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HOI4 Dev Diary - A New Germany

Hello everyone, and welcome to a new dev diary for the 1.5 “Cornflakes” update and the as-yet unannounced accompanying DLC.

For those of you who missed my introduction, I’ll briefly introduce myself. My name is Drikus and, after working briefly on DOD to help out the Content Designers on HOI4 back then, I re-joined the team in the summer to work on the next expansion, working with @Archangel85 and @Havebeard on all that CD goodness. Today I’ll be talking about some of the stuff we’ve been busy with since then.

Ever since release it’s become clear that the fanbase's interest in alternate history is far greater than we anticipated. Unfortunately, many of our focus trees for major powers are somewhat lacking in that regard, and it's something we want to change. So, while we will naturally be adding some new focus trees, this time around we will also be revamping two major nations. If this proves popular we plan to keep doing this in future expansions and eventually have all the majors with more options. For now, though, we figured a good start would be the most popular nation in HOI4: Germany!

In the next DLC, Germany will have its focus tree updated to bring it more in line with the new trees of minor nations, especially in terms of alternate history options. Furthermore, even players who do not buy the DLC will see some of these changes. For instance, we made some effort to flesh out the industrial part of the German tree. Initially only being a quick path of 4 focuses, it has now been expanded into a full 16-focus monstrosity, with paths leading into more fortification focuses, more domestic industrial focuses, and more focuses dealing with the ‘economic vassalization’ of Hungary and Romania and other areas of Europe. As a bonus, the 5th research slot is now accessible somewhat earlier, and no longer requires Air Innovations II. These changes do affect industrial balance somewhat, and we will go into how we handle that at the very end of the diary.

Germany Industry.PNG


All of the abovementioned will be free in the 1.5 “Cornflakes” update. What comes next, however, will be part of the DLC.

Use the full tree at the end of this dev diary to follow along. :)

Alternate history paths for Germany beg the question of when and how Hitler could have been stopped. These questions are very controversial, and there usually isn’t much consensus. We, however, have elected to explore the possibility of a concerted Wehrmacht opposition to Hitler, sparked by the Rhineland remilitarization.

Germany Civil War.PNG


A new path has been added, mutually exclusive with the Rhineland focus. It sparks a civil war led by the legendary August von Mackensen. Once won, the path splits, allowing the player to choose between reviving the old Kaiserreich (renaming the country to “German Empire”) and lifting Kaiser Wilhelm II’s exile in the Netherlands, or reinstating democratic elections and establishing a constitutional monarchy as a ‘compromise’ for the rather royalist (and powerful) Wehrmacht officers. In this path, Wilhelm II’s son will take the throne as Wilhelm III as a figurehead. In addition, there is a small 4-focus shared path focusing on the rebuilding of Germany after the Civil War, leading up to the German continental role as a “Bulwark against Bolshevism”.

Germany von Mackensen.PNG

Who wouldn’t want this guy leading their country?

In the Imperial branch, the player now gets the choice of either avenging the Great War, or letting bygones be bygones and focusing on the Communist threat. The former leads to Germany once again asserting its right of a ‘place in the sun’ (bullying China or Japan for the return of Tsingtao), focusing heavily on rebuilding its High Seas Fleet to challenge Britain (including some nice bonuses to battleship production and research), and then taking the fight to the British and French for their colonies. To this end, a new very powerful late-game focus has been added that will flip a significant amount of the country’s military production to naval production, in case the Soviet Union has been defeated and the player wishes to focus on the West (also available to fascists, if the player owns the DLC). The branch also enables the recreation of the Central powers via stimulating imperial sentiment in the Austro-Hungarian successor states and the assassination of Mussolini in favor of King Victor Emmanuel III.

Germany Wilhelm II.PNG

Can never have enough Pickelhaube...

The second Imperial path focuses on forgiving the British and giving up all dreams of an Imperial Navy. In return for accepting British naval supremacy, it is possible to form an alliance with them and stand together against the threat of Communism all over Europe. A punitive war with (Communist) France over Alsace-Lorraine can lead to an expulsion of the republicans from Iberia, as well as eventually taking the war directly to the Soviets, themselves. I minor shared branch, available for both the British alliance and the colonial route, allows for Germany to protect its eastern borders, retaking Memel, trading Danzig for military guarantees against the Soviets, and aiding the Baltics and the Finns with guarantees and some military support.

Germany Tsingtao.PNG

Can you taste that sweet Tsingtao beer? Ahhh, come to fatherland...

The Democratic path involves some sneaky diplomatic maneuvering, scaring the other nations in Europe into your sphere of influence by speaking up strongly against the Soviets and demonizing them. This leads to creating a Central European Alliance, in which most minor nations in Europe can be invited through various focuses, allowing for democratic Germany to challenge the historic French continental leadership role by creating its own power block. This course of action will likely result in the Soviet Union posturing threateningly, though, and gaining various bonuses to prepare them against what they perceive to be a threat to their sphere of influence. The end result of this mutual and intentional escalation is likely that it will not be possible to invite all nations you could potentially invite before the Soviets invade them. Eventually, Germany can take the fight to the Soviets, leading Europe in a war against the source of communism. In addition, it is possible for Democratic Germany to get a 6th research slot, and to strengthen their alliance through tech sharing and other cooperation.

Germany Democratic.PNG

Unleash the Swarm!

In addition, we have adjusted focuses like “Operation Weserübung” to give the player better control over the timetable of their invasions once the ball starts rolling. We’ve slightly buffed the naval parts of the core tree, adding an additional naval build-up focus or two, and adding some dockyards to Plan Z. In light of the significant improvements to Germany’s economic build-up in the new industrial tree, we are also revisiting the start-of-game balance of the nation. The intention is to make Germany initially weaker, but also quicker in building up, especially before any war has broken out. To that end, we have added a new idea upon startup. MEFO Bills will reduce the consumer goods by 20% (resulting in virtually no consumer good requirements at all), but have to be extended every three months. The price of extending these will progressively increase, as will the penalty that must be paid if these are not extended. Paying off these bills can be delayed by going to war, in which case the payment will be deferred until after the war’s conclusion (so be sure you can afford it by that point!). And finally, just as with the industrial segment of the tree, everything that was mentioned in this paragraph will be available without owning the DLC.

Germany MEFO.png


And finally, in its full glory:

Germany_tree.jpg


Don’t forget to check out the World War Wednesday stream later today, where @Da9L and @podcat will go through this dev diary while the rest of us get our asses handed to us by the Allies in South America. We look forward to showing you more cool stuff next week! :)
 
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Deinhardt

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Nothing better than getting rid of Hitler and than rallying Europe against Communism!

Which is something I expected to be honest. To my Knowledge there where allot of voices on the Ally side arguing for peace with Germany to get rid of the communists. And that is with Hitler in power mind you.

But hey. The Kaiser having that Option is somewhat Poetic. In the sense that the Old German Empire deals with the Devils it unleashed a few decades ago.
 

TheDungen

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I find that highly disturbing but will probably adopt a similar tactic.
Please I have had "Furthermore, I consider that Westphalian must be Low Saxon." in my signature for ages.
 

kettyo

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Which is something I expected to be honest. To my Knowledge there where allot of voices on the Ally side arguing for peace with Germany to get rid of the communists. And that is with Hitler in power mind you.

I think it was more like a "let them destroy each other while we sit and watch" kind of dream.
 

safe-keeper

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I don't know precisely how unstable Germany was in 1936, but I would enjoy a system that made me have to weigh my actions to avoid a coup or civil war. At least when I play as Nazi Germany myself.
 

Deinhardt

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I think it was more like a "let them destroy each other while we sit and watch" kind of dream.

Not really. I atleast know that the populace in britain and america had pro german Sentiments. Ofcourse Churchill blocked that off hard in GB and the bombs did the rest to form a firm anti german stance.

That said. A Anglo German alliance against Communism with Hitler still in power is probably more likely, then the Kaiser returning to the Throne. :p
 

katanatan

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@Bratyn
Since this is (I guess so) still in development and subjecto to change/ balance.
Please give some thought to letting germany have jet fighters and rocket fighters, buff interceptors and rockets in general. Pretty much a dead feature.

The allies have so much better research bonuses to research jet engines, especially the british focus "Secret weapons" which even counts for nuclear technology and rocketry and jets.
 

LiberiusX

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Not really. I atleast know that the populace in britain and america had pro german Sentiments. Ofcourse Churchill blocked that off hard in GB and the bombs did the rest to form a firm anti german stance.

That said. A Anglo German alliance against Communism with Hitler still in power is probably more likely, then the Kaiser returning to the Throne. :p

Because 25000 nut jobs in the USA qualifies as "the populace"
 

TheDungen

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I think it was more like a "let them destroy each other while we sit and watch" kind of dream.
Actually I'm sure they would have been more than willing to lend financial aid to whoever was the underdog at any given time to.
 

CrazyZombie

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Not really. I atleast know that the populace in britain and america had pro german Sentiments. Ofcourse Churchill blocked that off hard in GB and the bombs did the rest to form a firm anti german stance.

That said. A Anglo German alliance against Communism with Hitler still in power is probably more likely, then the Kaiser returning to the Throne. :p
I already see that great political balance in the game where everyone wants to smash Soviet Union.

Where are goddamn potential Soviet allies in this way and possible paths for them?
 

Ryousan2k

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I already see that great political balance in the game where everyone wants to smash Soviet Union.

Where are goddamn potential Soviet allies in this way and possible paths for them?

My gut tells me that IF the next Focus Tree is for the united States thats where we will see some communist goodness, specially if the focus on Alt-History continues: Imagine an scenario in which the Industrial Workers of the World Union manage to create its proposed Big Union of Workers in the United States, thus leading a Socialist Revolution in America, afterwards settling the issue that caused their downfall.

*In the Path of Centralization, you organize the union along Stalinist Lines and draw closer to the Soviets and the Comitern

*In the path of Decentralization, you opt to create your own communist Faction with sights of creating a new Internationale in the Americas
 

Captured Joe

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Where are goddamn potential Soviet allies in this way and possible paths for them?
You get Yugoslavia! ...oh wait, Britain automatically DoW'd them before they could get anywhere and now they automatically joined the Axis.
 

Reinner

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I don't know precisely how unstable Germany was in 1936, but I would enjoy a system that made me have to weigh my actions to avoid a coup or civil war. At least when I play as Nazi Germany myself.

The country was far from unstable in 1936. Germany was at its worst before Hitler took over. But already in his first year of rule the country started getting better. By the time of 36 which is when HoI starts, most of Hitler's political enemies were removed, unemployment was gone and it became the most prosperous state during the interwar period. For a country that suffered the most after WW1, it was considered to be "economic miracle", meanwhile the rest of Europe was still suffering from Great Depression.

Since we already have Oster conspiracy, i would also put Operation Valkyrie in and trigger it if Germany starts loosing the war in late game. Mackensen's coup seems to happen because people are afraid that Hitler might drag Germany into war again, since Rhineland was one of the first things where Hitler started disregarding Treaty of Versailles, which is a good "what if" scenario event in my opinion.
 

Deinhardt

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Because 25000 nut jobs in the USA qualifies as "the populace"

Well yes. They are part of it. And I am talking about Sentiments. Just like High Ranking Nazi Party members still had Sentiments of making peace with the Allies til the end of the war or the Group of the 20th of July having that exact same plan.

Or how a certain member of the Royal Family thought that Hitler was a pretty swell guy. Or the noumerous Anti War Protests against Germany, on the lines of "let the Germans be".

All I am saying is that in the starting Scenario up until a certain Point in the war it isnt out off the realm of possibility to have a Anglo German alliance.
 

kettyo

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Not really. I atleast know that the populace in britain and america had pro german Sentiments. Ofcourse Churchill blocked that off hard in GB and the bombs did the rest to form a firm anti german stance.

That said. A Anglo German alliance against Communism with Hitler still in power is probably more likely, then the Kaiser returning to the Throne. :p

It has close to no relevance what kind of sentiments the (parts of the) general population has. It has almost only relevance what kind of sentiments the power elites have since they will shape the direction.

I think the capitalist elites initially feared communism much more than fascism because of it's international nature. They have percieved communism as a threat to their power while fascism not as long as they can be befriended because fascism is local in nature. The novel This Above All from contemporary Eric Knight tells this as a fact. Furthermore it tells that the capitalist powers even covertly supported the nazis from the consideration that they will be a tool against communism. Just this fighting dog went mad.

Of course postwar narratives will exclude these aspects :)
 

kettyo

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The country was far from unstable in 1936. Germany was at its worst before Hitler took over. But already in his first year of rule the country started getting better. By the time of 36 which is when HoI starts, most of Hitler's political enemies were removed, unemployment was gone and it became the most prosperous state during the interwar period. For a country that suffered the most after WW1, it was considered to be "economic miracle", meanwhile the rest of Europe was still suffering from Great Depression.

Yes 1936 was a very successful period for the nazis so any serious challange to them from inside back then is highly unlikely.
 

Deinhardt

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It has close to no relevance what kind of sentiments the (parts of the) general population has. It has almost only relevance what kind of sentiments the power elites have since they will shape the direction.

I think the capitalist elites initially feared communism much more than fascism because of it's international nature. They have percieved communism as a threat to their power while fascism not as long as they can be befriended because fascism is local in nature. The novel This Above All from contemporary Eric Knight tells this as a fact. Furthermore it tells that the capitalist powers even covertly supported the nazis from the consideration that they will be a tool against communism. Just this fighting dog went mad.

Of course postwar narratives will exclude these aspects :)

Well true it's the politicians that make the calls. But there has to be a Level of understanding in a democratic Nation like Britain or atleast a very well done Propaganda to generate Support.

But yeah. There was Support for Nazi Germany in the higher ranks of GB and the US. Both on policitical and economy sides. As I said. If it wasnt Churchill and his firm stance against Facism and the ensuing Propaganda effort to Rally against the Third Reich, that whole Story might have played out allot different.