance, sensor and border systems that make sense for everyone (for example, cost of claiming a system not being based on euclidean distance but rather the actual distance for ships to travel there)
  • Galactic 'geography', systems that are strategically and tactically important due to location and 'terrain' (more on this below) rather than just resources
  • More possibilities for galaxy generation and exploration (for example, entire regions of space accessible only through a wormhole or a single guarded hyperlane, containing special locations and events to discover)
  • Better performance through caching and unified code (Wormhole FTL in particular is a massive resource hog in the late game)
  • Warfare with a distinct sense of 'theatres', advancing/retreating fronts and border skirmishes (more on this in future dev diaries)
Are all new forms of FTL free patch content?
Yes. Naturally we're not going to charge for any form of content meant to replace the loss of old FTL types.

Hyperlane and Sublight Travel
As mentioned, in the Cherryh update. all empires will now start the game with Hyperlanes as their only mode of FTL. By default, hyperlane generation is going to be changed to create more 'islands' and 'choke points', to make for more interesting galactic geography. However, as we know some players do not enjoy the idea of constricted space, we are going to add a slider that controls the general frequency and connectivity of hyperlanes. Turning this up will create a more connected galaxy and make it harder to protect all your systems with static defenses, for players who prefer something closer to the current game's Warp-style movement.

Sublight travel is also being changed somewhat, in the sense that you need to actually travel to the entry point to a particular hyperlane (the arrow inside a system) to enter it, rather than being able to enter any hyperlane from any point outside's a system's gravity well. This means that fleets will move in a more predictable fashion, and interdictions will frequently happen inside systems instead of nearly always being at the edge of them, in particular allowing for fleets to 'guard' important hyperlane entry/exit points. To compensate for the need to move across systems, sublight travel has been sped up, especially with more advanced forms of thrusters.
2017_11_02_2.png


FTL Sensors
Along with the change to FTL, we are also changing the way sensors work. Instead of simply being a circle radiating an arbitrary distance from a ship, station or planet, each level of sensors can now see a certain distance in FTL connections. For example, a ship with level 1 sensors (Radar) will only give sensor coverage of the same system that it is currently in, while a ship with level 2 (Gravitic) sensors will give sensor coverage of that system and all systems connected to it through a Hyperlane or explored Wormhole (more on that below), a ship with level 3 sensors will be able to see systems connected to those systems, and so on. Sensor coverage can be 'blocked' by certain galactic features (more on that below), which will also block propagation into further connected systems. We are currently discussing the implementation of sensor blockers as a potential Starbase component.
2017_11_02_1.png


Wormholes
While Wormhole as a full-fledged FTL type is gone, Wormholes are not. Instead they have been changed into a natural formation that can be encountered while exploring the galaxy. Wormholes come in pairs, essentially functioning as very long hyperlanes that can potentially take a ship across the entire galaxy near-instantly. Natural Wormholes are unstable, and when first encountered, you will not be able to explore them. To explore a Wormhole, you need the Wormhole Stabilization technology, after which a science ship can be sent to stabilize and chart the Wormhole to find out what lies on the other side. If you're lucky, this may be unclaimed space full of valuable systems, but it could just as well be a Devouring Swarm eager to come over for dinner. There is a slider on game setup that controls the frequency of wormhole pairs in the galaxy.
2017_11_02_4.png


Gateways
Gateways is an advanced form of FTL most closely resembling the Wormhole FTL in the live version of the game. While exploring the galaxy, you can find abandoned Gateways that were once part of a massive, galaxy-spanning network. These Gateways are disabled and unusable, but with the Gateway Reactivation mid-game technology and a hefty investment of minerals, they can be restored to working order. Like Wormholes, Gateways allow for near-instant travel to other Gateways, but the difference is that any activated Gateway can be used to travel to any other activated Gateway, and late-game technology allows for the construction of more Gateways to expand the network. Also unlike Wormholes, which cannot be 'closed', Gateways also have the advantage of allowing any empire controlling the system they're in to control who goes through said Gateway - hostile empires and empires to whom you have closed your borders will not be able to use 'your' Gateways to just appear inside of your systems.

When the first Gateway is re-activated, another random Gateway will also be re-activated along with it, so that there is never a situation where you just have a single active Gateway going nowhere. There is a slider on game setup that controls the frequency of abandoned gateways in the galaxy.
2017_11_02_8.png


Jump Drives
Jump Drives and Psi Jump Drives have been changed, and is now an advanced form of FTL that mixes Hyperdrive with some functionality from the old Warp FTL. They allow for a ship to travel normally and very quickly along hyperlanes, but also come equipped with a tactical 'jump' functionality that allows a fleet to make a point-to-point jump ignoring the normal hyperlane limitations. This is done with a special fleet order where you select a target system for the jump (within a certain pre-defined range, with Psi Jump Drives having longer range than regular Jump Drives), after which the fleet charges up its jump drive and creates a temporary wormhole leading to the system. After the fleet makes its 'jump', the Jump Drive will need to recharge, with a significant cooldown before it can be used again, and also applies a debuff to the fleet that reduces its combat effectiveness while the cooldown is in effect. This allows for fleets with Jump Drives to ignore the usual FTL restrictions and skip straight past enemy fleets and stations, but at the cost of leaving themselves vulnerable and potentially stranded for a time afterwards. This design is highly experimental, and may change during the development of Cherryh, but we wanted Jump Drives to not just be 'Hyperdrive IV' but rather to unlock new tactical and strategic possibilities for warfare.

Galactic Terrain
With the switch to Hyperlanes and the creation of strategically important systems and chokepoints, we've also decided to implement something we had always thought was a really interesting idea, but which made little sense without such chokepoints: Galactic Terrain. Specifically, systems with environmental effects and hazards that have profound tactical and strategic effects on ships and empires. This is still something we are in the middle of testing and prototyping, but so far we have created the following forms of Galactic Terrain:
Nebulas block all sensor coverage originating from other systems, meaning that it's impossible for an empire to see what ships and stations are inside a system in a nebula without having a ship or station stationed there, allowing empires to hide their fleets and set up ambushes.
Pulsars interfere with deflector technology, nullifying all ship and station shields in a system with a Pulsar.
Neutron Stars interfere with navigation and ship systems, significantly slowing down sublight travel in a system with a Neutron Star.
Black Holes interfere with FTL, increasing the time it takes for a fleet to charge its emergency FTL and making it more difficult to ships to individually disengage from combat (more on this in a later dev diary).

The above is just a first iteration, and it's something we're likely to tweak and build on more for both the Cherryh update and other updates beyond it, so stay tuned for more information on this.
2017_11_02_3.png

2017_11_02_5.png


That's all for today! I will finish this dev diary by saying that we do not expect everyone to be happy with these changes, but we truly believe that they are necessary to give Stellaris truly great warfare, and that we think you will find the game better for it once you get a chance to try them. We will be doing a Design Corner feature on today's Extraterrestial Thursday stream, where me and Game Designer Daniel Moregård (grekulf) will be discussing the changes, fielding questions and showing off some gameplay in the internal development build. If you want a look at some of these changes in a live game environment, be sure to tune to the Paradox Interactive twitch channel at 4pm CET.

Next week, we're going to talk about war and peace, including the complete rework of the current wargoal system that was made possible by the changes to FTL and system control discussed in this and last week's dev diary. See you then!
 
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Nussor

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Setting Hyperlanes as the default ftl method disappoints me a little. Most or at least very many 4x/strategy space games use these. Stellaris' mechanics make Warp pretty easy to use (games like Stellar Monarch wouldn't even work with it). Hyperlanes fascilitate doomstacks, as I mentioned, while Warp and Wormholes (noone seems to miss those very much) would allow for more hit and run assaults by smaller fleets, especially with higher travel distances.

The devs also don't seem to exploit the possibilities of Hyperlanes to the fullest (at least we get the slider thing, that is good). I'd more or less rip off Star Citizen for their ideas: different sizes of lanes (probably for different travel times) and having most lanes hidden until you get better sensors or hyperlane charts from other empires. A hidden Hyperlane network could also be used with Warp as the default travel method, like what they do with gates and wormholes.


@Bridgecommander
I kinda get the people who hate this drastic change. You can always revert back to a previous patch, of course, but you'd miss out on all the other updates. Maybe someone will make a mod to change the ftl method or the mods you're playing will do this themselves.
 

ISitOnGnomes

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I bought and play Stellaris for one reason, and one reason only, Mods, specifically Star Trek: New Horizons and Star wars, both of which do not use hyper-lanes.
Maybe someone will make a mod to change the ftl method or the mods you're playing will do this themselves.

Wiz actually addressed this earlier in this thread.

We're in frequent communication with modders, including the New Horizons team. If there is functionality they feel they need to be able to continue with the mod, they can absolutely ask for it.
 

LeanneKaos

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You can't do that with warp in current version of stellaris as well...

This is true; and by that token, makes for a much better counterpoint than "don't think of it as the obvious analogy, think of it as something it really isn't" was :p

Right now, for me, all methods of travel (warp, wormhole, hyperlanes) are the same. You jump from system to system. The difference is wait times before and after jump, where you can jump and how many fleets can jump at the same time.

This, though... reads a lot like "Apples and oranges are the same. They're both roundish fruits. The difference is the texture, the colour and the taste..."
 

Reverend Belial

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Since this is still going I figure I may as well throw my hat in the ring too:
I hate hyperlanes with a passion. I tried one game with them and didn't make it past surveying my initial surroundings before I gave up and went back to an FTL system that was actually useable. I understand the reasoning for why they made this decision, but they're going to have to do some significant changes to how hyperlanes actually work if they want me to continue playing this game.
 

stilgarpl

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This, though... reads a lot like "Apples and oranges are the same. They're both roundish fruits. The difference is the texture, the colour and the taste..."
Not really. That was my first impression when I played Stellaris and tried different FTL types. One is "go slowly wherever you want" and the other two are "go faster to certain places".

Compare that to SotS, where you actually have different FTLs that feel different. And that game also have STL, meaning you can turn or stop in deep space and even intercept fleets traveling through deep space. Hiver jump gates for example are ultimate defence - when you attack them, no matter where you strike, you can expect their full army to welcome yours - but that's balanced by really slow expansion.

Really, what's the difference between warping between two systems in Stellaris and jumping from wormhole station to somewhere? The wormhole jump is "instant", but you have to wait for the gate to charge so it's not really instant. It's just "after x days, you will be in that system".
 

Murray Rothbard

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I've never played a hyperlane game and I think this is an ENORMOUS improvement on the current system. I've never liked the idea of cutting out wormholes and warp drive tech entirely, but making all three available at start made hyperlane almost pointless. Sure, you could pick it, but only if you wanted to gimp yourself badly. Now everyone's going to be on the same page, and this plus the elimination of single-fleet doomstacks is going to open a lot of strategic possibilities that have put me off the game for months now. I was so disappointed to learn this isn't in the 1.9 patch, because I'm EAGER to try this out, to discover Gateways and chart Wormholes. It's much more rewarding than offering false choices.
 

JediBear

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FTL Rework

I hate it. Oh gods, I hate it so much. Please tell me I can at least mod it out.

I hate hyperlanes. They make no sense. Space games don't need them and shouldn't have them.

I have to put up with this nonsensical BS in literally every other space game I play because, I don't know, variety is bad and strategy that's too unlike terrestrial strategy is hard or something.

But Stellaris, at least, wasn't one of them.

As if every kind of FTL functionally being some kind of jump drive or other wasn't bad enough...
 

LeanneKaos

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Not really. That was my first impression when I played Stellaris and tried different FTL types. One is "go slowly wherever you want" and the other two are "go faster to certain places".

Compare that to SotS, where you actually have different FTLs that feel different. And that game also have STL, meaning you can turn or stop in deep space and even intercept fleets traveling through deep space. Hiver jump gates for example are ultimate defence - when you attack them, no matter where you strike, you can expect their full army to welcome yours - but that's balanced by really slow expansion.

Really, what's the difference between warping between two systems in Stellaris and jumping from wormhole station to somewhere? The wormhole jump is "instant", but you have to wait for the gate to charge so it's not really instant. It's just "after x days, you will be in that system".

If we're in hostilities: I can tell which system your warp ship is going to and (maybe) respond to it before it gets there. I can't do that with wormhole ships. OTOH, your wormhole ships can't reach as far so (if I have a rough idea of how your network is built) I can predict which systems are out of range and therefore 'safe' and I can potentially attack your wormhole stations themselves to further reduce your reach or possibly even trap your fleet.

In early game, because warp isn't tethered to the stations it has far more expansion options. Wormhole is constrained by range, which requires construction ship time to expand, and is more likely to take a slower and more globular expansion path.
 

ShiroSWR

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Personally, I don't like hyperlanes. That is, however, not due to the concept itself but mainly due to an association, as I grew up with 3 popular series that use the 3 FTL styles (Star Trek - Warp; Andromeda - Hyperlanes; Stargate - Wormholes) and Andromeda became a pretty terrible series.

I can and do fully understand why the decision was made, and TBH I do think the positive changes (less unneeded complexity, but more complexity that adds to a strategy game such as terrain effects or choke-points) outweight the negative ones (loss of start-up wormholes, which I like). If the slider thing "basicly turns a galaxy into a warp system", I'm fine with that as well, though I'd not play that way since it would kind of defeat the point of a railroad design.

I also like that the Devs leave the functionalities in for modders, if people feel so inclined to use them, and essentially salvage both warp jump (Jumpdrive special ability) and wormholes (natural wormholes and to some degree the new connection stations). The new stations in particular are a good addition IMHO, as they apparently essentially work like Stargates. Now if it's possible to expand the hyperlane network with research, by finding new uncharted paths that enemy empires might not know about and then wonder "Where the shroud did THESE guys come from!?", and maybe even have strategic "currents" that allow faster movement in one direction and conversely slower in the other, that could work out very well.

I am aware I am likely in the minority, and I admit I had a pretty annoyed reaction about it when I heard a friend say it, which is why I very carefully read the OP's post twice, and it abated my anger somewhat and convinced me.
 

stilgarpl

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Stargate - Wormholes
Stargates from "Stargate" are much closer to Stellaris' hyperlanes than to wormholes (even though, technically, they are wormholes).

But, look at the mechanics - in Stellaris wormholes, you can go from the gate to anywhere in range and from anywhere to the gate.
Hyperlanes connect some of the closest systems and from those you can go to other systems that are connected to it.

In "Stargate", you can only go from gate to gate, you can't open a wormhole in the middle of nowhere. And you can't just dial to any gate, the gates have an effective range. To reach very far systems you have to go to some "middle" gate and dial from there. Sometimes the gates could "re-route" wormholes automatically, but you needed "middle" gates.
Remember that SG:A episode, when they tried to reposition some gates to connect Atlantis to Milky Way ?

So, you had to follow specific paths on the gate network and you couldn't go off network... Looks like hyperlanes to me.
 

Tisifoni12

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Not like.

To me, as Stellaris is obviously based on Science Fiction genre it makes sense to have every 'state' use the same FTL technology, but allow the player in single player to choose which FTL 'model', or the players in MP to negotiate which FTL 'model'. To put it crudely:
  • Warp Drive if you want a Star Trek universe
  • Hyperdrive if you want a Babylon 5 universe
  • Wormholes if you want a Dune universe
Allowing a tech free for all asks for trouble, on the other hand imposing one system on players risks turning some players off and deters potential future players (like me) from buying into Stellaris
 

ShiroSWR

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Stargates from "Stargate" are much closer to Stellaris' hyperlanes than to wormholes (even though, technically, they are wormholes).

But, look at the mechanics - in Stellaris wormholes, you can go from the gate to anywhere in range and from anywhere to the gate.
Hyperlanes connect some of the closest systems and from those you can go to other systems that are connected to it.

In "Stargate", you can only go from gate to gate, you can't open a wormhole in the middle of nowhere. And you can't just dial to any gate, the gates have an effective range. To reach very far systems you have to go to some "middle" gate and dial from there. Sometimes the gates could "re-route" wormholes automatically, but you needed "middle" gates.
Remember that SG:A episode, when they tried to reposition some gates to connect Atlantis to Milky Way ?

So, you had to follow specific paths on the gate network and you couldn't go off network... Looks like hyperlanes to me.

Not how it works at all, or what I meant. I was refering to the new stations introduced in the Dev Diary, which are explicitly stated to able to connect to multiple other stations across the galaxy and the respective owner gets to choose which the things connect to IF they have more than 2 under their control, freely. If you get 1, you get connected to a random one, which kinda mirrors the original movie situation, and the more you own, the better access you have to the various stations already there, AND you can make new ones.

Stargates proper can also connect to any other Stargate if you know the correct adress (7 symbols for same galaxy, 8 for intergalactic, 9 for specific gate addresses anywhere, such as the original gate-spreader ships like the Destiny), the travel is near instantenous and the range is literally unlimited except for rising energy demands. In SG-1 Season 9 they start dialing to a galaxy at the other end of the universe, and the Ori come from there as well. The bridge between the two galaxies you are refering to is designed to counter-act the energy demands, because short jumps are more energy-efficient, but take longer in return, than a straight connection.
 

Tisifoni12

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Stargate; is that a useful analogy. Stargates were located, with one or two exceptions, on planets, and the only craft that were small enough to go through them were shuttle craft sized. See Babyon 5 and jumpgates.
 

ShiroSWR

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Stargate; is that a useful analogy. Stargates were located, with one or two exceptions, on planets, and the only craft that were small enough to go through them were shuttle craft sized. See Babyon 5 and jumpgates.
Not entirely true. Stargates can be placed in orbit of planets and even things like blackholes and work just fine, because they auto-update their own adresses should that change. Plus, SG-1 Season 9 introduces Supergates, which can transfer entire starships.
 

DizietSma

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Dear Paradox,

If you screw this game up so that my friends and I can no longer play Star Trek New Horizons mod with actual warp then we will not be buying any more DLC from you. Please dont!

Yours sincerely,
Diziet.
 

taivaansusi

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Big dislike.

The reason why I bought Stellaris after being disasppointed to Endless Space was that I saw Stellaris as a strategy platform for many different Sci-Fi settings. At last I could create scenarios similar to Star Trek / Dune / Foundation etc. Not being forced to arbitrary hyperlanes is definitely a plus for reasons iterated here hundreds of times already. They add role-playing flavour and have made possible several awesome mods that fans have made for Stellaris.

When I buy a game, I expect it stays more or less the same I've enjoyed. If you are going to make fundamental changes into core mechanics, make them as optional DLCs. Let those who are fine with the product as it is the possibitly to keep it that way.

Is there any way to opt out from 2.0 update?
 

Derp

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it's a good thing borders are being changed because right now the AI has some... issues... with hyperdrive-only games

20180103150259_1.jpg
 
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