Stellaris Dev Diary #130 - New and Changed Technologies in Le Guin

[Kukumarro]

Can you build anything at all in a Resort planet? Are there amenity/unity producting jobs, or something like that?

 

[Heretic Saint]

Sweet! I have to say, as much as I have serious concerns regarding some few aspects of 2.2 (taking away the ability to set sector borders will probably remain a pet peeve to me for quite some time, similar to what was done to Alliances or Ruler ships), by and large the changes are supremely exciting and I can't wait to be able to play this.

Immigration Pull for a Penal Colony sounds a bit weird at first glance, but I understand that's just abstraction, and this is probably the most elegant if not the only way to handle this.

Together with previous statements that we'd be able to establish colonies pretty much anywhere, limited only by economic concerns, I am looking forward to establish prisons on some forsaken desert, ice or vulcan worlds!

Also, we are aware that some people consider straight bonus technologies to be boring, but it would both be unfeasible and entirely undesirable for all of the hundreds of technologies that you can research in Stellaris to require active engagement on the part of the player - we'd simply end up with a whole lot more of the same kind of tedious chore that was the old building upgrade system.

Would there be room for some compromise, introducing more risks and associated policies to some of the straight bonuses like it was done for the True AI or Lineage techs? For example, a small chance that, at some point in time, a new batch of Gene Crops ends up with a mutation negatively affecting Food yield or (at the risk of invoking conspiracy theories) having an adverse effect on Pops? Or that one of the advanced mining techniques ends up damaging the environment, resulting in the application of a planetary modifier on a random world (with active Mining Districts) that can only be removed again with some expensive planetary edict?

I think it's sensible that most upgrade techs really are just flat bonuses, but I'd love to see more optional "Risk Techs" in the game. Their use could also serve to introduce additional Faction Issues!

 

[Tekore]

Can Determined Exterminators/Devouring Swarm use prison planets or a variant thereof to stock their larders/store extra battery charges?

 

[Pale Blue]

If resort worlds arent affected by their quality and you cant build districts and buildings on them wouldnt that lead to the most useless planets being your resorts? Like a resourcepoor tomb world?

 

[sortulv]

Can you build anything at all in a Resort planet? Are there amenity/unity producting jobs, or something like that?

Organic sanctuaries maybe?

 

[Grönis]

This is a game with FTL, psychic gods and space dragons. Stellaris isn’t meant to be realistic, it’s a GS/4x SciFi trope playground. Prison planets are a fun staple of SciFi so they fit in the game regardless of how effective they’d really be.

That's not my point, all im saying is that instead of lowering crime for other planets, why not just give them another resource as it would make more sense? Like more influence, more unity or whatever. You could also have the prison colony make amenities for the other planets as the prisoners are forced to do manual work.

 

[T80U]

Wonderful changes, but imo it could be better in one aspect. Instead of simply changing upgrade spam to "+10% to X" i think you could borrow a system of institutions from EU4 or techsystem from CK2. When you research a "+10% to X" tech it is slowly (or fast) implemented in all of your colonies, which can be speeded up by policies, money, ministers, adjscent planets with tech or else. It has more realism, impact and immersion of ruling a large empire than just +10%, but lacks disadvantage of overwhelming micromanagement. It will also go along with new trade route system making trade a highway for hightech, like it, actually, is.

 

[BluBot MAP]

So it's means that I can send all dissents and xenos to gulag?

 

[Calvax]

That's not my point, all im saying is that instead of lowering crime for other planets, why not just give them another resource as it would make more sense? Like more influence, more unity or whatever. You could also have the prison colony make amenities for the other planets as the prisoners are forced to do manual work.

It is your point. Your objection is that a prison planet wouldn’t realistically lower crime, my counter is that realism is neither here nor there. Prison planets reducing crime are an old SciFi staple and are a great fit for stellaris.

 

[sortulv]

It goes against all scientific research that incarceration lowers crime. Incarceration has never worked as a deterrent to criminal elements, nor does the lowered criminal population affect the overall crime rate in any meaningful way. It would be more realistic if the other systems got something else instead of lower crime rate.

The point of penal colonies is that they are not jails - they are more like exiles. And sending anyone with criminal experience to another planet will make crime schools less common.
Also, a good penal colony can be like a norwegian prison - more like a colony than anything else, just that all the other colonists are "former" criminals (may be the reason why the local crime rates are high)

 

[Kapitalisti]

I hope we can recruit elite soldiers from those hellish penal worlds ala Sardaukar and Salusa Secundus.

 

[_AnDy_]

the game is still pretty much with a tech tree its just hidden
if you look on the internet on how tech cards are drawn then you can pretty much force game into giving you techs you want

So why not just have a tech tree in the game - Why must I be forced to use a 3rd party method?

 

[Spidee]

Ok Selusa Secundus inspired question:
Will making a penal colony on a low habitability planet actually significantly increase upkeep? Or does penal colony have a significant reduction to maintenance costs by default?

 

[Grönis]

The point of penal colonies is that they are not jails - they are more like exiles. And sending anyone with criminal experience to another planet will make crime schools less common.
Also, a good penal colony can be like a norwegian prison - more like a colony than anything else, just that all the other colonists are "former" criminals (may be the reason why the local crime rates are high)

I totally get that, and im sorry for bringing up abstract concepts but even if all criminals where to be executed, it still wouldn't lower crime rate. No penalty has ever been a deterrent to crime and we do have the science to back this up. Having a high risk of getting caught works as a deterrent, as do social safety nets to prevent the lowest class of society to resort to crime (not saying that high income classes don't commit crime, just that they are not as pronounced in crime rates).

And once again, I'm not saying that this concept of having penal colonies are bad, it fits the game and the genre like a glove. But lets make it realistic while we're at it. The populist factions might like it, the higher stratas might like it, but in reality, it wouldn't lower crime rate.

 

[Serenity84]

But with the new systems you could rework terraforming to make it a bit more interesting and involved, by creating terraforming colonies.

Make the colony only able to build terraforming buildings and districts, the buildings would cost terraforming gases and liquids to maintain and speed up the terraforming process, depending on how many there are. After the process is finished you can then replace the buildings with a proper colony...

That's a nice idea

 

[Brian McG]

Would it be possible to have lesser designated planets, say agri World which gives say 10% boost to food on just that planet, which can only be set if the planet meets prerequisites, for an agri world it has to have say at least two or three farming districts, and it reduces the output of other types of districts?

 

[Kernog95]

In the same kind than Resort planets, will we have the possibility to build "Resort habitats"? Like a planet-wide Center Park, or a cruise ship perpetually orbiting a planet, à la Fifth Element?

Also, rather than varying the output effectiveness, it might be easier, in this perspective, to give a bonus to worlds/habitats presenting unique specificities:
* Worlds inhabited by primitive species
* Worlds with blockers (or what will come after), which would act as "natural wonders" of sort
* Shrouded worlds (for resort habitats)
* Gaia worlds
* Worlds with titanic life-forms
* Worlds with "shadow play" modifier
etc.

I specifically like the first two ideas, as it would offer a boon to preserving a primitive species population, or colonizing a world with a lot of blockers.

 

[Ursul]

"Arcane deciphering", we are getting magic in Stellaris?

 

[SacremPyrobolum]

Penal Colonies and Resort Colonies but no Hive Worlds or Foundry Worlds? The latter would be so much more useful than the former in my opinion and who in their right mind would designate an entire planet for the purposes of leisure or imprisonment? Are these worlds de-facto included in the update with the new economic system?

And why the limit? Its going to be one of the first things removed by mods like with megastructures. It like I keep saying, things should not be arbitrarily restricted they should be designed in such a way that a player is strongly encouraged to limit their usage. Penal worlds and Resort worlds look like they provide powerful bonuses at a high cost, a player who makes every other world one of them would quickly see the error of their ways without a limit, like fielding too many Titans.

Props on being able to spell leisure though. It took me a while and I had to look back up at the OP.

 

[Me_]

MegaCorporations next week? Sweet.