Stellaris Dev Diary #201: Galactic Imperium

[methegrate]

But the Custodian doesn't actually have anything interesting to do as a benevolent defender of the Community; they just get another fleet and some bland resolutions. They can't end conflicts amongst members to reduce vulnerability to crises or other threats. They can't setup resource or military transfers to community members from the community as a whole, to aid the protection / recovery of weak members. They can't prevent community members from victimizing weaker members of the community (blocking offensive wars, protecting primitives). They can't set community policy interactions (commercial / research pacts, migration treaties amongst members). They can't encourage political freedom (limits to faction crackdowns). They can't construct gateways to ensure rapid response to threats and more effective trade (would also be helpful with allies in general). They aren't actually expected or required to intervene against the crisis or anything else because it doesn't look like it will affect how anyone votes on anything. All of this would be a custodian acting as, well, a custodian of the galaxy.

It's great that we can do the galactic imperium thing in a more substantive way. And that Spritiualist Megacorps will be included in the "Bow before your god emperor" options, which fit Gospel of the Masses really well (establishing official state churches in every planet, via Branch Offices!), though I've wondered why there's no "Family Company" imperial succession for Megacorps in general. But the most interesting part of having diplomatic influence is actually exerting that influence in a substantive way on others - and paying a price in diplomatic accountability for it - and that's still limited to more or less the later stage Galactic Community resolutions. Custodian doesn't have it.

I agree with this. It kind of feels like the Custodian is being set up as just sort of an intermediate step on the road to the imperium. Your best case scenario as an egalitarian is to just keep things in a holding pattern and leave the story incomplete.

I'm on board with the idea that the Custodianship is one step toward what the galaxy will eventually become. I can see that narrative, essentially "we have learned that the dangers of the broader universe demand a stronger response." Something like that. But it seems like there should be two "end goal" positions.

Authoritarians should want to evolve the Custodianship into an Imperium, with them at the helm. That makes sense. Egalitarians should want their own, completely separate, vision for what the Custodianship becomes though. Something with its own narrative and game mechanics. (Please, emphasize the mechanics. Flavor text is not enough.)

Then make it possible to move between these two end goals. Make it possible to build a republic out of the imperium, or to have an emperor seize power from the republic. But it does feel kind of half-finished if the idea is just that the Custodian and galactic council are sort of permanent halfway points toward an imperium that may or may not happen.



Also, someone mentioned this earlier, but when is this all supposed to happen? I mean... the Crisis kind of ends the game. If this happens after the Crisis occurs, will there be much gameplay left to this feature? I mean, if there are no independent empires left to declare war on, and no Unbidden or Prethoryn to pop up, literally what will the player do while waiting to see if someone rebels against their empire?

 

[DrNukeLear]

I assume there's no restrictions on being head of the Imperium as a Criminal Heritage Megacorp, right? Would this change the way the Imperial Concession branch building works?

As you are the galactic government, would that negate the need to operate covertly. To take the Star wars analogy further, would the planetary governor arrest the stormtroopers moving the emperors illicit narcotics? Would the emperors narcotics be illegal? Would Galpol arrest the emperor?

What strange times await us.

 

[Don_Quigleone]

If you have a hegemony before declaring yourself galactic emperor, does your federation get dissolved along with everybody else's?

Likewise, if it does get dissolved, is there a way of getting some of its bonuses back? (eg trade income modifiers if you're in a trade league etc.)

 

[Arithmetician]

It would be nice that, if you had an existing federal armada when you formed the Imperium, it could be retained and absorbed into the Galactic Defense Force (or rather, the Imperial Armada after the proclamation of the Imperium), if one exists. Since, as others noted earlier in the thread, that could otherwise be a significant loss of fleet power for you.

 

[DanielPrates]

Again, with the additions from the espionage system, favors can now encompass coercion from blackmail or similar means... which would count as you being devious.

Additionally, in the version of the game that we currently have, it can also be construed as bribing important officials in the target government, which also fits the "devious" flavor... even if that is a rather trivial tactic for a human player in practice.

oh the sheer evil! I take it all back, that is more than enough - no need for the 'again' thing, I should have bowed right at the first time.

Whatever man, if you think this is enough, great, I hope you have a ball coercing favors to become Emperor or whatever, and if you're not quite there yet, coercing some more. Or getting people to happily vote for you to become their master, since, AGAIN, there seems to be very few and uninteresting ways to get there.

In any case I will say this, this whole new nemesis/be the crisis/imperium thing appears like a lot, but to me at least sounds like yet another thing I will do only once and then forget about it. I remember being this happy about the (then) upcoming Galactic Community, but when I actually got to play it, it got old quickly. This probably will too. (EDIT: thought beating the crap out of the wannabe emperor may prove to be the really interesting thing to do).

In this whole new DLC, only the intel/espionage feels like a true overall permanent improvement.

 

[DrNukeLear]

If you have a hegemony before declaring yourself galactic emperor, does your federation get dissolved along with everybody else's?

Likewise, if it does get dissolved, is there a way of getting some of its bonuses back? (eg trade income modifiers if you're in a trade league etc.)

It would be nice that, if you had an existing federal armada when you formed the Imperium, it could be retained and absorbed into the Galactic Defense Force (or rather, the Imperial Armada after the proclamation of the Imperium), if one exists. Since, as others noted earlier in the thread, that could otherwise be a significant loss of fleet power for you.

Judging from the OP - All federations, lose any member which is part of the Galactic Community. Any federation which has 1 or fewer members is then disolved.

 

[Arithmetician]

In all likelihood, becoming Emperor would come from already having a supermajority in the Galactic Senate, in turn derived from the bonus to diplomatic weight from Fleet Power gained from the Supremacy diplomatic stance - which is actually quite fitting enough for anyone who would be audacious enough to declare themselves Galactic Emperor. You would need a powerful military to enforce that will on the galaxy.

Getting other nations to vote you in as Emperor through favors would be an edge case, in all honesty. But it could speed up the process a little bit.

 

[klopkr]

I see that all of starwars is now doable in stellaris.

Can't wait for the Galaxy Quest DLC lol

 

[Arithmetician]

Yeah, I know that you would in practice lose your federal fleet, because your federation would be dissolved too. I was just speaking hypothetically, since it's a shame to lose your own federation's fleet when you become emperor. And from a flavor standpoint, you'd want to keep your own federal fleet if you were able to (not that it's currently permitted by game mechanics). Forcing the other federations' fleets to disband makes sense though, flavor-wise.

 

[Ovan]

I agree with this. It kind of feels like the Custodian is being set up as just sort of an intermediate step on the road to the imperium. Your best case scenario as an egalitarian is to just keep things in a holding pattern and leave the story incomplete.

I'm on board with the idea that the Custodianship is one step toward what the galaxy will eventually become. I can see that narrative, essentially "we have learned that the dangers of the broader universe demand a stronger response." Something like that. But it seems like there should be two "end goal" positions.

Authoritarians should want to evolve the Custodianship into an Imperium, with them at the helm. That makes sense. Egalitarians should want their own, completely separate, vision for what the Custodianship becomes though. Something with its own narrative and game mechanics. (Please, emphasize the mechanics. Flavor text is not enough.)

Then make it possible to move between these two end goals. Make it possible to build a republic out of the imperium, or to have an emperor seize power from the republic. But it does feel kind of half-finished if the idea is just that the Custodian and galactic council are sort of permanent halfway points toward an imperium that may or may not happen.



Also, someone mentioned this earlier, but when is this all supposed to happen? I mean... the Crisis kind of ends the game. If this happens after the Crisis occurs, will there be much gameplay left to this feature? I mean, if there are no independent empires left to declare war on, and no Unbidden or Prethoryn to pop up, literally what will the player do while waiting to see if someone rebels against their empire?

As much as I love this I really never did think about how it does feel kind of half done without a second side to things, and how the Custodian just kind of... exists I guess?

I'd like to see pretty much what you said for more benevolent egalitarian/xenophile/pacifist empires, while the empire is more tailored to the other spectrums.

Be able to build gateways, be able to pass instant resolutions to end wars or resolutions that prevent empires from declaring on each other, could even have the same rebel system or a power system that can cause the newly centralized galactic community to shift between ethics, hell you could even rename the entire event into a "centralization" event and then base the actual "Imperium" after various ethics.

The Imperium has the unique flavor we see here, being authoritarian based and very domineering.

The Republic has its own flavor, being egalitarian/pacifist based, running a series of laws that allows construction of certain megastructures in other empires, forcefully ending wars and removing the ability to vassalize other nations, keeping the galactic senate balanced, etc.

Then I could see something for the Spiritualist side where you're essentially forcing yourself on everyone as a God-Emperor of sorts, it's still authoritarian but plays more into forcing ethics shifts and taking tributes in the name of them. Though this seems more flavor wise so perhaps just the Republic and Imperium work the best.

 

[Super-Soviet]

As Imperial Centre, could I found a new Federation after becoming the Imperium?

 

[turbosr]

If the war ends in a Status Quo/White Peace, the Rebels secede from the Imperium, and their Federation stays intact.

I was wondering Post civil war with status quo instead of having two separate Federations. Why not have two working styles of government both the Imperium as well as the Galactic Community?

 

[Maethendias]

Your ignoring the part of the post where he's made that its limiting RP.

Also no, roleplay doesn't magically fix anything.

Nor is stellaris officially a rpg anywhere.

i was agreeing with him lmfao

and yes, stellaris IS officially a rpg, paradox themselves call it that

 

[FleetMaster]

Now that Perseverance has landed on Mars, if it finds those untrusty Xenos, I will become the Senate, OK? For a peaceful, safer society.

 

[Sighfer]

Now that Perseverance has landed on Mars, if it finds those untrusty Xenos, I will become the Senate, OK? For a peaceful, safer society.

But what if the senate wants me to become Emperor, but all I want is to tend to my cabbages in my Agrarian Idyll Commie utopia?

 

[redsquirrel456]

Will there be future additions for rebellion and internal dissent all the way up the ladder, as opposed to just one huge all or nothing war once you've reached Galactic Imperium level? I really want any and all empires to have a chance to collapse, and deeper systems to deal with the internal workings of your empire. This is almost too macro in my opinion.

 

[FleetMaster]

But what if the senate wants me to become Emperor, but all I want is to tend to my cabbages in my Agrarian Idyll Commie utopia?

Then you shall be demoted, and rewarded with the rank of Ungrateful Rebel Scum.

 

[Zanotir]

I don't see a reason for the forced change to authoritarian/imperial. Granted, that was the case in Star Wars, but there's nothing in the situation actually requiring it. Athens pulled this one on the Delian League after leading it against Persian Crisis, all the while remaining a democracy.

The core of the situation is a nation in a community gaining a leadership role in fighting some threat and then usurping the community's mechanisms for its own gains and power. There's nothing in this scenario that depends on a particular government in that leading nation.

In gameplay terms it would lead to weird cases like "Ok, just going to stay for some last events for this playthrough - i.e. my custodianship follow-up - but I want to keep my technocracy, I don't want to switch to authoritarian again". Unless Pdx has some equally interesting options for non auth/imperial empires coming that they haven't announced yet, they should either just remove the forced government change outright, or have usurping the community come in several flavors with Imperium being one of them.

 

[Thecarlocarlone]

>Be me
>Democratic crusader
>Fights and defeats all who can undermine peace in the galaxy
>Pass resolutions to ensure the end of slavery and universal rigths to all sentient life
>Tries to win control over other nation through democratic means to assure egalitarian values and peace are respected
>Becomes a fanatic autoritarian empire

 

[Arithmetician]

True... nothing about the process inherently has to be imperial, as opposed to dictatorial... but it is still a significant centralization of political power, and the usurpation of democratic norms is usually seen as being authoritarian in real life.

On an unrelated note, I know it was said earlier that you can reform your authority and shift ethics after becoming the Imperium. To which my brother started coming up with some convoluted scheme involving many steps, spanning decades of in-game time, to evolve the Imperium into a Democracy again (while still holding absolute power over the rest of the galaxy). But, to any devs still here, is it even possible to eventually revert to a democratic and/or egalitarian government while you're the Imperium, or are you blocked from doing so somehow?