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Welcome to another development diary for Europa Universalis IV and today we focus on warfare. Yes, you knew this dev diary was coming, didn’t you? It’s really quite difficult to play the game without understanding how the armies work.

Warfare is one of the most important aspects of Europa Universalis IV, and over the almost 400 years of gameplay, armies and navies will be your prime instruments of power when you go to war. You need to be aware of the different units of your armies and their strengths and weaknesses.
So, it is time to build some armies and go to war! In times of war, you will have to raise and maintain armies and fleets, conquer nations and project your power onto the world. You see them standing, moving and fighting on the map.

Battlefield casualties and general attrition will naturally reduce the number of men or quality of ships available to you as you play, but armies will be slowly reinforced and navies in a safe port will slowly be repaired. As you upgrade your technology, you will unlock different types of these units, each with different offensive and defensive characteristics. Some have attributes that favor the attack, some favor the defense, and others are suited for a more balanced approach. Each approach has its advantages and disadvantages depending on your circumstances, and it will be up to you to decide what kind of army you want.

Land Units
Just as in earlier Europa Universalis games, land units are divided into infantry, cavalry and artillery. As you move through the ages, your armies will evolve from men-at-arms and armored knights to advanced musketmen and dragoons, and everything in between. The specific types of unit available to you, and its offensive and defensive abilities, are also dependent on your culture. Asian countries can get samurai cavalry, for example, but you won’t find these guys riding around Spain unless you send them there.

You select your preferred unit type of your land units, as you discover them through technology. This interface allows you to select the focus of your military forces. Each unit you build represents a force of 1000 men.

Infantry will be the bulk of your army. They are your cheapest units, and don’t take long to recruit. Your cavalry are the force you rely on in a battle to hit the flanks of an outnumbered enemy or chase down those that can’t stand against you. They cost about double what an infantryman does. Artillery only become available at Land Technology Level 7 (Limber) and they are most important for their firepower on the battlefield and their effectiveness during sieges.

When you build your armies, keep in mind that an army that is more cavalry than infantry loses the “combined arms” advantage. Cavalry could be very powerful and fast at times in this era, but rarely outnumbered foot soldiers on the battlefield.

In the military menu, you can see four columns with data on the land units. First there is the power, second the ability during fire, third is ability during shock, and finally the number of regiments you have of that category.

Naval Units
There are four types of ships: heavy ships, light ships, galleys and transports. Unlike armies, each construction represents individual ships and have a strength measured in a percentage – a ship at 100% is in perfect health. Ships take damage in battles, of course, but also if they are in the open sea for too long. (This is naval attrition.) Ships only repair when in port.

Each naval unit has characteristics, just like army units. There are no longer any separate fire/shock values per ship type, as a ship-based gun is basically a gun. However, every type of ship has a different number of cannons, and a different hull size. There are also ideas that improve your ships ability to fight, or as we call it, the ships’ power.

The four different ship types have different purposes. Your main battle fleet will be composed of heavy ships (carracks, galleons, etc.). Light ships (barques, caravels, frigates, etc.) have better speed and are OK in a fight but will mostly be used to protect and project your trade power. Galleys (and later galleases and chebecks) are designed for fighting in inland seas and enclosed bodies of water. Your transports (cogs, flytes, merchantmen, etc.) are, as the name suggests, your lightly armed vessels intended to move troops across the water.

In the military interface, ship types have four columns, first there is the power, second the amount of guns, third is hull size, and finally the numbers of ships you have of that category.

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Leaders
Any military situation calls for extensive knowledge and leadership, and, for a monarch like yourself, how to choose which of the leaders at your service will serve what purpose in the war you just happened to find yourself in. (Clearly this war is not your fault.)

Though you can always put your monarch or a mature heir at the head of your army, you will hire most of your leaders from the general population. You can recruit generals, admirals, conquistadors and explorers as leaders. Generals and conquistadors, as land leaders, cost you 25 Military Power. Admirals and explorers, as naval leaders, cost you 25 Diplomatic Power. Once you’ve hired a leader, it can be assigned to lead any army or naval unit. As expected, generals are used to lead armies and admirals are used to lead navies. Assign conquistadors and explorers to units you wish to send far away or to uncharted lands – these are the only units that can venture into unexplored parts of the map (those sections covered by a white fog).

The skill of a leader determines how good he is at performing different strategies and tactics in combat. Leader skill is partly related to your nation’s military or naval tradition; countries with a history of warfare will be more likely to notice these talents among soldiers or general citizenry.

The four different attributes of leaders are scored from 0 to 6. “Fire” is their ability to direct the use of gunpowder or missile weapons. “Shock” measures how well the leader is at assaults, charges, whatever happens when ranged combat turns to man-to-man action. “Maneuver” is the ability of a leader to move his troops through land safely and get his forces into the right position for battle. Finally, the “Siege” attribute is most important for quickly taking down enemy cities. Paying close attention to these may be the difference between defeating an army twice your size or getting crushed.

Every leader (except your current ruler or heir) costs one military power each month to maintain. This puts a soft cap on the amount of leaders a nation can have at the same time. This also means that a monarch with low military skill and a poor selection of military advisors could find himself running a deficit in military power if he has too many generals. If you find yourself running low on military power, you can always dismiss your leaders, but this means you lose their services permanently.

Mercenaries
Every country has its own pool of mercenaries which replenishes over time, but the number of mercenaries you have already recruited impacts how many there are available for you. This isn’t an endless pool of soldiers for you to draw from. There are ideas that increase the size of the pool, as well as reducing the maintenance or cost of mercenaries. There are only mercenaries on land – you can’t hire renegade naval forces to fight for you.

Mercenaries do count against your land force limits – they are not a way to get around the costs of having to field an army that is already stretching your budget. But they do have a couple of advantages in certain situations. First, they are faster to recruit, so if you have seen your main force destroyed but can afford to get new men, mercenaries will get you back in the fight faster. Also, mercenaries fight just as well as regular troops and can be led by your generals and conquistadors if necessary. The best part is that they don't cost any manpower to reinforce, so while they fight and die, you can rebuild your own population for a later war. They are a vital part of any nation’s armed forces, and rich countries can benefit from them quite a lot.

ps. And in case you haven´t read this yet:
Paradox Hands-On Special: Master Class – Europa Universalis IV at Strategy Informer
“After crushing their main army, I then had a sudden wave of conscience as I felt bad for betraying my former allies, so I quickly ended the war in exchange for one of the core provinces I needed.”
http://www.strategyinformer.com/editorials/21807/paradox-hands-on-special-master-class
 

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simast

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What would you (or anyone else here complaining or disappointed) suggest be done?

I am not a game designer, so I will leave this to others. Not asking for the HoI level complexity, but something on par with CK2. Heck, I would take the EU 3 complexity if at least they choose to revamp it (make it feel like new and fresh mechanic).

But maybe it's just me.. I can't seem to get excited for EU 4 as much as the others seem to be.
 

Grubnessul

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Moving to MotE or CK2 type combat would be nice.
Meh, CKII is still pretty much "throw stacks against each other and the largest stack wins." It would improve little and make CKII and EU4 less distinct of each other.
 

basileuspetros

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Why is a province to the south-west of historical Bohemia called "Sudety"? Sudetes (Sudety in Polish/Czech & Sudeten in German) is a mountain range to the NORTH of Bohemia, it separates Bohemia from Silesia and nowadays forms the border between Poland and the Czech Republic. The actual mountain range to the south-west of Bohemia is called the Bohemian Forest (yes, it's a mountain range, not a forest; it's called Böhmerwald in German and Šumava in Czech).
 

MylesSCP

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What would you (or anyone else here complaining or disappointed) suggest be done?
I would suggest a system that is similar to EU3 during the beginning of the game, where there is little variety in unit types and no deployable flanks/tactics. As you progress in technology you unlock different unit types, the ability to design flanks, and ability select general tactics in a similar way to MotE. There was a massive shift in the way warfare was understood and conducted throughout the game, and in EU3 you don't feel this at all. The underlying mechanics might change, but as a player you don't see any of it. At least by allowing more army management it feels like there's been progress even if the underlying mechanics are the same.
 

shanadir

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is there a difference between generals and conquistadors? except the whole conqs can explore thing? it aqlways seemed a bit odd to me that the people who "trained" to explore jungles and whatnot with a few hundred men were also awesome at leading 50 000 soldiers in field battles in central germany...

A cap on the number of troops a conquistador could lead maybe? that would also in a (admittedly small) way help the problem with 20000 soldiers being shipped off to america to smash some indians... now you'd have to send in small stacks first to find them:D

same with explorers/admirals... Columbus might've been a good explorer but give him 60 ships of the line and i doubt he'd know what to do with them


on another note, did the thing where the one hiring mercenaries paid a small sum for every mercenary that died while in his employ actually happen in history or is it just some quasihistorical fancy?
if it did, I think it'd be nice if that was implemented to discourage throwing all your mercenaries att the walls of the enemies, completely ignoring casualties, in an attempt to take a few more provinces before peacing. Most mercenary captains wouldn't like that...

Which, btw, is quite ridiculous in CK2 as well. If you order a suicide attack that kills 3/4's of their troop, they ask LESS money from you? I've intenioally done that because i couldn't actually afford 1500 men so i hired them and suicided 1000 of them immediately....
 

Seli

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Moving to MotE or CK2 type combat would be nice.

In my opinion it would not, CK2 can have detail because we are playing at a character level, MotE because it is essentially a wargame. EU is more distant and with the details of army composition a few levels removed from the power we are. We have generals to take care of those.
 

Strager

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If Ottomans conquer Portugal they have no reason to discover new Asian trade route because they control the old one

That's one possibility.... another is a resurgant Byzantium empire emerged and kicked them out of Greece and Turkey..... the point being, the current system being developed doesn't account for any possibilities like this (which happened more often than not in EU3 - which is a good thing and what made the game such a classic) leaving you with pre-determined nations that will always do certain things according to what they historicly did.

I was really hoping for a more dynamic system than EU3 - instead it seems to be going 100% in the wrong direction. I could be wrong - it's possible Johan is just doing a poor job of explaining the new system (it wouldn't be the first time - sorry Johan!) but from everything I've read thus-far nations seem relatively locked into their ideas with no way of pursuing non-historical possibilities, and guaranteed bonuses for following historical precedence.
 

Closet Skeleton

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is there a difference between generals and conquistadors? except the whole conqs can explore thing? it aqlways seemed a bit odd to me that the people who "trained" to explore jungles and whatnot with a few hundred men were also awesome at leading 50 000 soldiers in field battles in central germany...

Conquistadors get a bonus against certain tech groups in EU3. A bonus that's irrelevant due to the tech differences but it is a difference.

I've read thus-far nations seem relatively locked into their ideas with no way of pursuing non-historical possibilities, and guaranteed bonuses for following historical precedence.

Bonuses for following historical precedence is better than the most obvious smart decision being to go against history, which is often the case in EU3. Best system would be to simulate the factors that made certain historical choices make sense in the context of those that made them.

I don't want another game where the optimum Ottoman strategy is to ignore africa, conquer Persia and the whole Arabian peninsula and then sell non-spice producing provinces to your vassals.
 
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George LeS

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So combat and the military in EU4 will be essentially identical to that in EU3 (except that you've got rid of the ships' shock value). Obviously we can't judge anything until we play the actual game, but I must say that each dev diary (with the exception of the ones on trade, religion, and monarch power) has 'revealed' features that are deeply familiar to me. Any chance of a dev diary surprising me, I wonder?

What is "the ships' shock value" which they've gotten rid of? EUIII ships had guns, hull, and maneuver, that's it. Shock was distinguished from fire in the tech tables, not in the unit files.

One problem I have (and have always had) with the leaders system is the split between admirals and generals. While this is fairly realistic in the 18th C, it isn't earlier. There were many people who were both. It would be nice if we could make this transfer from one service, at a cost increasing with time or tech, at our choice.

Another thing which might be useful would be having a slowdown for the largest forces' tech. Or perhaps, instead of simply enabling units when you reach a given tech, they are enabled by event/decision. (I really want this last feature on other grounds, anyway.) But the idea is that, once you achieve naval mastery, unit types don't change so readily for you. You have to wait until you capture some of the enemy's ships of the new type. This would allow France to actually get new types (frigates, 74's) before Britain, without actually passing them in tech (and thus remaining behind in the combat tables). On land you might only be able to upgrade AFTER you've faced the new types in combat. The idea is that your very lead locks you into the unit types which gained it for you.

On forcelimits, I do believe others have made a good point, that for armies, countries were rarely out of manpower, but frequently hit against the maximum number of troops which they could support in the field. Assuming a serious defeat didn't end a war, countries often built new armies to replace those lost. This should be built into the game.

However, at sea the opposite is really true. It *was* the number of trained sailors which placed an upper limit on a fleet. This limit, I will add, was not actually a max number of ships which you could have in commission, but a point beyond which their efficiency started to drop. (Too many landsmen in the crew.) This, too, would be a good feature. Sure, France can build a fleet as big as the RN, or bigger. But unless they have the seaborne trade which really provides the crews, they will be less efficient.
 
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Decimal

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Ah, missed that. Thanks!

I guess this mechanic has changed? Or at least become more transparent. Never was a fan of the 100 years to convert the last Muslim province in Africa thing.
 

Korsan82

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EU 3.5 gets closer. So far no big improvements apart from trade and National Ideas. Disappointed...
 

Seli

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EU 3.5 gets closer. So far no big improvements apart from trade and National Ideas. Disappointed...

Then don't buy it. Easy.

I think the changes in trade, building, diplomacy, war, peace, map, interface, DHE's, national ideas,etc we have seen so far potentially make up a huge improvement.
 

AdkEric

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Then don't buy it. Easy.

I think the changes in trade, building, diplomacy, war, peace, map, interface, DHE's, national ideas,etc we have seen so far potentially make up a huge improvement.

Aye. Not to mention the engine is new and updated, which will allow for even more improvements as time goes on.

While I haven't seen everything I've been hoping for in EU4, and am not happy about how it's being distributed, it does look to me that the positives are outweighing any negatives and that EU4 has a great deal of potential to be overall a great successor to EU3. Aside from Project Eternity, it's the only game out there that I'm aware of that I'm interested enough in to follow it's development and am looking forward to playing.
 

Corvid

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What would you (or anyone else here complaining or disappointed) suggest be done?

Here are some ideas that I´ve been thinking about for the last few days - some of these should be easy to implement, others would require major modifications to the way combat works. Combine them all and I think a very deep, immersive combat system could be created without going the MotE/CK2 flanks+center route, although that could definitely be integrated as well.

The elements that I would like to add can be summed up as follows:

1. Tasks(i.e, Give Armies More Stuff To Do)

2. More varied types of units

3. Supply lines

4. A levy/militia system

5. Different marching speeds

I will now explain each in moderate detail

1. Tasks

First off, what is the main problem with EU3 warfare? To me it can best be summed up by the fact that it revolves entirely around two specific aspects of war, the pitched battle and the siege, which although both were definitely very important throughout the period nevertheless are only a part of war.

What we need is the ability to assign armies different tasks that result in different types of conflicts when enemy armies find themselves in the same province.

Here are some examples of "tasks" armies could be given:

1. Assault.

This is fairly self-explanatory - the army will attack the enemy, attempting to bring him to battle and engage him en masse to earn a decisive victory. When two armies that have both been given the Assault task meet, a pitched battle is inevitable.

2. Skirmish

The army will NOT engage en-masse but rather engage the enemy in a series of smaller skirmishes, withdrawing if taking casualties and generally attempt to drag the fight out. This is what you attempt to do if your force of say, 1.000 cavalrymen cannot get out of the way of the doomstack bearing down on it.

3. Defend/Dig in

The army will seek out "good ground" and begin constructing defensive lines, sighting artillery, putting up stakes to repel cavalry etc. A unit given this task will first have a moderate jump in it's defensive stats, representing the positioning in good ground, but then it's defensive stats will slowly tick up for a LONG time, until over the course of several months it reaches a maximum. This represents the "digging in" phase as the field fortifications are gradually constructed.

4. Block

A variation on Defend, it confers not quite as good defensive bonuses(but still good ones), but has a special effect - an enemy army cannot exit the province in any direction without automatically Assaulting the blocking force - except they go back the way they came.

5. Retreat

This army will attempt to extricate itself from combat in an orderly fashion, as a cohesive whole, exiting a province in a direction you choose. This is what you use when you are losing but expect to be able to fight again soon, for instance if you can link up with friendly troops in a nearby province.

6. Disperse.

The army scatters, sending regiments in all available directions - now it's "every man for himself". Good to use if you just got your ass kicked and your army is in danger of being wiped out - hopefully at least some elements of it will make it home alive!¨ Also has it's uses when your supply lines(more on this later in this post) are cut. The units move very fast in all directions, and are automatically given the task Evade when they reach the neighbouring province.

7. Evade

This army is actively attempting to avoid engagement with enemy forces. This is the task you give formations that you want to slip through enemy lines, passing through the same province as that deadly doomstack, to do other stuff elsewhere. Light units led by generals with very high maneuver stats are best for this. Carting a lot of heavy cannons and siege equipment is bad, and it should not work unless the enemy is not interested in fighting.

8. Patrol

This task means the army is engaged in "rear echelon duties" - looking for enemy units, keeping the roads clear, and generally projecting the power of their army throughout the province, especially towards the civilian population. This task works well against skirmishing guerillas, and having units on Patrol in a province lowers revolt risk, both at home during peacetime and in occupied territories. In fact, for an enemy province to be considered fully under your control, you HAVE to have a certain minimum number of troops(based on it's size and population) patrolling it.


Using these eight tasks, you quickly have a lot of different types of conflicts deped I´m working on creating a matrix for these, but here are some examples:

Assault vs Assault

Two armies head towards each other, eager to fight a decisive battle. This will be decided in a matter of days. The standard EU3 battle really.

Assault vs Skirmish

One side attempts to corner an elusive foe and bring him to battle, while the opposing general conducts a hit-and-run campaign, attempting to bring the enemy force to it's knees via a "death by a thousand cuts" If the general that wants to skirmish can keep control of the engagement and avoid a battle, then the casualties will only come in a slow trickle, a few to a dozen men each day, lasting months or even years.

Assault via Defend

One side hurls itself at the enemy lines, taking heavy casualties. You better have numerical superiority for this one.

Defend vs Defend

Both sides dig in and eye each other warily across the no-man's land. This is basically trench warfare. Both armies take a minimal tricle of casualties in this mode, leading to the engagement lasting for months or years, so the ability to resupply and shield themselves from attrition becomes important in determining who has the upper hand.

Skirmish vs Defend

One army has dug in, but rather than assault it the opposing commander elects to probe their lines with small raids, looking to disrupt their operations and find weaknesses in their defenses. This also has minimal casualties and can drag on for a long time, but with one important exception: A Defending army that is being Skirmished with stops slowly increasing it's defensive stats. The strategic implications are obvious I think.

Evade vs Block

One side attempts to slip through the enemy lines unmolested to rampage through the rear areas, doing all manners of nasty things. The other side wants to stop this.

2. More varied types of units


This is easily achieved in combination with the "tasks" outlined above. From the three basic unit types of infantry, cavalry and artillery it is very easy to create special units with tons of flavor by giving them added descriptos that make them better at certain tasks and poor at others. Light irregular infantry would therefore receive descriptors that give them bonuses to successfully conducting Skirmish, Evade and Retreat tasks. Want to make heavy armoured cavalry? Give them descriptors that boost their efficiency and staying power during Assaults and high base Shock values, but makes them really, really bad at Evade, Skirmish and suchlike.

This way you can distinguish between relatively light, maneuverable battlefield artillery and siege artillery, between backwater mountain warriors and line infantry, between guerillas and elite Guards while sticking to the same basic unit types. Add to this descriptors that interact with terrain types and regions and you can create units that are deadly when in their element while being not so good outside it, giving you a reason to recruit natives that might not be of the highest tech level, but function better in deserts/jungles/mountains etc, than regular troops.

Side note: This could for example solve the "North Africa problem" by making Muslim forces very good in desert terrain(or alternately, European forces very poor), but ineffective outside of it. This way the Muslim kingdoms have a fighting chance of hanging on to their lands while preventing a speedy re-Reconquista.

3. Supply lines and various changes to attrition.

This is a variation of the trade route system that is being introduced in EU4. As in EU3, every province has a supply limit, and during the early game, most armies are small enough that they are irrelevant(late medieval armies didn't much have to worry about logistics, at least not to the same extent as later periods). But at higher tech levels, new units called Supply Trains become available. These allow you to stack bigger armies into a single province(concentrating your fighting forces or "doomstacking) without getting murdeder by attrition, provided you have A) enough Supply train units to service the entire army and B), an unbroken line of occupied provinces between your home provinces the army being supplied. A new mapmode, Supply Lines Mapmode would show these lines stretching back like an umbilical cord, and the bigger the supply line, the "fatter" the line. It provides full supply in the province the supply train(s) are located in, and some fraction of that supply in adjacent provinces, allowing you to conduct operations in a sphere around your "mother army"

These supply lines can be raided by the enemy, contracting their ability to supply the army, or cut entirely should any of the provinces revert to their original owner, forcing your to disperse your doomstack or get totally raped by attrition.

Supply trains have their downsides though. Much like artillery, they make their army slow as molasses, and good luck for such an army to catch a small, light, nimble opponent that wants to Skirmish or Evade for example.

4. A Levy/Militia system

This is partly inspired by CK2, but not quite. Basically these are the units that are "embedded" in your provinces and can be raised/mobilized in the event of a war. Think about it like pressing a button raises rebels friendly to you in a province.

They do not cost money, but they do not have very good baseline stats either. However, there would be ways to improve your militias through decisions like "The Militia Act", and some National Ideas would boost their effectiveness as well. But the biggest upside to militias is that they get bonuses to their effectiveness when fighting at home. These bonuses would be at their maximum when actually in their home province, some significant fraction when in an adjacent province(still close to home) and some moderate/small fraction elsewhere in the nation, disappearing entirely as soon as the militia unit is sent abroad.

Bolstered by a good general and stiffened up by a few regular army units, militias can punch significantly above their weight provided to keep them in their right places. But militias resent being mobilized for long stretches of time and will begin to randomly disband themselves if kept in the field too long.

This system would allow peaceful, diplomacy and trade-oriented nations to actually have some military capacity without having to maintain a large standing army to counter more expansionistic nations.


5. Different marching speeds


This is a pet peeve of mine. I think there really, really, REALLY needs to be the option to set the marching speed of your armies. Make it a trade-off between speed and the shape your armies will be in when they arrive. If you absolutely positively want to get somewhere fast, you can - but not all of your men will make it(attrition spikes) and those who do will be in poor fighting shape for a few days(morale drops significantly, but regenerates fairly quickly).

Good for beating your opponent to that key defensive terrain province, or staying outside the reach of an army that can annihilate you.


So, I guess these are my two cents.
 

Seli

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Here are some ideas that I´ve been thinking about for the last few days - some of these should be easy to implement, others would require major modifications to the way combat works. Combine them all and I think a very deep, immersive combat system could be created without going the MotE/CK2 flanks+center route, although that could definitely be integrated as well.
...

That is probably all nice for a war-oriented game in which immersive battles is what you'd want, but I really don't see the need for something this intricate in a much broader game such as EU. Especially because -since the game needs to be accessible- a lot of these intricacies would necessarily disappear underneath the hood.