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HOI4 Dev Diary - Chain of Command

Hi everyone and welcome back to regular dev diaries. This and upcoming diaries will be covering stuff happening in the 1.5 "Cornflakes" update as well as the unannounced expansion that will come out together with it. One of the main focuses of those can be summarized as "making players care more about armies, leaders and troops" (our DLCs tend to have 1-3 main focuses or missions). The first feature that touches on this, and the topic of today's dev diary is adding a military chain of command to the game.

After Hearts of Iron III, where something like organizing the soviet chain of command could take about an hour of the players time we decided that we wanted something that was a lot less effort to work with for HOI4. We basically settled on a flat level with field marshals with no restriction on commanded divisions, and generals with a limit on division count but with a different set of traits. Over time we felt that we lost a bit too much of the WW2 military flavor with this abstraction, so we started thinking about how to do it in a more interesting way.

Pasted image at 2017_09_13 02_48 PM.jpg

What we have done now for 1.5 is that field marshals are now leading an Army Group, which is a certain number of Armies (what we had before) led by Generals. There are then places in theaters as before. Theaters are like before just a geographical organizational tool for the player and don't have a commander or the like to keep them as flexible as possible. This means that we have a Theaters->Army Groups->Armies->Divisions structure now.
While the Generals still come with a soft cap for how many divisions they can efficiently command, the field marshals will now have a number of armies they can efficiently command.

I also want to make sure to point out that this is still very early on in development, so stuff is very likely to change, and some stuff aren't completely working as it should yet. So we are showing you this in progress rather than showing a completely finished feature, and as always any numbers you see are extremely subject to change ;) Also I very sneekily hid the topbar for now ;)
upload_2017-9-13_15-27-6.png


When it comes to controlling your troops the new system introduces some changes to the battle planner. You can either do a plan for each army in the army group, or have a central plan for the whole Army Group where each army has a part of the frontline assigned as its responsibility. You can also do a mix, in which case an Army will finish its plan and then fall back to executing the Army Group's plan. We are still iteration on this stuff though but I figured you all wanted to know how it would work in practice.

upload_2017-9-13_15-26-30.png


Something that does not really come across in the images is that we are working on ways to streamline the process for setting up fronts using the new army groups. This should make at least the basic cases feel smooth to set up, even with one more command level and more armies without a ton of extra clicking.

upload_2017-9-13_15-23-51.png


The sharp eyed reader will also notice that we have removed the skill level for generals. This is now replaced with separate skills of different kinds. Attack, Defense, Planning and Logistics. Attack and Defense do what you expect while Planning improves planning speed and Logistics lowers supply consumption. Field marshal stats apply together with army general stats at a reduced capacity, so you will always want to have a chain of command for best efficiency.

The chain of command feature is going to be part of the free update, although there is some cool DLC features that tie into it we will be revealing in later diaries. Also expect to read more details about the system itself like how things in combat are affected etc.

See you next week when we will be taking a look at national unity...
 

Alex_brunius

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I almost (well not really..) miss TC from HOI2.

Even though it was a big simplification it did manage to do something no other HoI supply mechanic has done so far, which is punish overextention in an almost historical manner. ( If you fielded more supply heavy divisions or occupied more territory then your industry could cope with, you suffered, alot! ).
 

ltccone

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Even though it was a big simplification it did manage to do something no other HoI supply mechanic has done so far, which is punish overextention in an almost historical manner. ( If you fielded more supply heavy divisions or occupied more territory then your industry could cope with, you suffered, alot! ).
Very true. It was a real struggle for Germany to even get a Bitter Peace with the USSR because of that. Now driving to Mongolia is not an issue.
 

Malickhoi

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Same here : I wish for a land transport capacity system, very much like the current 'naval convoy' system.
Except that, instead of building special 'convoy' equipment, you would build 'trucks' and/or 'trains'... Same for air, for airborne assault as well as re-supply pockets by air.
The whole transportation system (supply, troop movement, resources, trade, equipment...) could be taken care of with a naval / land / air TC.

But... that's not the point of this patch ;)
 

safe-keeper

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OP should say something about how moddable this is. There are lots of mod devs out there who'd love a deeper COC. This is possibly answered in the thread somewhere (I'll comb through dev replies right now :p ), though.

Other than that, looking great!
 

Axe99

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Wouldn't need pictures, just auto-generated names for flavor would be nice. It could be used for "spawning" Generals (like Aces in HOI4) or commanders in other PDS-titles.

Also just like the "division" isn't actually a division (you can make them corps-strength, divisional size, brigade, regiment or single battalions in the template designer) the levels wouldn't need to be fixed (just like an army now isn't "fixed" but rather limited to what the general/FM can handle).

I'd really really really like icons or representations for unit size. A lot of people are complaining about unit-spam which is pretty awful but not AS awful as it looks since a lot of the forces are regiment-strength units (but look like full-fledged divisions both in 3D-models and Counter.

Just a thought on this - if it was names rather than pictures, it should be fairly straightforward for most nations (at least the majors and major-minors) to have historical name lists before random ones kicked in without too much trouble (of course, easy for me to say without having to do the work :) ).
 

Scottsman

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This is looking nice...finally looking like the game is gaining the depth it deserves. Quite honestly...this might be the one that makes me finally buy the expansions. With each expansion, it looks better, but...it just won't improve the game enough to justify buying on it's own...but then, when the last 2 expansions and this one are together as a package, it's a bit of a different story.
 

Dan1109

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Well, going the right direction for sure. We've been shown just 1 feature, X more, but I'm hoping this shapes into like an HOI3 expansion, where game changing features were introduced.
 

CV10

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Just a thought on this - if it was names rather than pictures, it should be fairly straightforward for most nations (at least the majors and major-minors) to have historical name lists before random ones kicked in without too much trouble (of course, easy for me to say without having to do the work :) ).
I have to image that they have a bundle of lists with names of generals lying about in the office from HOI III. Some of the majors have hundreds of generals in that game:eek: Out of all of those divisional commanders, I'm sure that they could pick a few of the more notable ones and bring them over (using generic portraits if they did not want to have specific art)
 

PotatoesOfDoom

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Well, going the right direction for sure. We've been shown just 1 feature, X more, but I'm hoping this shapes into like an HOI3 expansion, where game changing features were introduced.
You mean the HoI3 DLCs where they added such stunning new features as:
from Semper Fi:
- air superiority mapmode (came with HoI4 base)
- tech sharing (TfV)
- upgrading brigades (came with HoI4 base)
- theaters (came with HoI4 base)
- ai improvements (comes free in patches)
- fixes and balance (comes free in patches)

from For the Motherland:
- partisans (came with HoI4 base)
- coup system (came with HoI4 base)
- better theater system with more information provided (either DoD or the accompanying patch, don't remember if the ledger is free)
- a bunch of fixes (comes free in patches)
- war goals (came with HoI4 base)
- map changes (comes free in patches)
- air map mode shows plane ranges around airbases (came with HoI4 base)
- fixes and balance (comes free in patches)

from Their Finest Hour:
- leader traits (came with HoI4 base)
- armor value for land units (came with HoI4 base)
- strategic warfare screen (came with HoI4 base, split up into a few different areas)
- lend-lease (came with HoI4 base)
- fixes and balance (comes free in patches)

The only really, really major things that weren't in HoI4 already that were added by HoI3 expansions are scenarios, OoB changes (which are literally coming in the next patch/DLC for HoI4 anyways as per this thread's dev diary), strategic resources, and better politics/espionage.
 

Dan1109

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They were game changing for HOI3 for its context, I want game changing for HOI4.
 

Juttland

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I have to say i am glad we are getting OoB structure back I am just curious as to the limits of it though. I would like to be able to assign air units to army advances to provide ground support with Stukas, add tactical and strategic bombers to theaters and use fighters in their own structure for air cover again. Is there going to be any sort of cross over like in hoi 3 where we could use air units in an armies OoB? That sort of management went a long way to simplifying my air cover in hoi 3. Using something like the army structure but re-purposed for the air force would go a long way to simplifying air cover, or just give us the ability to add air units to the army, army group and theater, like in hoi 3 would be a cool addition. Now I just put a few thousand planes somewhere forget about them and just use more else where. I do realize there are differences in the coding that might not allow that but if it were possible it would be freaking awesome.
 

Alex_brunius

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The only really, really major things that weren't in HoI4 already that were added by HoI3 expansions are scenarios, OoB changes (which are literally coming in the next patch/DLC for HoI4 anyways as per this thread's dev diary), strategic resources, and better politics/espionage.

Considering strategic resources included stuff like Tungsten, Chromium, Rubber, Aluminium and Dockyards you could argue that an improved and detailed version of some of the key resources actually did make it into HoI4 base as well!
 

PotatoesOfDoom

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Considering strategic resources included stuff like Tungsten, Chromium, Rubber, Aluminium and Dockyards you could argue that an improved and detailed version of some of the key resources actually did make it into HoI4 base as well!
Well, yeah, but the HoI3 version functioned more like EUIV trade goods, so I decided to leave it out. Besides, it'd be nice to have heavy water and other "exotic" resources added in-game at some time.
 

pwwl

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It is great news that there will be a chain of command again.
Will air units receive leaders too that can be linked to a Theater? For example the Germans had Luftflotten with their own generals which could be integrated in the proposed chain of command? Just a thought
 

NoahtheBoah36

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So, let's say that we're playing as one of the minors that doesn't start with any commanders, does this mean we'll need at least two commanders, or can armies operate independently without a field marshall?