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Today is thursday, the day of the God of Thunder, so what is a more appropriate way to celebrate than with a development diary for Europa Univeralis IV. We’ve talked about development and politics the last few weeks, so now its time to talk a bit more about warfare again, before going back to more peacetime-related activities.

All of this mentioned in this development diary will be in the free update accompanying the next expansion.

Fortress Rework
Connecting a bit to the previous reveal of our change to how building works, we have overhauled the fortress system.

There are now four different forts, one available each century, providing 1, 3, 5 and 7 fort-levels each. A newer fort makes the previous obsolete, so you only have 1 fort in each province. Each fortress also provides 5000 garrison per fort level, so besieging a fortress now requires a large investment.

Forts now also require maintenance to be paid each month, which currently costs about 1.5 ducats for a level 1 fort per month in 1444. Luckily, you can mothball a fortress which makes it drop to just 10 men defending it, and won’t cost you anything in upkeep.

Garrison growth for a fort is also a fair amount slower than before, so after you have taken a fort, you may want to stick around to protect it for a bit.

What is most important to know though, is that forts now have a Zone of Control. First of all, they will automatically take control of any adjacent province that does not have any forts that is adjacent and hostile to them. If two fortress compete over the same province, then the one with highest fort-level wins and in case of a tie, control goes to the owner of the province. Secondly, you can not walk past a fortress and its zone of control, as you have to siege down the blocking fort first.

Each capital have a free fort-level, but that fort will not have any ZoC, as most minor nations can not afford a major fortress.

fH0WehV.jpg



Looting
As we promised, we have now completely revised how looting works. Now there is a “pile” of possible loot in a province, which is directly tied to have developed the province is.

At the end of each month, all hostile units in a province attempt to loot, and the amount they loot depend on how many regiments you have there, and what types they are, where cavalry is by far the best. Some ideas and governments increase the amount you loot each month, where for example Steppe Hordes gains a nice boost.

A province starts recovering from being looted when 6 months have passed since last loot, and it takes up to a year until it has fully recovered.

Of course, the penalty on a province from being looted is still there until it has fully recovered, but it is scaled on how much have been looted.

Ea5YCKh.jpg


Committed Armies
One of the major complaints we have had on the combat in Eu4, has been the fact that you can fully abort your movement whenever you liked. This have been changed, and now you can’t abort your movement if you have already moved 50% of the way. After all, its just common sense that a unit that have already moved halfway between the centers of two provinces is already in the second one.

Force Limits
We felt that the calculations of forcelimits where far too hidden from the player, Players saw stuff like “+25.87 from Provinces”, which based based on projections of base-tax amongst other things, and sometimes those dropped for no obvious reasons.

Now you will be able to see in each province how much it provides to your forcelimits, and we have cleaned up the logic.

Each level of development gives 0.1 land and naval forcelimit.
Overseas will provide -2 land and -2 naval forcelimit
Inland provinces will not provide any naval forcelimit.
However, a province will never be able to provide negative forcelimits.

A nation also have a base value of +3 land and +2 naval force limit, and there are some other ways to get direct forcelimit increased, that are not just percentage increases.

IRmTjoZ.jpg



Next week, we'll be back and talk more about The Devout.
 

Pigeoncount

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Ouch. That would answer my concern about fighting the HRE emperor as say Denmark. Sounds like there will be some super fierce battles over Lübeck, Lauenberg, Holstein, etc.

As the original post says, capital province forts are free, but will not have a ZoC, which sounds like to me meaning that OPM nations will work exactly as they did before, while the strategy for invading major nations is entirely different.

Edit:

Btw is this new start date? What happened to Burgundy!! o_O

It was nerfed into the ground. It looks like the Dutch region was given partial independence, so that it doesn't spend almost every single game as just a part of a larger nation.
 
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WhiskyGlen

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As the original post says, capital province forts are free, but will not have a ZoC, which sounds like to me meaning that OPM nations will work exactly as they did before, while the strategy for invading major nations is entirely different.

Yes, but it seems to indicate the fort could still be upgraded, no? And if you are an HRE nation, your provinces are generally wealthy and it's hard to believe the AI would not all upgrade their capital forts if they are a one or two province nation. Since they are more defensive nations than offensive... If I were playing as a one province nation, first thing I would do is upgrade that fort and worry about defense first..
 

Golladan

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I don't think conquest will be slow, if you take the forts other land will fall automatically, speeding the things nicely. For example in that screenshot aboce, conquer Paris and you get as a bonus 5 surrounding provinces, providing that they don't have forts.
Where are people getting this from? The diary doesn't say anything about sieging a fort and suddenly all surrounding land is yours. It says that if you siege the fort you are able to move past its zone of control.

Also the diary also says that capitals do not have a zone of control.

As the original post says, capital province forts are free, but will not have a ZoC, which sounds like to me meaning that OPM nations will work exactly as they did before, while the strategy for invading major nations is entirely different.
It says that capital provinces gain a free fort level. But the screenshot also shows that Edirne is costing the Ottomans some money.
 

Pigeoncount

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They do already do that, I don't think I've ever not seen all of Europe end up with top tier forts by the end game. It will be harder to siege down a OPM from the sound of this, but I think that will be more fun, and make OPM a more important part of conflicts. You can still effectively ignore them in lieu of an invasion on Austria, since their capital forts cannot block movement.
 
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ruzen

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I liked every idea / feature! Cant wait to play and when will you guys announce the new expantion and what is it about? Cause I wana know :D
Also I think with the current state of "Ottoman Dynaysty" need a new goverment just like England. Not a like but Sultan System where they can pretend or kill other brothers.
 
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WhiskyGlen

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One thing I love about this update is the committed armies idea. No more playing cat and mouse with an AI army that realizes you are about to reinforce a province they are about to attack. Although, a suggestion is to allow an army to back out, but have it based on how many days past they are. For example, it takes 20 days to go from province A to province B. After 10 days, the army is in province B. Say it's 14 days, the army should be able to turn around, however, it takes four days to complete the return to the original province.

You know, this could ultimately set-up a future game where there are no "provinces." Movement is free based on terrain and army width. Roads could be hand-built for increase troop movement and forts could be placed at actual choke points. Although, this would be more of an EUV thing...
 
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Pigeoncount

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Where are people getting this from? The diary doesn't say anything about sieging a fort and suddenly all surrounding land is yours. It says that if you siege the fort you are able to move past its zone of control.

Also the diary also says that capitals do not have a zone of control.

It says that capital provinces gain a free fort level. But the screenshot also shows that Edirne is costing the Ottomans some money.
Where are people getting this from? The diary doesn't say anything about sieging a fort and suddenly all surrounding land is yours. It says that if you siege the fort you are able to move past its zone of control.

Also the diary also says that capitals do not have a zone of control.

It says that capital provinces gain a free fort level. But the screenshot also shows that Edirne is costing the Ottomans some money.

Oh, my mistake then! That sounds a bit more annoying than how I read it, but I think that'll still be fine.
 

WhiskyGlen

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They do already do that, I don't think I've ever not seen all of Europe end up with top tier forts by the end game. It will be harder to siege down a OPM from the sound of this, but I think that will be more fun, and make OPM a more important part of conflicts. You can still effectively ignore them in lieu of an invasion on Austria, since their capital forts cannot block movement.


Johan said:
Each capital have a free fort-level, but that fort will not have any ZoC,

To me this indicate that the capital fort is "level 0."

So a nation could upgrade that level 0 fort to a level 1 or better. I guess he does say most minor nations cannot afford a fort level. But he does say it's 1.5 ducats per month for a level 1 fort level. What does an HRE minor with one province usually pull in per month? It's been so long since I've played a minor..
 

Golladan

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To me this indicate that the capital fort is "level 0."

So a nation could upgrade that level 0 fort to a level 1 or better. I guess he does say most minor nations cannot afford a fort level. But he does say it's 1.5 ducats per month for a level 1 fort level. What does an HRE minor with one province usually pull in per month? It's been so long since I've played a minor..
Screenshot from the first developer diary (Stockholm selected) suggests that the capital has a level 1 fort.
 

lolada

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Where are people getting this from? The diary doesn't say anything about sieging a fort and suddenly all surrounding land is yours. It says that if you siege the fort you are able to move past its zone of control.

Also the diary also says that capitals do not have a zone of control.

It says that capital provinces gain a free fort level. But the screenshot also shows that Edirne is costing the Ottomans some money.
I see...

Ok so I take the fort and i can move forward, now i get ZOC from that fort. Then i guess its back to carpet siege/loot or attack new fort?

What will be the size of garrison then in provinces without forts ? I assumed something like 50 or zero, thats why i thought other provinces will fall automatically.
 

WhiskyGlen

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Where are people getting this from? The diary doesn't say anything about sieging a fort and suddenly all surrounding land is yours. It says that if you siege the fort you are able to move past its zone of control.

I was clearly wrong in my suggestion of a domino affect as I thought forts fell too, but it does clearly say that taking a fort does grant you surrounding land if the fort is more powerful than any fort near any nearby provinces.

Johan said:
First of all, they will automatically take control of any adjacent province that does not have any forts that is adjacent and hostile to them. If two fortress compete over the same province, then the one with highest fort-level wins and in case of a tie, control goes to the owner of the province.

So what Johan is implying is that if Lübeck has a fort 3 and Schleswig has a fort 1, then once war breaks out, Holstein will go to The Hansa or whomever controls Lübeck. The question, however, is when a fort falls, is it considered "destroyed" and removed from the map or does it transfer control. I would have to guess the forts are now removed from the map?
 

jrgen3

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Are you adding some optimisation with the new provinces and tags (at least 2 new tags and a bunch released from Burgundy)?
Also, regarding the Netherlands: Breda should go to Brabant instead of Holland.
Wouldn't having 7 vassals have a very significant impact on Burgundian monarch point generation or has something changed here?
 
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All these new changes are incredably good. If you continue to adress other community complaints such as naval system this game's gonna be a completely different game with the next patch.

I am assuming this will be released in June so plenty of time to make it perfect.
 

GamingHUD

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This seems like a potentially interesting change.

The question, however, is when a fort falls, is it considered "destroyed" and removed from the map or does it transfer control. I would have to guess the forts are now removed from the map?

Transfer control. Johan mentioned needing to consider protecting recently occupied forts better than previously due to the slower garrison recovery rates.
 

Philadelphus

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Wow. Just...wow. This is huge. A major gamechanger. I'm quite looking forward to it.

What is most important to know though, is that forts now have a Zone of Control. First of all, they will automatically take control of any adjacent province that does not have any forts that is adjacent and hostile to them. If two fortress compete over the same province, then the one with highest fort-level wins and in case of a tie, control goes to the owner of the province.
So if I'm interpreting this correctly, a fort can't take control of provinces that have a fort in them, correct? Also, what exactly does "take control of" mean? Just normal occupation?

If so, this suggests that leveling up your military tech to get the next fort level before your neighbors could be very valuable, as you could build a fort a level above them next to a few non-fortified provinces then declare war for some instant free warscore due to the occupied provinces.
 
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WhiskyGlen

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Screenshot from the first developer diary (Stockholm selected) suggests that the capital has a level 1 fort.

I went back and looked and you are correct on that. Which I guess would indicate capitals can upgrade to a level 3, but level 1s are free. At which point, it would likely be too expensive for a one or two province nation to have a zone of control fort.

GamingHUD said:
Transfer control. Johan mentioned needing to consider protecting recently occupied forts better than previously due to the slower garrison recovery rates.

Thanks for pointing that out. I seem to be off a lot tonight. Then again, I probably should be sleeping, but this has made me quite excited. Although, since forts are now so expensive, does this mean occupying a lot of forts will bankrupt you or would they simply not cost you while occupied? I imagine they will still cost you... Perhaps an option to remove occupied forts?
 

Golladan

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Worth noting that the base tax icon in the Economy screen at the bottom has been replaced with a development level icon. Suggests that base tax calculations are likely going to change to be based on development level.

What will be the size of garrison then in provinces without forts ? I assumed something like 50 or zero, thats why i thought other provinces will fall automatically.
Screenshot with Caux shows it as 0, although that province is under French control.

I would imagine that it is less than 10, as a province with no fort should have less garrison than a province with a mothballed fort.
 

No idea

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Wow. The features in this DD and the previous one are going to change the way EU IV is played more than all the previous expansions together. It is going to be a big, big change in gameplay. I hope the AI is taught to play it well.
 
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blackchoas

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Dear god what implications does this have for navals invasions. Johan mentioned that provinces without forts and outside of a forts ZOC will just instantly fall now, France and Spain can't afford to make freaking sea walls how easy will it be to launch a naval invasion from behind and half their territory
 
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