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Welcome to another development diary for Europa Universalis IV and today we focus on warfare. Yes, you knew this dev diary was coming, didn’t you? It’s really quite difficult to play the game without understanding how the armies work.

Warfare is one of the most important aspects of Europa Universalis IV, and over the almost 400 years of gameplay, armies and navies will be your prime instruments of power when you go to war. You need to be aware of the different units of your armies and their strengths and weaknesses.
So, it is time to build some armies and go to war! In times of war, you will have to raise and maintain armies and fleets, conquer nations and project your power onto the world. You see them standing, moving and fighting on the map.

Battlefield casualties and general attrition will naturally reduce the number of men or quality of ships available to you as you play, but armies will be slowly reinforced and navies in a safe port will slowly be repaired. As you upgrade your technology, you will unlock different types of these units, each with different offensive and defensive characteristics. Some have attributes that favor the attack, some favor the defense, and others are suited for a more balanced approach. Each approach has its advantages and disadvantages depending on your circumstances, and it will be up to you to decide what kind of army you want.

Land Units
Just as in earlier Europa Universalis games, land units are divided into infantry, cavalry and artillery. As you move through the ages, your armies will evolve from men-at-arms and armored knights to advanced musketmen and dragoons, and everything in between. The specific types of unit available to you, and its offensive and defensive abilities, are also dependent on your culture. Asian countries can get samurai cavalry, for example, but you won’t find these guys riding around Spain unless you send them there.

You select your preferred unit type of your land units, as you discover them through technology. This interface allows you to select the focus of your military forces. Each unit you build represents a force of 1000 men.

Infantry will be the bulk of your army. They are your cheapest units, and don’t take long to recruit. Your cavalry are the force you rely on in a battle to hit the flanks of an outnumbered enemy or chase down those that can’t stand against you. They cost about double what an infantryman does. Artillery only become available at Land Technology Level 7 (Limber) and they are most important for their firepower on the battlefield and their effectiveness during sieges.

When you build your armies, keep in mind that an army that is more cavalry than infantry loses the “combined arms” advantage. Cavalry could be very powerful and fast at times in this era, but rarely outnumbered foot soldiers on the battlefield.

In the military menu, you can see four columns with data on the land units. First there is the power, second the ability during fire, third is ability during shock, and finally the number of regiments you have of that category.

Naval Units
There are four types of ships: heavy ships, light ships, galleys and transports. Unlike armies, each construction represents individual ships and have a strength measured in a percentage – a ship at 100% is in perfect health. Ships take damage in battles, of course, but also if they are in the open sea for too long. (This is naval attrition.) Ships only repair when in port.

Each naval unit has characteristics, just like army units. There are no longer any separate fire/shock values per ship type, as a ship-based gun is basically a gun. However, every type of ship has a different number of cannons, and a different hull size. There are also ideas that improve your ships ability to fight, or as we call it, the ships’ power.

The four different ship types have different purposes. Your main battle fleet will be composed of heavy ships (carracks, galleons, etc.). Light ships (barques, caravels, frigates, etc.) have better speed and are OK in a fight but will mostly be used to protect and project your trade power. Galleys (and later galleases and chebecks) are designed for fighting in inland seas and enclosed bodies of water. Your transports (cogs, flytes, merchantmen, etc.) are, as the name suggests, your lightly armed vessels intended to move troops across the water.

In the military interface, ship types have four columns, first there is the power, second the amount of guns, third is hull size, and finally the numbers of ships you have of that category.

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Leaders
Any military situation calls for extensive knowledge and leadership, and, for a monarch like yourself, how to choose which of the leaders at your service will serve what purpose in the war you just happened to find yourself in. (Clearly this war is not your fault.)

Though you can always put your monarch or a mature heir at the head of your army, you will hire most of your leaders from the general population. You can recruit generals, admirals, conquistadors and explorers as leaders. Generals and conquistadors, as land leaders, cost you 25 Military Power. Admirals and explorers, as naval leaders, cost you 25 Diplomatic Power. Once you’ve hired a leader, it can be assigned to lead any army or naval unit. As expected, generals are used to lead armies and admirals are used to lead navies. Assign conquistadors and explorers to units you wish to send far away or to uncharted lands – these are the only units that can venture into unexplored parts of the map (those sections covered by a white fog).

The skill of a leader determines how good he is at performing different strategies and tactics in combat. Leader skill is partly related to your nation’s military or naval tradition; countries with a history of warfare will be more likely to notice these talents among soldiers or general citizenry.

The four different attributes of leaders are scored from 0 to 6. “Fire” is their ability to direct the use of gunpowder or missile weapons. “Shock” measures how well the leader is at assaults, charges, whatever happens when ranged combat turns to man-to-man action. “Maneuver” is the ability of a leader to move his troops through land safely and get his forces into the right position for battle. Finally, the “Siege” attribute is most important for quickly taking down enemy cities. Paying close attention to these may be the difference between defeating an army twice your size or getting crushed.

Every leader (except your current ruler or heir) costs one military power each month to maintain. This puts a soft cap on the amount of leaders a nation can have at the same time. This also means that a monarch with low military skill and a poor selection of military advisors could find himself running a deficit in military power if he has too many generals. If you find yourself running low on military power, you can always dismiss your leaders, but this means you lose their services permanently.

Mercenaries
Every country has its own pool of mercenaries which replenishes over time, but the number of mercenaries you have already recruited impacts how many there are available for you. This isn’t an endless pool of soldiers for you to draw from. There are ideas that increase the size of the pool, as well as reducing the maintenance or cost of mercenaries. There are only mercenaries on land – you can’t hire renegade naval forces to fight for you.

Mercenaries do count against your land force limits – they are not a way to get around the costs of having to field an army that is already stretching your budget. But they do have a couple of advantages in certain situations. First, they are faster to recruit, so if you have seen your main force destroyed but can afford to get new men, mercenaries will get you back in the fight faster. Also, mercenaries fight just as well as regular troops and can be led by your generals and conquistadors if necessary. The best part is that they don't cost any manpower to reinforce, so while they fight and die, you can rebuild your own population for a later war. They are a vital part of any nation’s armed forces, and rich countries can benefit from them quite a lot.

ps. And in case you haven´t read this yet:
Paradox Hands-On Special: Master Class – Europa Universalis IV at Strategy Informer
“After crushing their main army, I then had a sudden wave of conscience as I felt bad for betraying my former allies, so I quickly ended the war in exchange for one of the core provinces I needed.”
http://www.strategyinformer.com/editorials/21807/paradox-hands-on-special-master-class
 

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takedown47

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AGEOD games have the best military system. Paradox battles are rubbish compared to games like Alea Jacta Est and Birth of Rome, but unfortunately those AGEOD games suffer from a poor engine design and bad campaign maps (just think of the terrible lag issues with pride of nations and the complicated hard to understand game interface/economic system). Paradox has some of the best grand strategy/ campaign map level games in the market but if they want to progress to the next level and start to make new customers stand up and take notice they really really need to fix the military aspect. There is no strategy or tactical maneuvering, no postures or stances that can be assigned and there are too few variables (at least compared to the Age2 engine).

Just drool over the nice unit cards and leader traits in their latest title and you'll see what I mean:
646512_full.jpg

fp58dFULL.png

imperatorsev193.jpg

646520_full.jpg


I know Paradox is set in their ways and they would rather invest time into a trade system and dynamic weather (which I love by the way) but if I can be constructive instead of just critical I would say this is what is lacking:

- We need generals with detailed traits that influence critical things (CK2 did a good job of this) so basically more variables in battle
- Focus on singleplayer (or at least make games for singleplayer and games for multiplayer), this way in singleplayer games battle can be calculated and resolved in a single day of game time instead of being fought out over 14-15 days between dice rolls and various phases.
- Supply is important. Its not that hard to have provinces produce something generic like food and military supplies which must be loaded up onto units called "Supply Wagons/Carts" and moved with the army when marching through enemy territory. If this is not part of the military system than we get doomstacks marching into weird places like deserts or 100k men landing in Corsica. This leads to my second point..
- More units with their own images. We love total war because we can see units on a 3D battlefield. Clearly that is unrealistic and quite frankly unnecessary in a Paradox Grand Strategy but the same effect can be created just by having unit graphics (see the screenshots above). This creates more work for artists but they will thank you for giving them a permanent job with something important to do. I noticed this was done with March of the Eagles but not any other title.
 
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ABookshelf

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So basically unit types are still ridiculously simplistic and mercenaries are still useless and entirely inconsequential to the game unless you're a OPM.

Huh...I thought these diaries were supposed to highlight new features?
 

sinugie

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great dd, if i want to play pokemon strategy i play total war, paradox is grand strategy level, unit factoring for each nation should be represent on grand scope, like economy, technology and such, not trivial
 

Poh

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So basically unit types are still ridiculously simplistic and mercenaries are still useless and entirely inconsequential to the game unless you're a OPM.

Huh...I thought these diaries were supposed to highlight new features?

i wouldnt say that about mercs. Look at the picture Austria got 100k manpower and an army of 100k soldiers. Ofc we dont know if thats max manpower or how much it is. But we know that max manpower is equal to 10 years of manpower gain. Im pretty sure with the new system if you dont use mercs you are either not going to do alot of wars or you are simply going to destroy your manpower pool and then get eaten by your neighbors
 

Earl Uhtred

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It seems far too much like the existing system, which is horribly flawed and in some ways a step backwards in realism even from the arcane board game on which the series is based. I really hoped the new trade system meant we might get a new logistical system on the same basis in place of the dumb and exploitable copout that is provincial supply limits. With the example of CK2 and March of the Eagles behind it, it would also have been great if the transition from a feudal levy around a professional and/or mercenary core, to a large professional army backed by conscription - which was in many ways the defining feature of the age - had been mirrored, as the nations that succeeded in the long run were the ones that managed to adapt themselves to this concept.

It's even more disappointing, at least to me, that we're back to huge standing fleets from the 15th century on featuring ships that will endure for the length of the game if not sunk or disbanded. (Yes you can use your 400 year old carrack fleet for piracy suppression in the South Pacific in the early 19th century.) IRL England in particular was a pathetically weak naval power at the game's start date, and that it was not invaded has mainly to do with the preoccupation of its Continental rivals and *drumroll* logistics and the difficulty and expense of raising an invasion fleet, none of which, it seems, will be significantly better modelled in EUIV than in EUIII.

Not that it will stop me buying the game.
 
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the_legion

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Two 'small' request for leaders:
(hope they'll make it in)

1) Please put a cooldown on reasigning leaders to another army (Either general 20/30 Days or based on the range he's away from the capital). In EU3 you could take your best general to fight a battle against Ming in Asia and the next day he was fighting France in Europe. That way you'd have the strategic decission to make where to place your little Napoleon.

2) If a ship sinks with a leader onboard in mid-Atlantic the leader has to DIE. To avoid exploiting it as 'King-Killing-Machine', King-Leaders should be excluded from the rule or there sould be a massive (-6) stability hit if your leader dies in battle/onseas (which is historical because nothing shook a nation more than their monarch killed in action) or other nasty consequences (like massive rebels).

----------------------------------------------

I like the mercenary-addition. It makes sense that mercenaries have the same morale as 'normal soldiers' because in that days mercs where the proffessionals on the battlefield. Not sure about the maintenance of generals, I feel it would be better to have the recruitment-cost in Military-Power-Points and the maintenance-cost in cash imho, but let's see how it will work ingame.
 

1alexey

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I can not get people that say "EU is not a wargame, it doesn`t need a complex warfare system".

The "uncomplex" system always comes down to who has more manpower and gold, plain and simple. We will spend a lot of time fighting wars. Soe wars will decide if we succed or if we fail. Warfare needs to be interesting and entertaining, not just number crunching.

In EU3, there was the simple-best composition of troops that didn`t varry much thrugh the game. That is uninteresting.
 

Synge316

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Very underwhelming DD :(

Everything else I've seen so far has looked great but I was really hoping that there would at least be some marked improvement in the the military system since war is such big part of the EU series. Even CK2 and Vicky2 have better systems. It's probably too late to redo it but I'd love for some elements of CK2/MotE to be brought into it. Flanks, supply lines, army orders (like those in MotE and mentioned by Corvid), more than 3 unit types, leader traits, etc...
 

wolfing

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Just to make something clear. I do NOT want a more complex combat system. I like EU3 mostly because of that, I don't have to worry about army composition and tactics. I like the EU3 system as it is, it's the generals that have the good or bad stats (meaning, good or bad tactics), not me. My job is to form the army stacks and move them around the map as my grand strategy dictates.

Having said that, I'm worried that none of the problems of the EU3 system are changing. I would have liked this DD to say things like "We changed the leaders to be non-combat units of their own, when attached to a stack their stats would affect the army. That also means they would have to move around the world as your other units (i.e. no more teleporting generals)". And "We made the non western europeans combat units stronger, equivalent in power to any other units at the same tech level of any other country. Of course, they still get them much later because of the research penalties, but the penalties won't be 'double-dipped' as in EU3". That would have made me happy, but this DD could have been summed in one line... a link to the EU3 combat wiki page.
 

grommile

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The "uncomplex" system always comes down to who has more manpower and gold, plain and simple.
... Sometimes. Play your hand right, and you can beat a less-competent opponent who has substantially more of both.
 

Seli

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I can not get people that say "EU is not a wargame, it doesn`t need a complex warfare system".

The "uncomplex" system always comes down to who has more manpower and gold, plain and simple. We will spend a lot of time fighting wars. Soe wars will decide if we succed or if we fail. Warfare needs to be interesting and entertaining, not just number crunching.

In EU3, there was the simple-best composition of troops that didn`t varry much thrugh the game. That is uninteresting.

Personally because I don't want to play the micromanagment game where I have to keep close track of which army is where and if they are going to fight in the correct terrain against the correct opponents. Especially with a game design that I like which makes showing that important information at a glance nearly impossible.
But more importantly because the true problems with war were never with the way armies behaved in battle, but more at the peace table, manoeuvring, fights-to-the-death. And most of those -as discussed in other places- have been changed. The aim of the game design is apparently to make wars more goal-oriented and making strategic decisions on how to use available manpower and leadership. Which to me makes a lot more sense in the general feeling of the series than trying to optimize the tactical sides of the battle system.
 

Seli

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Battle tactics on this level are a distraction. Logistics on the other hand...

Those seem to have changed as well. At least I remember reading a post by Johan about an increased need for lines of supply and more penalties for deeply penetrating enemy controlled territory.
 

1alexey

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... Sometimes. Play your hand right, and you can beat a less-competent opponent who has substantially more of both.
And what exactly does allow for skill difference, if not complexity?
Personally because I don't want to play the micromanagment game where I have to keep close track of which army is where and if they are going to fight in the correct terrain against the correct opponents. Especially with a game design that I like which makes showing that important information at a glance nearly impossible.
But more importantly because the true problems with war were never with the way armies behaved in battle, but more at the peace table, manoeuvring, fights-to-the-death. And most of those -as discussed in other places- have been changed. The aim of the game design is apparently to make wars more goal-oriented and making strategic decisions on how to use available manpower and leadership. Which to me makes a lot more sense in the general feeling of the series than trying to optimize the tactical sides of the battle system.
I can understand the wish to have more simple game where you need to do less. But i disagree completely that it is not the problem of EU.

EU suffers a lot from the syndrom where wars are extremly predictable. You go to war, you know that you win it. THe stupid behaviour at diplomacy desk doesn`t change that.

I also do not see anything wrong with you being punished for engaging in wrong terrain or with wrong composition.
Battle tactics on this level are a distraction. Logistics on the other hand...
Actually vice versa. Kings an leaders were very often in comand of the armies, while supplies were more often than not delegated lower down the chain, so ligistic is distraction, and tactics is not.
 

Earl Uhtred

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Actually vice versa. Kings an leaders were very often in comand of the armies, while supplies were more often than not delegated lower down the chain, so ligistic is distraction, and tactics is not.

Medieval military logistics may have been fairly crude but commanders were and have always been heavily concerned with supply. Even if they hadn't been, supply and the constraints it imposes exists regardless.

With naval warfare logistical advances were the difference between longterm success and failure - the ability to keep fleets on station ever further from the home country for ever longer periods. Improvements in physical and financial infrastructure, not tactical or weapons superiority, were what gave Venice its early edge and later allowed first the Netherlands, then England to dominate the oceans.

Just having a regiment or cluster of generic ships that you can leapfrog out to the ends of the earth where they will sit indefinitely until you call on them is highly unsatisfactory.
 

BelisariuS.F

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Actually vice versa. Kings an leaders were very often in comand of the armies, while supplies were more often than not delegated lower down the chain, so ligistic is distraction, and tactics is not.
But you are playing as a state, not a king.
You argue for a more complex warfare system, and yet you say that logistics is a distraction. You realize that logistics is part of warfare, and not just a distracting part, but central (you surely heard the saying "amateurs talk tactics, professionals talk logistics")? And that's especially true on strategic level (which EU focuses on). For example, you can plan some grand maneuvers deep into the enemy territory, but it will be a failure if you cannot supply your army everywhere it is (or cannot protect your supply lines).
 
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Stoycho

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AGEOD games have the best military system. Paradox battles are rubbish compared to games like Alea Jacta Est and Birth of Rome, but unfortunately those AGEOD games suffer from a poor engine design and bad campaign maps (just think of the terrible lag issues with pride of nations and the complicated hard to understand game interface/economic system). Paradox has some of the best grand strategy/ campaign map level games in the market but if they want to progress to the next level and start to make new customers stand up and take notice they really really need to fix the military aspect. There is no strategy or tactical maneuvering, no postures or stances that can be assigned and there are too few variables (at least compared to the Age2 engine).

- We need generals with detailed traits that influence critical things (CK2 did a good job of this) so basically more variables in battle
- Focus on singleplayer (or at least make games for singleplayer and games for multiplayer), this way in singleplayer games battle can be calculated and resolved in a single day of game time instead of being fought out over 14-15 days between dice rolls and various phases.
- Supply is important. Its not that hard to have provinces produce something generic like food and military supplies which must be loaded up onto units called "Supply Wagons/Carts" and moved with the army when marching through enemy territory. If this is not part of the military system than we get doomstacks marching into weird places like deserts or 100k men landing in Corsica. This leads to my second point..
- More units with their own images. We love total war because we can see units on a 3D battlefield. Clearly that is unrealistic and quite frankly unnecessary in a Paradox Grand Strategy but the same effect can be created just by having unit graphics (see the screenshots above). This creates more work for artists but they will thank you for giving them a permanent job with something important to do. I noticed this was done with March of the Eagles but not any other title.

outstanding post!