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Stellaris Dev Diary #101 - Marauders, Pirates and the Horde

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today, we continue talking about the Apocalypse expansion and 2.0 'Cherryh' update, on the topic of Marauders and Pirates.

Marauders (Apocalypse Feature)
Marauders are a new type of non-playable empire that those with the Apocalypse expansion can encounter in the galaxy. They are essentially nomadic FTL societies that have eschewed planetary living in favor of living on ships and stations in and around a handful of resource-rich systems, subsisting largely on raiding each other and extorting tribute from settled empires. Being born spacefarers, they are hardy warriors and expert ship crew, able to muster impressive fleets despite their relative lack of technology compared to other older civilizations (such as Fallen Empires). Marauders are always hostile to regular empires, but will generally not attack them unless you attempt to enter their home systems, or they are in the process of raiding them.
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Marauders will occasionally set out to raid settled empires they have established contact with. Before raiding, they will offer said empire a chance to pay them off with a hefty tribute of minerals, energy or food. If you refuse, they will send a fleet to that empire's territory, pillaging stations and raiding planets for slaves, stopping only when they are either destroyed or satisfied with the amount of booty they have amassed. While in the process of raiding, they can still be bought off with tribute, but the price will be raised significantly from if you just agreed to pay them off from the start. Settled empires can pay a Marauder empire to conduct a raid on one of their rivals, both diverting their attention from yourself and potentially weakening that rival's military and economy. A Marauder empire can be wiped out by destroying all stations and ships in their home systems, but these systems are well defended and will take a powerful mid to late game navy to deal with.
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Settled empires can also enlist the aid of Marauders as mercenaries. At the start of the game, it is possible to hire them as Generals or Admirals with a high starting skill and special traits, and after a certain amount of time has passed, the option to hire their fleets will also be unlocked. Marauder fleets cost a large energy payment up-front, and consist of a fixed-size fleet that cannot be split, merged or disbanded, with a leader that cannot be reassigned. The fleet does not count towards your naval cap and will not cost any maintenance, but will only serve you for a period of 5 years, after which you will have to renew their contract by paying the full cost again.
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Horde Mid-Game Crisis (Apocalypse Feature)
Also new in the Apocalypse expansion is something we're calling the Horde Mid-Game Crisis. This is an event chain that can trigger after the first 100 years of the game, where one of the Marauder empires unifies under a Great Khan. Once this happens, the Marauder empire becomes a Horde, and will begin expanding in all directions, claiming empty systems and sending fleets to destroy the Starbases of any empire that will not submit to the Khan. At any time, it possible for a regular empire to submit to the Khan and become a Satrapy, a type of subject that has to pay part of its income and naval capacity in tribute to the Khan, but is otherwise left to its own devices. The Horde will grow stronger for every system it conquers and Satrapy it acquires, but it is a fragile construct, held together only by the personality of the Khan. If the Great Khan is killed in battle, or falls victim to disease or assassination, the Horde will collapse, at which point one of several things will happen to the Horde and its Satrapies: It may dissolve into a myriad of squabbling successor states, or a new, democratic Federation may form out of its ashes. Regardless, the appearance of the Khan and the Horde is sure to shake up the galactic scene of any game in which it makes an appearance.
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Pirate Rework (Cherryh Feature)
Finally, though not directly related to Marauders, we wanted to mention that we have made some changes to pirates in the 2.0 'Cherryh' update. Back in the dev diary about Starbases, we talked about discouraging 'snaking' and leaving empty systems inside your borders by adjusting the influence costs. This turned out not to work so well in testing for a variety of reasons, and so we decided on a different solution, by expanding on the concept of pirates. Now, once the Birth of Space Piracy event has fired, Pirates will be able to spawn in empty systems bordering your empire. These pirates will attack your systems and pillage your stations until they are destroyed, and will grow stronger and more numerous over the course of the game. They are especially likely to spawn in systems that are fully surrounded by your borders, making any empty systems in the middle of your empire into potential hotbeds of trouble that you are likely going to want to take control of sooner or later. As part of these changes, we have removed most of the static pirate spawns in the galaxy, leaving only their home system with the Pirate Galleon.
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That's all for today! Next week we'll continue talking about Cherryh and the Apocalypse expansion, on the topic of Edicts and Unity Ambitions.
 

Shaftoe

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If they're always hostile, then how an AI Federation would act if it's attacked by random Marauders? By Horde? Will said Federation ever strike back with the purpose of destroying the enemy? And if it won't, then how you expect them to survive and remain even semi-competitive?

How Players+AI composed Federation will act? Will we be able to commit federation members' fleets to the cause of fighting with random Marauders? Will federation members' fleets automatically come to help if player's space is attacked by Marauders/Horde?

Really, I think we need some military diplomacy. Something like target designation for allied fleets, to which friendly AI (or human) would heed. Since Cherryh is focused on war, such feature is absolutely necessary.
 

Silens

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Hm. Not really convinced overall, but I guess I'll see in game. Those features (especially the pirate rework) seem to be more annoying than fun. I don't know if you realize everyone, but pirates are just military units that keep trying to destroy your space stations, and it appears that there's almost no way to permanently get rid of them in 2.0.

But well, that's the kind of thing that relies on balance and tweaking, so let's wait and see.

It will give you and the AI a reason to keep your fleet dispersed, updated and ready-to-go.

And once all space is claimed (with no free systems), pirate spawn will most likely stop. If anything, it will make the early-to-mid-game far more interesting.
 

Niora

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Hm. Not really convinced overall, but I guess I'll see in game. Those features (especially the pirate rework) seem to be more annoying than fun. I don't know if you realize everyone, but pirates are just military units that keep trying to destroy your space stations, and it appears that there's almost no way to permanently get rid of them in 2.0.

But well, that's the kind of thing that relies on balance and tweaking, so let's wait and see.

That's just how pirates work. In history piracy only became obsolete because world powers developed a proper navy to hunt pirates.
 

Radene

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Hm. Not really convinced overall, but I guess I'll see in game. Those features (especially the pirate rework) seem to be more annoying than fun. I don't know if you realize everyone, but pirates are just military units that keep trying to destroy your space stations, and it appears that there's almost no way to permanently get rid of them in 2.0.

And the problem with that is, what? The fact that it puts some challenge into expansion?
 

Sapa Inca

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The mid game with khans, machine uprisings, AEs and war in heaven will be great.

Is possible acquire pops of marauder empires in your planets? Different marauders empires will be of the same or different species?

That's all for today! Next week we'll continue talking about Cherryh and the Apocalypse expansion, on the topic of Edicts and Unity Ambitions.
Considering that hive minds put a great empahsis in growth speed and food and that edicts/campaigns/ambitions showed in dev's stream can cost influence/energy/unity is possible that hive minds will have special edicts/campaigns that cost food instead energy? This would be very thematic and would help to differentiate more hive minds of normal empires.
 

Lord Lambert

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This is all great however I am slightly concerned that as of right now, the update has by far more content than the paid expansion. Looking at the summary of what Apocalypse is offering, it appears to be titans, plant destroyers and pirates.

This is only the second dev diary for paid features, more is coming. To complain at this early point is laughably stupid.
 

BlackUmbrellas

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Though a query- what happens if you take the Pirate home planet out?
Pirates don't have a "home planet"; the closest thing is a sort of "home system" with some VERY large fleets in it and flavour text suggesting that the pirates are likely survivors of some ancient empire(s) turned to raiding to survive, and probably the "corrupting influence" that's been encouraging piracy in other empires (and thus, likely the reason that Birth of Piracy pirates can have technology you don't have).
 

BlackUmbrellas

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That's just how pirates work. In history piracy only became obsolete because world powers developed a proper navy to hunt pirates.
Well, "obsolete". Piracy still exists- consider that Somalia has (or at least recently had) an entire industry based around providing housing and amenities to hostages taken by pirates.
 

Ursul

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So, we now have space Mongols, those that mean that Stellaris is going to receive t's chinese expension too? With option to build the great space wall? :p
Im a bit sad that they are not really nomdic, what with hanging around the exact same spot the whol game, but I guess it's way easier to program that way.


When the new system of border was announced, I thought that it created a huge lawless space and I was hoping you'd exploit it, those updated pirates sound very fun and annoying.
 

Caspian Mortis

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If the 'Great Khan' is female she should be called 'Khatun' (which is the female equivalent of Khagan, the Mongol title for emperor) or 'Great Khanum' (a title that doesn't exist but would be equivalent to saying Great Khan).
 

The Great Guardian

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The horde has a chance to unite after 100 years. I know that you are changing alot of things but this pretty late ( would consider mid game 40-80). I do belive there would be more things to spice up the mid game ( 80 years mabey?)

Though i dont really know the strength of the horde or the new normal fleet strength.

Now days people can win 100 years into the game without real problems.
 

SlyEcho

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They are especially likely to spawn in systems that are fully surrounded by your borders, making any empty systems in the middle of your empire into potential hotbeds of trouble that you are likely going to want to take control of sooner or later.

Please reconsider the pirate spawning. This way you're discouraged to have empty space beyond your borders.
 

BlackUmbrellas

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The horde has a chance to unite after 100 years. I know that you are changing alot of things but this pretty late ( would consider mid game 40-80). I do belive there would be more things to spice up the mid game ( 80 years mabey?)

Though i dont really know the strength of the horde or the new normal fleet strength.

Now days people can win 100 years into the game without real problems.
Powergamers are just going to keep pushing the "minimum win date" further and further back, doesn't mean the developers should balance around that instead of the intended pace of the game.
 

BlackUmbrellas

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Please reconsider the pirate spawning. This way you're discouraged to have empty space beyond your borders.
That's... the point?

It's not like that's unreasonable. The game already naturally trends towards everybody sharing borders eventually anyhow- with natural border growth/push removed and system claims being manual, the pirates encouraging that trend makes total sense.
 

Diezy

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Xenophobe Fallen Empire will be Pirate Heaven for quite some time :D

I wonder where the Leviathans Pirate Galleon fleet will fit in with these changes, will they simply become a Marauder on their own?
 

Goosecreature

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If the 'Great Khan' is female she should be called 'Khatun' (which is the female equivalent of Khagan, the Mongol title for emperor) or 'Great Khanum' (a title that doesn't exist but would be equivalent to saying Great Khan).

We discussed this briefly, but decided that it was too confusing and that in the world of Stellaris and in the context of the Marauders, the title of Khan could be applied to individuals of any gender... including those that have none.
 

Bobylein

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I would really like to see those "hotpots" you mentioned to grow slowly with the starbase getting bigger and fleets roaming the system. And later you should be able to hire special kind of people there, so you might even consider leaving that one hotpot system alone because they do certain jobs for you.
 

Es57

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The flavor text for marauders mentions that they gave up their home planet aeons ago.

Is it possible to discover this planet ? (Maybe as an abandoned planet with derelict buildings ?)

And if so, does it trigger special events/interactions with the marauder faction ?