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HoI 4 Dev Diary - Nationalist China

Hi and welcome! Today we announced the expansion we have been working on for the last couple of months: Waking the Tiger. The names comes from a quote by Mao: “When waking a tiger, use a long stick”. A major theme in the expansion is Asia, with a special focus on China. We will be presenting focus trees and other content leading up to release, as well as going over other features we haven't shown off yet. But first a word on the expansion pass:

The expansion pass for HOI4 was the first one we’ve done, and we’ve learned many lessons.

For example, we decided to release "Death or Dishonor" as a country pack rather than a full-sized expansion so that we could still release something cool during a period of time when we were busy staffing up and focusing on technical issues. We saw that with the resources we had, at the time, we couldn't release a full-sized expansion at the same time as we were spending time on improving the AI and doing other free updates to the base game, such as the significant revamp of the air combat system.

It turns out that scope changes of this type do not go well with an expansion pass if you look at the value we promised to pass-owners. So, in order to make sure we over-deliver and make everyone happy, we have decided that not only this expansion, but also the next expansion - the one after "Waking the Tiger", which is planned to be similar in scope - will also be included in the pass.

This means that the initially promised two expansions have now actually become four. This also means that we are also no longer selling the pass. So if you picked it up yesterday: jackpot!

More info about this here: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/expansion-pass-faq.975687/

Now back to the regular diary!


China in 1936 was one of the most confusing and interesting countries on the planet. After a revolution in 1911 deposed the last Qing Emperor, the young republic quickly found itself ripped apart by a brutal civil war that would continue, on and off, until 1949. In 1936, the Central Government under Chiang Kai-Shek had established some measure of control over the central regions of China. A number of provincial governors, nominally under the control of Chiang, ran their provinces as essentially separate political entities. The Communists under Mao Zedong had successfully evaded annihilation and created a Base Area in Yan’an.

upload_2017-11-15_14-27-38.png


In 1931, the Japanese military had engineered a false-flag terror attack on a Japanese-owned railroad and used the “Mukden incident” to invade and occupy Manchuria, eventually setting up a puppet government under Puyi. The deposed Qing Emperor, eager to reclaim the throne that was so rudely taken from him, is unlikely to give them too much trouble. The Japanese, of course, have their own designs on China - and they don’t necessarily involve Puyi.

The stage is set for the showdown between 3 large players and 5 smaller ones, with the ultimate prize the title of Ruler of China. Historically, the conflict would lead to a savage war against Japan, causing millions of deaths. The following renewed Chinese Civil War ended up in the disgraceful retreat of Chiang Kai-Shek’s government to Taiwan, with the Communists in control of the mainland. But history need not have followed this path…


Given that the various ideologies are already well-represented in the different players in the Chinese Civil War, we have diverted from our past practice of making alternate ideology paths for every country. It made little sense to us that you would want to turn Nationalist China communist when Communist China is already a thing you can play. This also meant we didn’t have to resolve all the weird edge cases that would spring up from this (the days of Mao vs. Mao battles for control of China are sadly over).

The first new focus tree we want to show you is Nationalist China. It has consistently been one of the most requested nations and is actually one of the most played nations even with the generic focus tree. We originally looked at China as a whole during the early development of DoD, but decided that with the available resources we couldn’t do it justice. Events have proven us right, since the new decision system in particular has been critical in modelling the complex issues in China and turn it into interesting gameplay.

china_focus_tree.jpg


In 1936 Nationalist China is coming out of the brief golden age of the so-called Nanking Decade, in which the Nationalist Government tried hard to industrialize the country and build a modern system of government. Guided by the political theories of Sun Yat-Sen, founder and first president of the Republic, this rested on three pillars, called The Three Principles of the People: Nationalism, Democracy and Welfare (note that the Chinese terms have various meanings and don’t map perfectly on what we understand those words to mean).

In the game, the three principles form the start of three separate branches. The Welfare branch builds a modern welfare state, as it was envisioned by the leading experts of the time. Making the people invested in your leadership by improving their livelihood will increase their willingness to defend it against any aggressor, raising your war support. It comes at a cost, however. The Chinese economy is not yet up to the task of supporting a large welfare state, and so your government will have to make up the deficit by printing money, increasing inflation. Inflation is represented by a national spirit in 5 levels, reducing factory output and the number of civilian factories available for construction. You will have various options to reform your taxation system in the industrial branch, but they might not be popular with everyone.

Capture_inflation.JPG


The Democracy branch concerns itself with reforming the government to a state that truly deserves the name “Republic”. Part of this is the establishment of the 5 branches of government (as opposed to the three the rest of the world has to make do with): Executive, Legislative, Judiciary, Control and Examination. Creating a system of checks and balances will finally allow you to get rid of the “Ineffective Bureaucracy” spirit, which reduces conscription by 35%.

Capture_advisors.JPG


The Nationalism branch concerns itself with the struggle to unite China under your banner and defend it against foreign aggression. It offers you a fundamental choice: do you focus on uniting the country first, leading to a confrontation with the warlords and the Communists, or do you put your petty squabbles behind you to focus on defending against Japan? Or perhaps, you might want to take the fight to the Japanese directly? After all, nothing unites a people like a common enemy…

Before you do, however, it might be wise to review the state of your army, which is less than impressive. Usually under-equipped, often poorly trained and shoddily led, your army suffers crippling penalties to attack and defence until you have had the chance to reform it. Each step will have to be paid for with Army XP, meaning you will be on the back foot for a while until your army has absorbed the harsh lessons of warfare.

Capture_army_reform.JPG


The only upside in your rather bleak position is that you are, after all, the internationally recognized government of China, which offers up a large number of avenues to get outside support: German advisors can help you reorganize your officer corps and assist you in building up your tank force, while approaching the Soviet Union might gain you some desperately needed planes as well as support in developing new tanks.

The French and British will send you supplies directly through the Burma Road and Hanoi, represented by off-map factories helping you produce equipment. They may, however, withdraw the support if they wish. Should Burma be overrun, they will also be unable to help you.

Capture_burma_road_eng.JPG


Finally, the US can help you build a navy and will support you in building up a domestic aviation industry. Should you find yourself in the position to approach Japan, they can help you with modernizing your navy, although they won’t help you to the point where you may become a legitimate challenger in their own home waters.

Lastly, once you have built up your forces, it may be time to throw off the shackles the Great Powers have laid on you, and reclaim the position you were meant to have: the undisputed, unchallenged hegemon of the Eastern Hemisphere. Whether you will be a benevolent overlord or institute direct rule from Nanking is up to you.

CHI_infantry_artillery_cavalry_04 (1).jpg

The expansion will come with a bunch of new 3d models for china, more details of this in a later diary.

upload_2017-11-15_14-44-4.png

A sample of the new general pictures for nationalist china

See you all next week with another diary!

PS. The last episode of our beginner-stream with @Da9L and @bus will start at 16:00 today and run for 30 minutes and then I’ll pop in and talk a bit about the expansion. So check out the Paradox twitch today at 16:00 CET: https://go.twitch.tv/paradoxinteractive

PSS: This is not the thread to discuss the recent removal of HoI from sale in China. To discuss this issue, please go to the relevant thread: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...-iron-iv-removed-from-steam-in-china.1052971/ . Moderators will remove posts concerning this issue.

PSSS: If you missed the trailer, check it out here:
 

Pyro157

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“Fire the canons bombard the shit.”
LMAO
“You told me to do this way,
He told me to do that way.
You are a bunch of jerks,
All mother f***ing jerks.”

And don't forget the one time there was a drought...

(slaps statue of rain god for the fifth time)
"YOU OLD DRAGON KING, IF IT DOESN'T RAIN, DO YOU WANT TO KILL THE PEOPLE OF SHANDONG? HUH?" *whack whack whack*
 
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Duke_Dave

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Because he was Commander-in-Chief of the armed forces, not a field commander. As were Hitler, Stalin and Roosevelt. The argument can be made, but from what I read, CKS never commander troops in the field during this period.
I follow your reasoning there, I just love, as an old CK2 player, to have the leader of my country lead my armies into battle - leading the charge - so to say.
 

redcoat22

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I didn't think the Chinese army had more than a few hundred thousand German helmets. After '42 shouldn't they be in caps?
 

Pyro157

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I didn't think the Chinese army had more than a few hundred thousand German helmets. After '42 shouldn't they be in caps?

Well, around 1936 (the earliest starting time), they still had plenty of Stahlhelms to go around. After the first few years of war, most of them seem to have been relegated for parade use and drilling.

Of course. the wallpaper shows NRA troops in accurate caps, but I think Paradox chose the helmet to make it accurate for the start of the war. They might've picked boots too because although I highly recommend straw sandals, bare feet can be a little hard to model.
 

Gamengervi

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They made it quite clear that the meaning of the three principles isn't necessarily mainstream - so it's probably "democracy with Chinese characteristics".
Say what you want about modern Taiwan and the communists, that's still a bit too much for a brutal military dictator who had no qualms about the suffering of his own people. That being said, as I mentioned before, I am completely fine with having the current branch in, but I do have an issue about it being only option for the Republic of China given the history.

It could be like the British Raj, where if China gets help from the USA or Britain or France, it leans towards Democracy, but if Nazi Germany stays loyal to the Chinese rather than recognize Japan as a better ally, then China leans towards fascism.
Perhaps. I could see something like that. If I recall, Chiang did make some concessions to the US in return for their support. At least nominally. The issue regarding Tibet comes to mind.
 

Dagdom12

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A few weeks after Death or Dishonor released my Brother and I were in his car talking about the next DLC and I said it was going to finish off Europe and he Said China. Look who is right now...
 

Duke_Dave

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Given that it ususally takes more than a month between announcment and release this will not drop before christmas...
 

Axe99

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Cheers for the DD Archangel and the extra info Podcat :D. Much excitement, and a great choice in terms of which countries to add more content to (and a great DLC name as well - it really is Paradox's "Year of the Dragon"* :) ). Am very much looking forward to giving China a good 'ole playthrough or few, and am very much looking forward to see what you've done with the Japanese and other associated focus trees.

Thank you very much for the "Four expansions in the two-pass expansion pass" thing as well - this is incredible value, and greatly appreciated :).

In honour of Nationalist China's new focus trees, here's a pic of Ping Hai (underway here, but still not completed and under construction at the start of the game) :).

Ping Hai - small.jpg


* Even if Stellaris got Space Dragons last year - they went early!


So an agricultural nation can produce tanks ships planes without industrialization? that's ridiculous;

While armament and machinery were provided by Japan (along with technical assistance), Japan did complete to 2000+ ton warships in the 1930s, and had a bit of a history of earlier shipbuilding (nothing approaching the majors, but not nothing at all either).

the curse of lists needing to be short. that "other changes" is a big list in itself

in which case...ah, but that would be telling.

Hahaha, so does Paradox included "teasing ability" in its selection criteria for new employees, or are all new staff required to attend a 2-week "teasing retreat" shortly after induction? :).
 
Last edited:

am300307

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looks good :rolleyes:
 

C-Breeze

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The first new focus tree we want to show you is Nationalist China. It has consistently been one of the most requested nations and is actually one of the most played nations even with the generic focus tree.

Interesting... I wouldn't have guessed that. I reckon it's true what they say, you do learn something new every day. :)

P.S. Happy the name of the expansion is released! That kitty gonna cause quite a ruckus! ;)
 

Time Emperor

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@Archangel185 Why are the British and french focuses exclusive from one another is for balance or do they have to much to help you when other is?

View attachment 313703
 

C-Breeze

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The French and British will send you supplies directly through the Burma Road and Hanoi, represented by off-map factories helping you produce equipment.

Overall, a very good diary today. Quite interesting.

As for the quote, I know what you're getting at, but I did find it quote humorous. It's just something about the idea of 'Off-map factories' on a map that encompasses the entire planet. Tickles my funny bone. :D Where are the supplies coming from? The Moon? :p
 

Pyro157

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For those interested, the full artwork:

175ac514e3172277619a085cbf1411906bf55d48.png
 

vyshan

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He certainly wasn't overly fascist, but took some influence from it. He was definitely more of the HOI3 "paternal autocrat", or a centrist authoritarian military dictator as I like to say. The centrist position of the KMT helped them ally up with Germany, the USSR and the USA at various points in time.

Or maybe the democratic influence is going to be veeeeeeeery slow.

This is one of the many reasons why I wish that HOI4 had more political ideologies like the previous HOI games did.
 

Ryousan2k

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Im really excited for the Manchukuo Focus Tree, time to bring Puyi back home...

...Alas, I hope this is accompanied by some Foci that make him more competent , more savory a character and less of a pushover ,as they did with King Carol and Romania, and perhaps (wishful thinking ahead) some event that allows him to get some help for his wife Wanrong. probably not pertinent to the game ,but damn, I feel so sorry for that woman...