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Stellaris Dev Diary #54 - Ethics Rework

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Now that 1.4 is out, we can finally start properly talking about the 1.5 'Banks' update, which will be a major update with an accompanying (unannounced) expansion. As of right now we cannot provide any details on when 1.5 will come out, or anything about the unannounced expansion, so please don't ask. :)

Today's topic is a number of changes coming to ethics in the 1.5 update. Everything in this diary is part of the free update. Please note that values shown in screenshots are always non-final.

Authoritarian vs Egalitarian
One of the things in Stellaris I was never personally happy with was the Collectivism vs Individualism ethic. While interesting conceptually, the mechanics that the game presented for the ethics simply did not match either their meanings or flavor text, meaning you ended up with a Collectivist ethos that was somehow simultaneously egalitarian and 100% in on slavery, while Individualism was a confused jumble between liberal democratic values and randian free-market capitalism. For this reason we've decided to rebrand these ethics into something that should both be much more clear in its meaning, and match the mechanics as they are.

Authoritarian replaces Collectivist and represents belief in hierarchial rule and orderly, stratified societies. Authoritarian pops tolerate slavery and prefer to live in autocracies.
Egalitarian replaces Individualist and represents belief in individual rights and a level playing field. Egalitarian pops dislike slavery and elitism and prefer to live in democracies.

While I understand this may cause some controversy and will no doubt spark debate over people's interpretation of words like Authoritarian and Individualist, I believe that we need to work with the mechanics we have, and as it stand we simply do not have good mechanics for a Collectivism vs Individualism axis while the mechanics we have fit the rebranded ethics if not perfectly then at least a whole lot better.
2016_12_08_1.png

2016_12_08_5.png


Pop Ethics Rework
Another mechanic that never quite felt satisfying is the ethics divergence mechanic. Not only is it overly simplified with just a single value determining if pops go towards or from empire ethics, the shift rarely makes sense: Why would xenophobe alien pops diverge away from xenophobe just because they're far away from the capital of a xenophobic empire? Furthermore, the fact that pops could have anything from one to three different ethics made it extremely difficult to actually quantify what any individual pop's ethics actually mean for how they relate to the empire. For this reason we've decided to revamp the way pop ethics work in the following way:
  • Each pop in your empire will now only embrace a single, non-fanatic ethic. At the start of the game, your population will be made of up of only the ethics that you picked in species setup, but as your empire grows, its population will become more diverse in their views and wants.
  • Each ethic now has an attraction value for each pop in your empire depending on both the empire's situation and their own situation. For example, enslaved pops tend to become more egalitarian, while pops living around non-enslaved aliens become more xenophilic (and pops living around enslaved aliens more xenophobic). Conversely, fighting a lot of wars will increase the attraction for militarism across your entire empire, while an alien empire purging pops of a particular species will massively increase the attraction for xenophobic for the species being purged.
  • Over time, the ethics of your pops will drift in such a way that it roughly matches the overall attraction of that value. For example, if your materialist attraction sits at 10% for decades, it's likely that after that time, around 10% of your pops will be materialist. There is some random factor so it's likely never going to match up perfectly, but the system is built to try and go towards the mean, so the more overrepresented an ethic is compared to its attraction, the more likely pops are to drift away from it and vice versa.
2016_12_08_3.png


So what does the single ethic per pop mean in terms of how it affects pop happiness? Well, this brings us to the new faction system, which we will cover briefly in this dev diary, and get back to more in depth later.

Faction Rework
One thing we feel is currently missing from Stellaris is agency for your pops. Sure, they have their ethics and will get upset if you have policies that don't suit them, but that's about the only way they have of expressing their desires, and there is no tie-in between pop ethics and the politics systems in the game. To address this and also to create a system that will better fit the new pop ethics, we've decided to revamp the faction system in the following manner:
  • Factions are no longer purely rebel groupings, but instead represent political parties, popular movements and other such interest groups, and mostly only consist of pops of certain ethics. For example, the Supremacist faction desires complete political dominance for their own species, and is made up exclusively of Xenophobic pops, while the Isolationist faction wants diplomatic isolation and a strong defense, and can be joined by both Pacifist and Xenophobe pops. You do not start the game with any factions, but rather they will form over the course of the game as their interests become relevant
  • Factions have issues related to their values and goals, and how well the empire responds to those issues will determine the overall happiness level of the faction. For example, the Supremacists want the ruler to be of their species and are displeased by the presence of free alien populations in the empire. They will also get a temporary happiness boost whenever you defeat alien empires in war.
  • The happiness level of a faction determines the base happiness of all pops belonging to it. This means that where any pop not belonging to a faction has a base happiness of 50%, a pop belonging to a faction that have their happiness reduced to 35% because of their issues will have a base happiness of only 35% before any other modifiers are applied, meaning that displeasing a large and influential faction can result in vastly reduced productivity across your empire. As part of this, happiness effects from policies, xenophobia, slavery, etc have been merged into the faction system, so engaging in alien slavery will displease certain factions instead of having each pop individually react to it.
  • Factions have an influence level determined by the number of pops that belong to it. In addition to making its pops happier, a happy faction will provide an influence boost to their empire.
2016_12_08_4.png

2016_12_08_2.png


We will come back to factions in greater detail in a later dev diary, going over topics such as how separatists and rebellious slaves will work, and how factions can be used to change your empire ethics, but for now we are done for today. Next week we'll be talking about another new feature that we have dubbed 'Traditions and Unity'. See you then!
 
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BeastSoulEyes

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Do not assume buildings and mechanics will 100% stay the same. They won't.

So what will become of the whole Economical/Energy-focused aspect in the game? The new Achievement for Individualists seems to augur that the Egalitarian ethic that will replace it will be a lesser version of Xenophile, about Migration Attraction and such, of course it's merely speculation and I really hope I'm wrong.

That plus I liked that aspect Individualist brought in, it gave a basis with government types like Plutocratic Oligarchy to make a greedy empire.
Was it really worth it messing with that aspect for a name change?? Again the mechanics and flavors of both Collectivist and Individualist were great and made sense.

Well, whatever, it is your game in the end, you do what you want with it. Not sure it will be worth splitting your playerbase over a name change.
 
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These look like good changes. I agree that the ethics diversion system didn't make much sense, and wasn't very interesting. This way I'll actually be paying attention to population ethics and stylizing play around them, instead of just plopping down buildings all over the place.

I am curious about how this is going to affect ethics modifiers though, specifically population modifiers. Will Authoritarian pops still have lower food consumption? Will spiritualists get a "government ethics attraction" bonus? Are these expected to be rebalanced?
 

Dalinski

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The factions are really cool and the thing I look the most towards.

As for the ethics change, personally I think we need more ethic choices then what we currently have. Why not have both the old collectivism/individualism and the new authortarian/egalatrainism together?

I agree with this.....its basically crying out for it. The player can choose.
 
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Ulfing

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I am curious about how this is going to affect ethics modifiers though, specifically population modifiers

I hope they're Empire wide seen as the ones you pick are the government ethics not individuals ethics. My logic there is that currently the people can drift away from the stated ethics but your government never can.
 

Fourthspartan56

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I hope they're Empire wide seen as the ones you pick are the government ethics not individuals ethics. My logic there is that currently the people can drift away from the stated ethics but your government never can.
At the end of diary Wiz explicitly mentioned that Factions can change the government ethos.
 

BlackUmbrellas

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My question about if other ethics were rebalanced to fit into the new system you said that you couldn't see why they wouldn't do it.

That gave me the impression, that you were just assuming all the other answers as well, without knowing anything for sure.
If you really have access to the new files, I guess that's enough of a trustworthy source for me.
I never claimed to have any special accesses- this is why I said I'd be better able to provide sources of some sort if you had specified what you were so uncertain about. Vaguery helps no one. Still, think of this rationally- if they're completely overhauling how the Ethics system works, why in the world wouldn't they rejigger the associated mechanics? If POP units can no longer be fanatical, why wouldn't Paradox adjust things in some way to make up for the loss of that mechanic?
 

No idea

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I dont own the game (altough I want to get when there is a good sale) but i have been following it and I think military VICTORIES should take your pops towards a more warlike (authoritarian?) attitude, but military DEFEATS should take them the other way, dont you think?
 
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I'll deeply mourn collectivism though. Whether you defined it as socialist, "needs of the many", "the greater good", "cogs in the machine" or just the eusocial structure like an ant/bee/termite colony, it is distinctly different to authoritarianism.
I think saying the needs of the many is the same as socialism is also oversimplifying it.
People that argue for capitalism also usually say that it is in the name of the greater good. The disagreement is more that a) both sides disagree on the effects the policies have and b) that the socialist's view is more inequality averse then the capitalist's (if you were asking about a policy that greatly helps the rich by hurting the poor a little, socialists would be more likely to be against it).
I think to really represent it (more) correctly, you would have to have a inequality preferences axis (if Paradox didn't already use that term, calling it "egalitarian" vs "elitist" would probably a fitting label), with socialism being on the left, capitalism in the middle and whatever ideology actively favours inequality on the right and a "pragmatic" vs "idealist" axis, although that one would maybe somewhat overlap with the spiritualist vs materialist axis.

As for ethics divergence, maybe that should be mainly based on current happiness: If the pop is unhappy, it will move away from the currently most prominent factor, otherwise it will move towards it (that is, if you are doing terribly and there are many aliens on your planet, you'll turn xenophobe, if you are happy and there are many aliens nearby you'll turn xenophile). The same should go for happiness in relation to other empires: If you are next to another empire that is doing worse then you are, you'll move away from their ethics, if the other empire is doing better, you'll move towards them.
 
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At the end of diary Wiz explicitly mentioned that Factions can change the government ethos.

Oh I know, I just meant that I think the ethic bonus should be tied to government rather than individuals because its always felt more like a governmental than a population mechanic even though its currently tied to population. Even more so if factions are flipping the government ethos, because the victors presumably would want to encourage/force their ethos.

I think saying the needs of the many is the same as socialism is also oversimplifying it.

Oh it certainly is - I was trying to say that different players interpret it to mean different things and just threw out some examples. Both collectivism and individualism are diverse terms with many interpretations and perhaps its better if some ethics are left up to personal perception than an enforced creed.
 

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I dont own the game (altough I want to get when there is a good sale) but i have been following it and I think military VICTORIES should take your pops towards a more warlike (authoritarian?) attitude, but military DEFEATS should take them the other way, dont you think?
Contrary to popular belief, Adolf Hitler was actually a pacifist.
 
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Fourthspartan56

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Oh I know, I just meant that I think the ethic bonus should be tied to government rather than individuals because its always felt more like a governmental than a population mechanic even though its currently tied to population. Even more so if factions are flipping the government ethos, because the victors presumably would want to encourage/force their ethos.
I would rather they keep ethos bonuses as they are, with a population and empire bonus for each ethos.
 

Alzara

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Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Now that 1.4 is out, we can finally start properly talking about the 1.5 'Banks' update, which will be a major update with an accompanying (unannounced) expansion. As of right now we cannot provide any details on when 1.5 will come out, or anything about the unannounced expansion, so please don't ask. :)

Today's topic is a number of changes coming to ethics in the 1.5 update. Everything in this diary is part of the free update. Please note that values shown in screenshots are always non-final.

Authoritarian vs Egalitarian
One of the things in Stellaris I was never personally happy with was the Collectivism vs Individualism ethic. While interesting conceptually, the mechanics that the game presented for the ethics simply did not match either their meanings or flavor text, meaning you ended up with a Collectivist ethos that was somehow simultaneously egalitarian and 100% in on slavery, while Individualism was a confused jumble between liberal democratic values and randian free-market capitalism. For this reason we've decided to rebrand these ethics into something that should both be much more clear in its meaning, and match the mechanics as they are.

Authoritarian replaces Collectivist and represents belief in hierarchial rule and orderly, stratified societies. Authoritarian pops tolerate slavery and prefer to live in autocracies.
Egalitarian replaces Individualist and represents belief in individual rights and a level playing field. Egalitarian pops dislike slavery and elitism and prefer to live in democracies.

While I understand this may cause some controversy and will no doubt spark debate over people's interpretation of words like Authoritarian and Individualist, I believe that we need to work with the mechanics we have, and as it stand we simply do not have good mechanics for a Collectivism vs Individualism axis while the mechanics we have fit the rebranded ethics if not perfectly then at least a whole lot better.
View attachment 223040
View attachment 223041

Pop Ethics Rework
Another mechanic that never quite felt satisfying is the ethics divergence mechanic. Not only is it overly simplified with just a single value determining if pops go towards or from empire ethics, the shift rarely makes sense: Why would xenophobe alien pops diverge away from xenophobe just because they're far away from the capital of a xenophobic empire? Furthermore, the fact that pops could have anything from one to three different ethics made it extremely difficult to actually quantify what any individual pop's ethics actually mean for how they relate to the empire. For this reason we've decided to revamp the way pop ethics work in the following way:
  • Each pop in your empire will now only embrace a single, non-fanatic ethic. At the start of the game, your population will be made of up of only the ethics that you picked in species setup, but as your empire grows, its population will become more diverse in their views and wants.
  • Each ethic now has an attraction value for each pop in your empire depending on both the empire's situation and their own situation. For example, enslaved pops tend to become more egalitarian, while pops living around non-enslaved aliens become more xenophilic (and pops living around enslaved aliens more xenophobic). Conversely, fighting a lot of wars will increase the attraction for militarism across your entire empire, while an alien empire purging pops of a particular species will massively increase the attraction for xenophobic for the species being purged.
  • Over time, the ethics of your pops will drift in such a way that it roughly matches the overall attraction of that value. For example, if your materialist attraction sits at 10% for decades, it's likely that after that time, around 10% of your pops will be materialist. There is some random factor so it's likely never going to match up perfectly, but the system is built to try and go towards the mean, so the more overrepresented an ethic is compared to its attraction, the more likely pops are to drift away from it and vice versa.
View attachment 223038

So what does the single ethic per pop mean in terms of how it affects pop happiness? Well, this brings us to the new faction system, which we will cover briefly in this dev diary, and get back to more in depth later.

Faction Rework
One thing we feel is currently missing from Stellaris is agency for your pops. Sure, they have their ethics and will get upset if you have policies that don't suit them, but that's about the only way they have of expressing their desires, and there is no tie-in between pop ethics and the politics systems in the game. To address this and also to create a system that will better fit the new pop ethics, we've decided to revamp the faction system in the following manner:
  • Factions are no longer purely rebel groupings, but instead represent political parties, popular movements and other such interest groups, and mostly only consist of pops of certain ethics. For example, the Supremacist faction desires complete political dominance for their own species, and is made up exclusively of Xenophobic pops, while the Isolationist faction wants diplomatic isolation and a strong defense, and can be joined by both Pacifist and Xenophobe pops. You do not start the game with any factions, but rather they will form over the course of the game as their interests become relevant
  • Factions have issues related to their values and goals, and how well the empire responds to those issues will determine the overall happiness level of the faction. For example, the Supremacists want the ruler to be of their species and are displeased by the presence of free alien populations in the empire. They will also get a temporary happiness boost whenever you defeat alien empires in war.
  • The happiness level of a faction determines the base happiness of all pops belonging to it. This means that where any pop not belonging to a faction has a base happiness of 50%, a pop belonging to a faction that have their happiness reduced to 35% because of their issues will have a base happiness of only 35% before any other modifiers are applied, meaning that displeasing a large and influential faction can result in vastly reduced productivity across your empire. As part of this, happiness effects from policies, xenophobia, slavery, etc have been merged into the faction system, so engaging in alien slavery will displease certain factions instead of having each pop individually react to it.
  • Factions have an influence level determined by the number of pops that belong to it. In addition to making its pops happier, a happy faction will provide an influence boost to their empire.
View attachment 223039
View attachment 223037

We will come back to factions in greater detail in a later dev diary, going over topics such as how separatists and rebellious slaves will work, and how factions can be used to change your empire ethics, but for now we are done for today. Next week we'll be talking about another new feature that we have dubbed 'Traditions and Unity'. See you then!

The woman in the second picture appears to be meditating... perhaps on the nature of authoritarianism v eglatarianism! :D
 

Elfwind

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Questions! @Wiz

1) Will species traits play a factor? For example an industrious species might not mind be a slave as much.
2) Will faction suppression affect happiness? I think it would but just to be sure =p
3) For Authoritarian governments, will they have different faction interactions than Egalitarians? It seems Egalitarians would have political parties while for Authoritarians would limit or ban them.
4) Will factions give you influence based on your rivalries as well? It seems they'd be happy to stand with you against empires that oppose their ethos.
5) What other ways will factions influence game-play outside of ethics diverge or influence gain? Will there be events or special faction strongholds etc?
6) Will there be more ways to interact with the leaders of factions? Giving our leaders more personality and making them an involved part of the game would really spice things up!
7) Can factions be eliminated... outside of manual purges?
8) Will armies have a suppressing affect on rebellious worlds held by dissidents?
9) Assassinations? Assassin "leaders?" Spies? =D
10) Will xenos form unique factions or join with your species faction?
11) Will there be more than one faction for each ethic? To represent different ways of handling things?
12) Will ethics divergence based on capital distance be countered by development and better ftl (representing a shrinking galaxy via less travel time and trade)
13) Can happiness be a more direct counter to ethics divergence? 20% max doesn't make much sense if the pop is as happy as it possibly can be.
14) Will dealing with factions and faction events impact governors and grant them experience? Right now they don't get experience from enough sources. (Only building buildings and clearing tiles)
15) Will leaders gain ethics which affect them in any way?
And most importantly
16) Will we be able to interact with factions of other Empires and vis versa? Maybe format rebellions? Give pacifists options for rivals outside of war?

Like where this is going! It adds a good layer to the game =D
 

Soranya

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Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Now that 1.4 is out, we can finally start properly talking about the 1.5 'Banks' update, which will be a major update with an accompanying (unannounced) expansion. As of right now we cannot provide any details on when 1.5 will come out, or anything about the unannounced expansion, so please don't ask. :)

Today's topic is a number of changes coming to ethics in the 1.5 update. Everything in this diary is part of the free update. Please note that values shown in screenshots are always non-final.

Authoritarian vs Egalitarian
One of the things in Stellaris I was never personally happy with was the Collectivism vs Individualism ethic. While interesting conceptually, the mechanics that the game presented for the ethics simply did not match either their meanings or flavor text, meaning you ended up with a Collectivist ethos that was somehow simultaneously egalitarian and 100% in on slavery, while Individualism was a confused jumble between liberal democratic values and randian free-market capitalism. For this reason we've decided to rebrand these ethics into something that should both be much more clear in its meaning, and match the mechanics as they are.

Authoritarian replaces Collectivist and represents belief in hierarchial rule and orderly, stratified societies. Authoritarian pops tolerate slavery and prefer to live in autocracies.
Egalitarian replaces Individualist and represents belief in individual rights and a level playing field. Egalitarian pops dislike slavery and elitism and prefer to live in democracies.

While I understand this may cause some controversy and will no doubt spark debate over people's interpretation of words like Authoritarian and Individualist, I believe that we need to work with the mechanics we have, and as it stand we simply do not have good mechanics for a Collectivism vs Individualism axis while the mechanics we have fit the rebranded ethics if not perfectly then at least a whole lot better.
View attachment 223040
View attachment 223041

Pop Ethics Rework
Another mechanic that never quite felt satisfying is the ethics divergence mechanic. Not only is it overly simplified with just a single value determining if pops go towards or from empire ethics, the shift rarely makes sense: Why would xenophobe alien pops diverge away from xenophobe just because they're far away from the capital of a xenophobic empire? Furthermore, the fact that pops could have anything from one to three different ethics made it extremely difficult to actually quantify what any individual pop's ethics actually mean for how they relate to the empire. For this reason we've decided to revamp the way pop ethics work in the following way:
  • Each pop in your empire will now only embrace a single, non-fanatic ethic. At the start of the game, your population will be made of up of only the ethics that you picked in species setup, but as your empire grows, its population will become more diverse in their views and wants.
  • Each ethic now has an attraction value for each pop in your empire depending on both the empire's situation and their own situation. For example, enslaved pops tend to become more egalitarian, while pops living around non-enslaved aliens become more xenophilic (and pops living around enslaved aliens more xenophobic). Conversely, fighting a lot of wars will increase the attraction for militarism across your entire empire, while an alien empire purging pops of a particular species will massively increase the attraction for xenophobic for the species being purged.
  • Over time, the ethics of your pops will drift in such a way that it roughly matches the overall attraction of that value. For example, if your materialist attraction sits at 10% for decades, it's likely that after that time, around 10% of your pops will be materialist. There is some random factor so it's likely never going to match up perfectly, but the system is built to try and go towards the mean, so the more overrepresented an ethic is compared to its attraction, the more likely pops are to drift away from it and vice versa.
View attachment 223038

So what does the single ethic per pop mean in terms of how it affects pop happiness? Well, this brings us to the new faction system, which we will cover briefly in this dev diary, and get back to more in depth later.

Faction Rework
One thing we feel is currently missing from Stellaris is agency for your pops. Sure, they have their ethics and will get upset if you have policies that don't suit them, but that's about the only way they have of expressing their desires, and there is no tie-in between pop ethics and the politics systems in the game. To address this and also to create a system that will better fit the new pop ethics, we've decided to revamp the faction system in the following manner:
  • Factions are no longer purely rebel groupings, but instead represent political parties, popular movements and other such interest groups, and mostly only consist of pops of certain ethics. For example, the Supremacist faction desires complete political dominance for their own species, and is made up exclusively of Xenophobic pops, while the Isolationist faction wants diplomatic isolation and a strong defense, and can be joined by both Pacifist and Xenophobe pops. You do not start the game with any factions, but rather they will form over the course of the game as their interests become relevant
  • Factions have issues related to their values and goals, and how well the empire responds to those issues will determine the overall happiness level of the faction. For example, the Supremacists want the ruler to be of their species and are displeased by the presence of free alien populations in the empire. They will also get a temporary happiness boost whenever you defeat alien empires in war.
  • The happiness level of a faction determines the base happiness of all pops belonging to it. This means that where any pop not belonging to a faction has a base happiness of 50%, a pop belonging to a faction that have their happiness reduced to 35% because of their issues will have a base happiness of only 35% before any other modifiers are applied, meaning that displeasing a large and influential faction can result in vastly reduced productivity across your empire. As part of this, happiness effects from policies, xenophobia, slavery, etc have been merged into the faction system, so engaging in alien slavery will displease certain factions instead of having each pop individually react to it.
  • Factions have an influence level determined by the number of pops that belong to it. In addition to making its pops happier, a happy faction will provide an influence boost to their empire.
View attachment 223039
View attachment 223037

We will come back to factions in greater detail in a later dev diary, going over topics such as how separatists and rebellious slaves will work, and how factions can be used to change your empire ethics, but for now we are done for today. Next week we'll be talking about another new feature that we have dubbed 'Traditions and Unity'. See you then!

I am indifferent to sceptical about the new Ethical drift System (the renaming is nice)
But i reall am looking forwrd towards the faction changes.

thumbs up"!
 

Derdiedas

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Authoritarianism does not necessitate oppression. You're free to ban slavery and roleplay a benevolent autocrat, but it doesn't make your society in any way equal. As for things like hive minds, as I said, they can't really be done well under the current ethics system period, this does not change that.

And this is why I agree with people who say that Authoritarianism is a name for a government type, for something about actual distribution of power, but better name for an ethos, something about deeper believes about society, universe and everything, would be Hierarchical? Something that signify belief in that [species_name] is divided into different groups based on biology/society/day of birth and they have different place and role in society and this division is something good, while egalitarians believe that either there are no such distinction or they should be meaningless in the grander scheme of things.

But could we also talk about something slightly different? Namely about how the new icons are hideous? Both are pretty overcomplicated and IMHO don't mesh well with the simpler style of the previous ones. And the fact that authoritarian icon looks kinda like head of devil (or Krampus who is suddenly in vogue) while the one for egalitarians looks more like symbol for justice - as most of us in the West are conditioned to recognize - is not helping to fit them with the rest of the symbols that is mostly ethically agnostic. If I may suggest change, choose a horizontally stripped triangle for an Authoritarianism/Hierarchical and either solid square for Egalitarianism or if you insist on balanced scales, choose stylized long horizontal rectangle over a triangle, not this antiqued piece.
 
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Sopbucket

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I dont own the game (altough I want to get when there is a good sale) but i have been following it and I think military VICTORIES should take your pops towards a more warlike (authoritarian?) attitude, but military DEFEATS should take them the other way, dont you think?
I think, if a planet is bombarded or occupied during a war, it would make sense for a "recently occupied" modifier to make the inhabitants of that planet move toward pacifism. On the other hand, if a nation has to cede a whole bunch of planets at the end of a war, it would make sense for a "revanchism" type modifier to move pops toward militarism on an empire scale.
 
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sauron_33

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The rework of ethics and the effect on factions seems like a very good direction to take this. I look forward to this patch very much.
 

Scourgeclaw

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I'm incredibly concerned as to exactly how much weight these factions are going to have to be honest.

What I'm really fearing is the possibility of factions simply dictating how players manage their empire and spending more time interacting and working to counteract your own people's factions. rather than interacting with other empires.

Furthermore, as someone who regularly plays as an expansionist slaver race, I'm regularly forced to conquer planets and subject the new pops to slavery as a means of indoctrinating the new world. My fear is that doing such in 1.5 would immediately dump a massive amount of power into one of the factions and cause rebellions galore.

I imagine this is all being considered to some degree already by the devs so, I'll wait to raise the flag of outrage just yet but I'ma remain concerned about how well the new factions will work until I get my hands on it. Time will tell how things play out I suppose.

Fingers crossed for 1.5; really looking forward to it~
 
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Yenzen

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I'm incredibly concerned as to exactly how much weight these factions are going to have to be honest.

What I'm really fearing is the possibility of factions simply dictating how players manage their empire and spending more time interacting and working to counteract your own people's factions. rather than interacting with other empires.

Furthermore, as someone who regularly plays as an expansionist slaver race, I'm regularly forced to conquer planets and subject the new pops to slavery as a means of indoctrinating the new world. My fear is that doing such in 1.5 would immediately dump a massive amount of power into one of the factions and cause rebellions galore.

I imagine this is all being considered to some degree already by the devs so, I'll wait to raise the flag of outrage just yet but I'ma remain concerned about how well the new factions will work until I get my hands on it. Time will tell how things play out I suppose.

Fingers crossed for 1.5; really looking forward to it~

As I understand it, being the slaving scum that you are will inspire your people to love slaving more, while causing distress and desire for freedom among the enslaved.

Keep your people strong, keep the slaves suppressed and unable to rise up.
 
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