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EU4 - Development Diary - 30th of April 2019

Good day and welcome to this week's EU4 Dev Diary. Last week we briefly covered Custom Nation desires. Let's go through some of the feedback on it here:

Some nations' national ideas have two ideas in one slot, what's your opinion on adding that to nation designer?

I'm a tad unsatisfied with NI sets with repeating bonuses, and it's generally something you see on older NIs. I'd rather do away with them, but for Custom Nations, we already give the player the ability to turn up ideas to a high degree at extra cost. I'm not convinced that we want to add repeating ideas, even at additional cost.

Please more colours for flags and country on the map! Also let CN import a mission three from a tag, at a cost in ponts.

Another idea: how about giving custom nations access to custom national mission trees? I guess letting you actually design a mission tree sounds like a work for a medium-sized expansion itself.

Expanding the CN feature to allow for custom or imported mission trees would likely balloon in work required quickly. I feel you on the colours issue though.

In-game options when devs?

I will keep asking this as part of my duty to get it through to devs that us players desperately want this so we can customize our playthroughs.

If you mean Game Options akin to CK2, then I'm going to have to disappoint you, as that is not in our plans.

It baffles me how France has such a high playrate. Dosen't it get boring starting so strong?

Also Ming, which literally defeats the purpose of playing.

Relatability is a hell of a drug.

English monarchy and steppe horde are broken with custom nations in random nations settings. The reason is in the government reform file the reform is set to appear if the country already has the reform when it should be set to appear if it has ever had the reform.

Interesting, thanks for the heads up, I'll look into these issues.

Please, for the love of all that is holy, add the converter religions into the nation designer. I am perfectly happy for them to ONLY be available to custom nations if you don't feel like they are fleshed out enough to add them as actual religions via the existing heretic rebels

We'll look into this, I think it'd be a cool touch.

Custom portraits for rulers would add immersion

I just want Ruler/General/Admiral/Explorer/Conquistador portraits and more personalities for these characters. Please. Pretty please.

EU4 is a nation focused game, rather than a character focused one, so we're not big on such things. Advisors, as instruments of state, are about the only people given faces. While you'll see rulers (and all sorts of other characters) in portraits in CK2 and Imperator, they are not going to make an appearance in EU4.


I'd really like to see the culture mapmode on the start screen to help make the custom nations.

Culture map-painting is the patrician level of expansion, so I agree.

More custom nation achievements please. I wouldn't hate the addition of some random world achievements either. Ideas guy is one of the best achievements out there because there are so many different paths you can choose for doing it.

Spot on. Ideas Guy is one of the most inspiring Achievements and more are desired.

Serbian Flavour pack? Missions related to the reconquest of lands held by Tsar Stefan Dusan and expansion in the balkans, Serbia was an important regional power in the area and theyre a bit underrepresented *crie

The focus of the Expansion is from Brest to Byzantium, which encapsulates Serbia. Their time in the flavour limelight is now.

Hey EU IV devs do you planing any changes in ruler/Royal Families/PU system in upcoming European expansion?

In a concise but disappointing response, we do not have this planned for the upcoming expansion/


So what do we have today? A bit of a smorgasbord as it happens. First of all, back in January we talked a bit about 4K support / scalable UI for EU4. It's currently not the prettiest of games when played on a 4K screen, and we've been investigating it lately.

Here is the EU4 experience on a 4K monitor at 100% UI scale:

100%.jpg



and up to 150%:

150%.jpg


and now for 175%:

175%.jpg


We have some kinks to iron out, but we're onto a winner here for making EU4 more timeless for the every growing % of players who have upgraded beyond the traditional batting grounds of 1080p

I want to talk about a couple other aspirations we have for the upcoming European expansion. In the giant end of year dev diary, there were a couple things that we said we wanted to address, namely:

  • The HRE system, which is largely unchanged from EU3 needs to evolve
  • Make Catholicism and the Pope feel like a force to be reckoned with, rather than just another colour of Christianity and country
Let's take the HRE first. The Holy Roman Empire has not really been needing change, leading to it's relative state of persistence for so long. It functions well as an entity for keeping such a historically fractured region jumbled and offers an interesting challenge on expansion with varied approaches on dealing with it, so for all intents and purposes it has a job and it does it without huge complaint.

The caveat here however is that this has been a satisfactory situation for a while, but as we have enriched much of the world around it, the HRE has become less interesting in comparison. When we wrote up pillars for what we want to do in the upcoming expansion and update, we came up with the following:

Revitalize the play in the HRE that hasn’t changed much. Make the empire feel alive filled with bickering princes.

Does it feel this way right now? Not to the point that we are currently satisfied with. As a member state, becoming Emperor is a cool aspiration, but as Emperor, aside from some cool strengths you get, it doesn't feel like you have much in the way of interesting choices to make to run the Empire as you envision. Granted in such a decentralized mass, not all should be so keen to follow your law, but we want to open up the Holy Roman experience to allow for more meaningful and dynamic situations. The Emperor should have some sway in the Burgundian Situation. A powerful Pope should lead to meaningful conflict between Empire and Italy beyond the Shadow Kingdom event. The formation and consolidation of the powerful Prussian state should be a matter of concern for the Emperor and Princes. What if Switzerland wish to abandon the HRE?

These are the occurrences that we aspire to model as dynamically as we can within the HRE, and are dabbling with good ways to simulate this in the game.

Another evident issue with HRE play, one that can be seen by playing as Emperor or talking to anyone who has, is that the final reform feels like a trap. An army of HRE subjects to unleash on your foes and carve up the map as you see fit? Now that's an enjoyable reward for reigning in the Empire, however smashing that final reform, absorbing the entire empire and losing all the effects you've built up, considerably less so. While we don't have the exact details, we see this as something that should be split: where there is a clear path for reform in the HRE, either towards decentralized power or all land under one ruler, so that players don't feel the need to purposefully hold back on completing the HRE reform path.


Regarding Catholicism, both the religion and the head of the faith are in need of attention, and the attention is two-fold, both gameplay and flavour.

In terms of gameplay, Catholicism is widely considered a poor choice of religion. If you are not the Curia Controller, it is a very weak religion, and if you are the Curia Controller, then it's a strange state where you actually want there to be as few other Catholics as possible so that you can hoard this power for yourself. Add to this the fact that the Pope himself is, by and large, just treated as another country, and not the mighty head of a faith that he deserves to be (as I have been masterfully lectured by @Duplo )

When it comes to flavour, Catholicism has far been left in the lurch in terms of interesting content when compared to pretty much all other forms of Christianity.

Catholicism is one of the main focuses, fittingly for this European expansion and update. In a nutshell we want to empower Catholicism against the already tantalizing Protestantism, such that union between the Catholic faith adds to its strength, where the Pope and/or Curia Controller himself can take action in favour of the entire faith (or potentially lining their own filthy pockets) and take action in response to the growing threat posed by the reformation. Currently, Reform Desire does little outside of igniting the reformation, we would like to make the mechanic more engaging for Pope and Catholics alike, such that they are incentivized to combat or grant concessions against the rift.

These are our aspirations at least, with regards to HRE and Catholicism. How do you feel about them in the game currently and what would you most like to see?


Now, we've been talking about design, quality of life and content aspirations for a few months now, which has been very much our goal and quite fun from our end, but I think we all are keen to get to some content. This will be our last week of such aspiration dev diaries: from next week onwards, we'll start showing off map work, content work and features/fixes/QoL for our upcoming European Update and Expansion.

Let's tease as I so often like to do, with a cheeky preview screenshot for next week:

teaser.png
 
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EasternTiger

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The focus of the Expansion is from Brest to Byzantium, which encapsulates Serbia. Their time in the flavour limelight is now.
I'm assuming that Brest in this case refers to Brest, France? Or is this a subtle hint that Belarus is getting some flavour as well? :p

All jokes asides, it's nice to see that there will be changes to Catholicism in the next patch. In my opinion, the worst part of the Reformation in 1.28.3 is when 99% of the HRE is converted from Catholicism during the Reformation, due to the AI not converting as much due to the 1.28 religious conversion patch changes. The Reformation steamrolls just steamrolls through Germany. In my current game, Austria lost Emperorship because they became Protestant, leaving Brandenburg and Bohemia as the only Catholic nations in the HRE. Will religious conversion be addressed anytime soon?
 

Eltener

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I think with the first CN feedback you addressed, the poster meant individual ideas that have 2 seperate bonuses like England's first idea as opposed to the same bonus appearing as 2 seperate ideas
 

DSR

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It does sound amazing. Eagerly looking forward to it. HRE, Catholic and European rework is more than welcomed, specially if it goes as ambition demands it.

All continents but Europe feel unique in their own little way, it's time to bring Europa back to Europa Universalis IV.
 
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Greece stronk

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With the focus being on Europe, and it having the largest Jewish population during the game's period, I think some more representation of the impact of Judaism and flashing out the religion itself could go a long way to make the region more interesting. Now that with the map update there a prime opportunity to add an historically Jewish-majority province in Europe, namely Thessaloniki, players could easily find ways to play around with the religion.
 

Pureanger

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While we are on the topic on hre. I really liked Florryworrys idea of imperial circles back in the day (english wikipedia / a more detailed german version on wikipedia ).

According to the german wiki, there were 10 imperial circles (Reichskreise) introduced from 1500-1512. Switzerland and Bohemia did not participate. Function of those imperial circles were:

- policing revolts / inner defense
- outer defense
- enforcements of imperial bans (Reichsacht)
- coinage
- overview of tariffs (which was a huge problem as far as I recall)
- election of the imperial court (reichskammergericht) which ruled over inner differences (landfrieden)

Beside from being actually historical I can see several cool mechanics derived from these functions. Like instead of triggering the emperor and ALL this allies when attacking the hre, it could rather just trigger the corresponding circle and the emperor. Imperial bans could be a thing where you have to face off against a circle. An imperial court... Last but not least the ae for the hre could be reduced for the whole hre, but increased for bordering circles...

I know this is going to be controversial, so I want to make my last suggestion seperate from the imperial circle suggestion. Please also consider reworking the vassal swarm (japan also), once you get it going wars become too boring and most cpu´s collapse. Having a vassal swarm of the original german or japanes nations would be op enough I think. Maybe add a requirement that nations have to be of that specific culture group as well so it would at least become more difficult to add nations to the swarm.


Also the Reichskammergericht, Landsknechte and the tariffs situtation might give you some ideas for interesting mechanics... Anyways, thx for the update!
 
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giovdb

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I'm assuming that Brest in this case refers to Brest, France? Or is this a subtle hint that Belarus is getting some flavour as well? :p

All jokes asides, it's nice to see that there will be changes to Catholicism in the next patch. In my opinion, the worst part of the Reformation in 1.28.3 is when 99% of the HRE is converted from Catholicism during the Reformation, due to the AI not converting as much due to the 1.28 religious conversion patch changes. The Reformation steamrolls just steamrolls through Germany. In my current game, Austria lost Emperorship because they became Protestant, leaving Brandenburg and Bohemia as the only Catholic nations in the HRE. Will religious conversion be addressed anytime soon?

In one game I was playing recently, the HRE dismantled all on its own because there was no eligible Catholic Emperor... I'm excited to see changes to such an important part of the world in this time period!
 

By_Science!

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An interaction between being the Emperor and the industrialisation events would be interesting-maybe there could be some way for the HRE to share the trade good bonus for coal? or maybe other trade good boni?
 

Lavilledieu

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Bavarian split, yay!
It is unfortunate that the dynastic system will not get a rework/an expansion. When playing Voltaire's Nightmare, you discover that the HRE doesn't actually give a lot. Instead of having very complex dynastic situations, where theocracies also played a major role in, we have a rather mysterious and cryptic system. It's so cryptic that haven't even had a normal PU. My first PU was as a theocracy. Here is an example of something that is very difficult to do: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_August_I,_Duke_of_Oldenburg
I know that vanilla eu4 isn't VN, but a clearer and improved dynastic system could greatly benefit the HRE and Christianism.
A second thing: we all know the HRE is the place for bordergore in history. Liege for example had gorgeous borders. But as HRE member it is impossible to core non-neighboring provinces, and last time I annexed a vassal, there seemed to be a system hindering you from annaxing non-neighboring vassals. This makes it impossible to recreate the bordergore that happened. Maybe implement a system where HRE states can annex far away vassals, and that they can take non-neighboring provinces (but at increased war score cost, without affecting AE) and core these. Taking those lands will still remain risky, as you cannot easily protect them from rebels.
 
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Krebsig

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Since we tackle the German region, I'd like to point out that the current Germany tag is somewhat unsatisfying. I would very much enjoy the possibility of having more formable Germany endgame tags. The Unified HRE one should be kept, but I feel like there should be at least two other Germany tags with seperate forming conditions and ideas: A republican Germany more resembling the current Germany tag with its 1848-inspired flag and a focus on more liberal ideas and a classic Imperialist tag for the German Reich that eventually existed after the unification wars in the 19th century. Maybe such a tag can only be formed in similar vain to its historical counterpart and maybe there is even room for a North German Confederation tag available to Prussian/Pommeranian states to simulate its historic rise a bit better?

In any case, I look forward to more options in the HRE.
 

Pollices

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How about a religion based coalition modifier? This would initially empower catholicism and would also help against an over-expansive ottoman empire
 

TolHydra

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Sounds like there still would be little reason to become greyskin though.

Look, don't give me any accepted cultures, just let me annex all the little princes into my glorious purple Aachen(etc) and I'll consider ever pressing Renovatio Imperii. Otherwise I don't see myself ever pressing that button when I could just have a vassal swarm as always.
 
Last edited:

Kamraar

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If you mean Game Options akin to CK2, then I'm going to have to disappoint you, as that is not in our plans

HRE rework wasn't either on your plans based on your PDX Con talk and yet here we are. Hope there is reconsideration on this too.
 

Lavilledieu

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will the province development in hre be reduced
it is ridiculously high
That's largely because of the many OPM's develloping their capital. If you play in the HRE, and have a decent conquest speed, you will find out that many provinces have actually rather low development. 6 to 8 will be the average IIRC. Nations tend to almost exclusively develop their capitals, which makes this situation annoying and more obvious. In that perspective, it can be seen as a good defensive measure: the AE from taking those provinces will be so high that they will not be captured, and the nation continues to live (and develops its capital even more). There is not an easy way to stop this from happening. Giving HRE members negative development modifiers can decrease dev a bit, but makes playing there even more punishing (it is the slowest region after all). Increasing conquest speed will give the best effect, but that defeats the nature of the HRE.
 

John the John

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Latheloi

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Having some form of representation of religious minorities in game would probably be the most useful thing for making the reformation more interesting - especially if it was a representation of the minorities that was something other than -1000% conversion chance and magic conversion centres.

What about a "protestant estate" which States individual interact with (and prior to this, Waldensian, Hussite, and Lollard estates in S. France/Savoy/N. Italy, Bohemia, and England respectively). Some of the interactions result in reform desire impacts. Can potentially have loyalty/reform desire trade offs between the clergy estate and the relevant religious minority estates.

Could then have a mixture of province flags, estate control, and finally province religion to indicate the relative religious minorities.

(as a side note, Clergy, in Catholic countries could very well be renamed "The Catholic Church". Would also give some clear Pope-muscle.)
 

John the John

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I was thinking that the Papal states could have similar reform mechanic that the HRE emperor has. Especially considering the fact that during Eu there were 2 Catholic councils and counter-reformation . At the end of the reform tree the Papal states would become permanent papal controller which would symbolize the end of investiture contest and the church would get absolute control over curia.
 
Last edited:

PedroVargas

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One idea to spice up the HRE reforms is splitting them up:

The reforms, rather than being a fixed path, could offer variation. If you go path a) you are going more into the direction of a vassal swarm, meaning dip rep, relations, development reduction for juicy subjects. If you go path b) you go for unity and integration, meaning more focus on core creation cost, aggressive expansion reduction for the emperor when taking HRE land.

But I'm eager to see what you cook up because I love playing in the HRE, even if it's coalition hell in there ...