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EU4 - Development Diary - 30th of October 2018

Hello and welcome back to another huge dev diary! Today we’ll talk about two new features, a small one and a big one. We then end the diary with two changes to balance. Also as usual, large warning on that all of this is work in progress and might not match the final product!

First up is a small little feature based on the Portuguese Marines and them attacking forts along the coast of Africa and India. Naval Barrage is the same as Artillery Barrage but it requires the cannons of your ships instead of field artillery. It goes by amount of cannons on the coast / 100 to the fort level to determine if you can break open it’s walls. It will cost 50 military points just like the normal Artillery Barrage.

ART NOT FINAL
upload_2018-10-30_9-10-7.png


The Portuguese also gets a small bonus by a change we’ll describe in the next feature for the dev diary.


The big feature of today is Flagships. A more bombastic and expensive ship as the pride of your navy. It houses the commanding officers of the fleet who plan the engagement and mission the ships take part in. They are unlocked to any nation that fields a navy of 3 000 sailors, or 15 heavies worth, and it costs 100 ducats to build.

ART/INTERFACE NOT FINAL
upload_2018-10-30_9-10-43.png


A flagship consists of up to 3 modifications on it. Each modification you pick will raise the maintenance cost of your flagship. Some modifications will only buff the flagship itself but some will buff the entire fleet that it’s part of. There are also some modifications that are restricted to specific nations.

ART/INTERFACE NOT FINAL
upload_2018-10-30_9-39-19.png


Here is a list as of this writing the current generic modifications we have in the game.
  • Mass Load Cannons: 15% more cannons on flagship
  • Hull Sheathing: +50% Flagship Durability
  • Trade Route Map: +1 Trade Power for all ships in fleet (Yes not only lightships)
  • Command Aftercastle: +5% Morale to Ships in Fleet
  • Improved Crows Nest: +5 Engagement Width
  • Mortars: +1 Blockade Impact on Siege
  • Standardized Signal Book: +1 Movement Speed for every ship in Fleet
Then we also have a few country specific ones.
  • Portuguese Navigators: +100 Exploration Mission Range
  • Portuguese Bombardiers: -50% Naval Barrage Cost
  • Portuguese Trade Route Map: +2 Trade power for every ship in the fleet.
  • Spanish Grand Armada: -30% Attrition for fleet
  • Spanish Treasure Fleet: Cannons count twice for hunting pirates
  • Spanish Mass Load Cannons: 30% More cannons on Flagship
  • Swedish Mass Load Cannons: +100 More Cannons on Flagship
  • Dutch Courage: 10% Morale bonus in fleet.
ART/INTERFACE NOT FINAL
upload_2018-10-30_9-36-19.png


Next are the balance changes we’ve done. These are not tied with the future paid content but we are experimenting a bit with it to see how it gets received. There’s been a lot of discussion on the current meta with idea groups both on our forums and other platforms. So over the last couple of weeks we’ve been collecting data on what idea sets that are picked by players to get a proper statistical overview on where the meta lies. For clarification the data as follows is per player, per game. This means if two players in the same game picks the same idea groups, it will be counted twice. If you as a player start two seperate games and pick an idea group it will be counted twice. If you pick a group and then unpick it to pick another, it will count both instances of groups. I hope this explains what the data this is based on actually is.

Now one of the things we can see that Exploration ideas are the most popular idea set of all counting for 11% of the picks. Which makes sense, it’s an idea group that opens up a whole area for the player. Lowest on the list is Plutocracy with an abysmal 0.79%, one I’ve seen many point as an interesting and good group, but it’s unpopularity is probably due to its very scarce availability. Even Aristocracy clocks in on 3% which I've seen some refer to as "trash tier" of the military ones.

So the most unpopular idea groups are the ones we focused the most on, minus plutocracy. They are as follows.
  • Maritime ideas: 1.41%
  • Naval ideas: 1.09%
  • Spy ideas: 1.07%
upload_2018-10-30_9-13-42.png


We also focused on some pet peeves of ours like influence ideas which was the third most picked one, religious, expansion, humanist, administrative, diplomatic and innovativeness ideas. I’ll attach the change log to the end of this dev diary but I’ll try to put some more descriptive text to some of the more important changes.

So first I want to cover the changes to Espionage. Espionage gained the -20% AE Impact from Influence ideas to replace it’s -10% Liberty Desire. In return Influence gained -15% Subject Liberty desire to replace their 25% Heir Chance. Though Espionage gained another little fun feature.

On the 5th idea for Espionage you now get, besides just cheaper fabrication cost, the ability to fabricate claims on behalf of your vassals. This works for any type of vassal except tributaries. Important to note is that the claim will belong to the vassal and not you.

upload_2018-10-30_9-13-52.png


Another big change is to the colonisation game, We’ve thrown things around a little. The first two ideas of Exploration have been swapped and Exploration have been made to be a bit slower in colonization. Instead we have have buffed Expansion ideas to be the idea group that speeds up your colonisation. It gives you two colonist and way faster speed in getting it done. It’s finisher have been changed to give +5 Max States as well.

An experimental thing we are testing out now and seeing how it plays out as well is to put DLC locked values into the idea groups. People have for a long time asked for Innovativeness Gain in Innovative Ideas for instance. Now it got 50% of that, which converts into 5% Idea Cost if you don’t own Rule Britannia. A similar thing is -20% cheaper CoT Upgrade in Expansion ideas and -25% Expel Minority Cost for Exploration ideas.

Last important change is to Religious. The +2% Heretic Missionary Strength have been removed and instead we have 50% Missionary Maintenance there. Now you might be thinking “Well that value is worthless, missionaries costs literally nothing!” We’re changing that and removing the block on religious conversion requiring you to have the province fully cored and stated. Instead it will be a soft block coming from conversion now going to be real expensive. So to be extra clear, you will be able to convert any province again, it will just cost you a bucket load of ducats.

The idea is to have a non-linear cost increase based on the autonomy of the province you are trying to convert. At the moment this is up still for being tweaked and balanced but the raw formula for the yearly cost for all math geeks: base cost + dev factor * development ^ ( autonomy base + local autonomy * autonomy factor) * local/global missionary maintenance cost

upload_2018-10-30_9-14-3.png

Which monthly cost for a 20 development province can be visualized like this with all base and factors being set to 1 and no modifier to the missionary maintenance cost.

It does mean while converting the 100% autonomy territories of 3 dev will cost extra, it won’t be that super more expensive. But if you for instance have Samarkand for some reason try to convert it while it not being cored and states, it’s going to cost you a fair deal.

Following with this change, since missionaries are now actually gonna ask you to pay up, we’ve also changed a bit on how the maintenance slider works for them. Previously you could avoid paying any cost because you just needed to have enough strength on it’s own as the slider only affected the base values of missionary strength. Second if you did lower the slider and could make progress before, but without those 2% you will get a hard stop on any progress to the conversion. Now instead the slider decides how much of your conversion speed is actually generated, so if you are making progress on the conversion and lower it, it will instead lower the amount of progress you get.

So if you are paying dough, you have enough strength, it will always generate some progress for you.

upload_2018-10-30_9-14-29.png


Also with this change it means I've reworked the missionary tooltip also a bit, since missionaries can cost differently depending on where you can see them, it will list all your active missionaries and their cost.

upload_2018-10-30_9-14-34.png


And here's a collection of the balance changes we've covered today.
- Gamebalance: Missionary maintenance cost now costs development^(1+local autonomy)
- Gamebalance: Missionary Maintenance no longer only operates on the base strength but instead it is a percentage of how much progress you get. So now as long as you pay money, you will always get some progress.
- Gamebalance: Expansion 3rd idea buffed to 20 Settler Growth.
- Gamebalance: Expansion 4th idea switched out to be -50% Rival Border Fort Maintenance & -20% CoT Upgrade Cost(Dharma).
- Gamebalance: Expansion 6th idea switched out to be 1 colonist & 5% Settler Chance
- Gamebalance: Expansion Finisher now gives +5 States instead of Maintenance
- Gamebalance: Innovative 2nd idea switched out to be 50% Innovativeness Gain(Rule Britannia) or -5% Idea Cost(Non-Rule Britannia).
- Gamebalance: Innovative 5th idea switched out to be 25% Institution Spread.
- Gamebalance: Religious 4th idea buffed to have 2 Tolerance of Own Faith.
- Gamebalance: Religious 6th idea switched out to be -50% Missionary Maintenance Cost.
- Gamebalance: Humanist 3rd idea nerfed to 2 tolerance of heretic.
- Gamebalance: Humanist 7th idea nerfed to 2 tolerance of heathens.
- Gamebalance: Maritime 1st idea switched to 100% Naval Tradition from Trade.
- Gamebalance: Maritime 6th idea switched to +1 Free Leader and -25% Admiral Cost
- Gamebalance: Maritime 7th idea buffed to give +25% Privateering efficiency.
- Gamebalance: Exploration 1st idea and 2nd idea switched places.
- Gamebalance: Exploration 4th idea nerfed to 10 Settler Growth.
- Gamebalance: Exploration 5th idea tariffs nerfed to 10% and given 20% Envoy Travel Time.
- Gamebalance: Exploration 6th idea switched to give -25% Expel Minority Cost or 5% Settler Chance without DLC.
- Gamebalance: Diplomatic 3rd idea switched out for 0.5 Prestige
- Gamebalance: Influence 2nd idea switched out for -15% subject liberty desire
- Gamebalance: Influence 4th idea switched out for +1 diplomatic relations
- Gamebalance: Influence 6th idea lost +1 diplomatic relations
- Gamebalance: Espionage 3rd idea lost 10% Province Trade Power Modifier.
- Gamebalance: Espionage 4th idea switched out for 20% AE Impact.
- Gamebalance: Espionage 5th idea buffed with Claim Fabrication onbehalf of Vassals.
- Gamebalance: Quantity 5th idea switched out for 33% Supply Limit Modifier.
- Gamebalance: Naval 4th idea switched out for 1 Yearly Naval Tradition.

That’s everything for today! Next week will be @neondt who will be going through a bunch of the country specific flavor for missions.
 
Last edited:

iNFERnozz

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Is there any consequences to losing a flagship in battle or from attrition?

I was hoping there would be some penalties in terms of PP, prestige, unrest etc. This reminds me of the HoI3 "Pride of the Fleet" modifier.
 

Displacement

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I have a hard time contemplating a universe in which EU4 players take Administrative, Diplomatic and Humanist less than Expansion. Are we sure this data is accurate? Is it possible that something like tag switching to an AI and back counts those AIs as player-chosen idea groups?
This is the multiplayer meta we're talking about. Dip rep and aggressive expansion are almost completely irrelevant. And administrative is just okay because colonization is a way cheaper way to get clay.

The multiplayer meta very strongly favors mil ideas of quality, offensive, defensive and quantity, plus economic and innovative, and possibly trade or influence for dip ideas
 

Commonblob

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What happens to the Religious Finisher?

Sorry if it's been asked already.

So what's replacing the religious finisher, since converting in territories is allowable to anyone again?

I think Paradox considers the 2 finishers it has already to be enough (culture conversion cost and clergy loyalty). Sure, they suck but the last idea in religious is the Deus Vult CB so PDX probably doesn't see the need to give any powerful modifiers along with that.
 
Last edited:

Less2

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This is the multiplayer meta we're talking about. Dip rep and aggressive expansion are almost completely irrelevant. And administrative is just okay because colonization is a way cheaper way to get clay.

The multiplayer meta very strongly favors mil ideas of quality, offensive, defensive and quantity, plus economic and innovative, and possibly trade or influence for dip ideas

I don't see any indication that this survey data is limited to MP, and I'm fairly certain SP play vastly outnumbers MP play.

And expansion is awful everywhere. If anything it's worse in MP. In SP at least you get another colonist to roleplay a colonizer with.
 

TheRipper69-PT

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I like the ideas overhaul, but if I may propose something, is that exploration only enables the recruitment of explorers and the discovery of adjacent territory of colonies. And expansion allows recruitment of conquistadores...
 

grommile

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You should add a new idea called Construction ideas focused on buildings
In what way would this be anything other than Economic Ideas 2: Electric Boogaloo?
 

geoaraujo

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Converting provinces was pretty much fixed by making possible to convert territories having completing religious ideas. It was balanced and fair. I strongly disagree with the new chances announced.
 

Emre Yigit

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I have a brilliant idea. Scrap almost all pre-determined effects from idea groups. Instead make certain effects more likely to come up, or give those effects a certain range. That way we'll all be playing roulette, and it wouldn't matter too much which idea group you put your money on. So no more "bias". Wheee!

Yay! (?)
 

Naranjito

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I with Brandenburg or Poland always play with commercial ideas.

The first 3 can be: Commercial or economic, offensive and commercial or economic.

The theme is the same as always, there are people who play to world conquest and others who do not.

I started to play in normal mode when I understood it and I started to see that in 1600 I already dominated the whole world (levels of development, army, punctuation of the game ...) with Spain or England or France, I switched to the iron mode. When I saw that it was very simple, I went to the difficult mode in iron mode.

I mean, I can play with Brandenburg to create a strong Prussian, very antihistorical, expand a little in Asia or Africa (I also end up choosing naval), create Germany 150 years before what happened ... but I do not even try to get to Moscow or conquer Paris, something that in 1750 with 2000 development and 400 ultra doped marines could try, and even earlier because between 1650-1700 my Prussia is already very powerful.

For me, economics to develop my provinces with all modifiers activated when university is discovered is vital.

For others it is administrative ideas, to save points in the world conquest.

It's the usual, there are 2 types of players, those who want more war and those who want more micro-management of countries.


PD:
Also, without the DLC of the 8 powers, early commercial ideas serve to score in the game (diplomatico punctuation).

That is where I usually measure, in the punctuation of the game, that is, with Brandenburg-Prussia with 4 merchants and a minimarina in 1480-1520 you can already score.
 

TheMeInTeam

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This is the multiplayer meta we're talking about. Dip rep and aggressive expansion are almost completely irrelevant. And administrative is just okay because colonization is a way cheaper way to get clay.

The multiplayer meta very strongly favors mil ideas of quality, offensive, defensive and quantity, plus economic and innovative, and possibly trade or influence for dip ideas

I'm surprised you don't see at least some religious worked in over innovative. The policies it has with quantity and quality are both pretty nice. The hit to advisor cost hurts but if you're taking wrong religion land it could be helpful. Maybe it depends how many people are in the game.
 

Thrudgelmir2333

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With this new Iberian DLC and Dharma I think the Portuguese - Ottoman conflict in Ethiopia and in the Indian ocean should get more attention. After all afetr the battle of Diu the Ottoman monopoly of far east spices was broken and the power started to shift to western Europe. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Diu_(1509)

Of course the Venetians were around trying to save their monopoly!;)

Technically speaking, with the new trade routes, you can recreate that conflict pretty easily by targeting Middle Eastern gulf entrances and competing to get Ethiopia's trade flow into the Gulf of Aden.
 

Bolachinha

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Technically speaking, with the new trade routes, you can recreate that conflict pretty easily by targeting Middle Eastern gulf entrances and competing to get Ethiopia's trade flow into the Gulf of Aden.
Still special events/missions would be interesting and realistic.Like defending christianity in Eastern Africa/Ethiopia - Prester John. Assume the control of the trade routes against the muslim powers in Indian ocean. Just to mention some.
 

Afonso de Albuquerque

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Still special events/missions would be interesting and realistic.Like defending christianity in Eastern Africa/Ethiopia - Prester John. Assume the control of the trade routes against the muslim powers in Indian ocean. Just to mention some.
There are already a few events referencing that, Portugal has "Commercial Conflict in the Indian Ocean" giving extra trade power in the Gulf of Aden and Ethiopia has several Portugal/Prester John events. But they could definitely be expanded and made much more interactive, for sure.
 

Count DVB

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Thouse Humanists nerfs hurt, especially since there's barely other chances to increase heathenism tolerance. And now converting religion is gonna be a pain too?

That will be a pain with Coptic Alexandaria. Though naval stuff isn't my strong suit, but it will be interesting to see
 

dD_ShockTrooper

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A lot of people are complaining that espionage is super bad even with the changes, and I can tell those people are not the 1% that used to use it sometimes. Espionage was never amazing and there were always better ideas, but I can tell you, just like Aristocratic it was certainly *almost* good. It had a lot of things that were *almost* useful enough to push it up there with the obvious choices, and I think 20% AE reduction is certainly that push from *almost* good to amazing. The best thing is, that unlike Influence, AE reduction is actually synergistic with the rest of the Espionage tree. Claims and AE matter most when you're not already a major power. Every claim is 10% CCR and extremely importantly; free local autonomy reduction. This is absolutely vital to anyone conquering a parcel of land equal to their initial nation size. Adding in the age of discovery bonus for chain claiming, espionage is now an extremely strong opening idea for small nations with a plan to not be small very quickly.