• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Welcome back to our weekly series of development diaries about Europa Universalis. This time we’ll talk about two features that will be part of the next expansion.

Theocracies
This is based on something we read in the suggestions forum. Monarchies and Republics have had their Legitimacy and Republican Tradition, but Theocracies haven’t had a unique mechanic yet. The next expansion will add a concept we call Devotion. Devotion ranges for 0 to 100, and impacts several thing.

Devotion impacts your religious abilities, your prestige gain and your tax-income.

You primarily gain devotion from high religious unity and the devoutness idea. Low stability will decrease it, while being Defender of the Faith will increase it.

There are also a lot of events that impact your devotion.

Another unique mechanic for theocracies is the fact that they always have an heir, and they have somewhat of control of it.

If you do not have an heir, you get a chance to select one heir. Heirs are age 40+ with random stats. You can then pick one of the following.

  • A Local Noble – Loses 5 devotion, but gains +10 Prestige
  • A Foreign Noble - Gains +100 relation with a random nation.
  • A Merchant's Son - +25% yearly income, lost 10 devotion
  • A Papal Protege – Catholic only. Gains +10 Papal Influence
  • A Talented Theologian: +10 Devotion
  • A local preacher – +5 Devotion & -10 Prestige


Government Ranks
A new feature in the next expansion is the introduction of proper Government Ranks. In previous versions, most countries would either be simply a Kingdom or a Republic, with a few special cases like Byzantium's Imperial Government and vassalized Kings becoming Dukes. If you don't get the expansion, this changes little, but for those with it most government types will come in three ranks: Duchy, Kingdom and Empire. While these are the names of the ranks, it doesn't mean there aren't any ranks for Republics - Venice's Serene Republic is on the same level as a Kingdom, for example.

Countries will start with whatever is closest to the rank they had historically, so the King of Burgundy becomes the Duke of Burgundy, while Byzantium is very much an Empire despite no longer having a special government form. Vassals, Marches and non-Elector members of the HRE are always Duchy rank, and certain government types only come in a single rank (such as Ming's Celestial Empire, which is always an Empire). Countries that are not locked to a particular rank can raise their rank through the Government screen by fulfilling certain requirements such as a certain level of prestige and total development level of your nation.

So what benefit do you get from a higher government rank, besides a new title and fancier headgear? Well, for one, higher government ranks are able to change their National Focus more often, with the default 25 year cooldown being 20 years for Kingdoms, and a mere 15 years for Empires. The bonuses granted from each government are now also set per rank, with government types getting more autonomy reduction from the higher ranks, while others such as Steppe Hordes have their base government bonuses to force limits, manpower and looting speed increased by higher government ranks.

Finally, this system also comes with a complete and mod-friendly overhaul of how government names and titles are handled. Under the old system, if you wanted to for example call your Greek Emperor a Basileus, you would have to create a particular localisation string that might get overwritten by other localisation strings, and there was no ability to differentiate between the titles of say, a Greek Western Technology Group Emperor and a Greek Eastern Technology Group Emperor. Under the new system, you script specific government name/title entries that might look something like this:


Code:
byzantine_monarchy = {
rank_1 = PRINCIPALITY
rank_2 = KINGDOM
rank_3 = EMPIRE


ruler_1 = AUTOKRATOR
ruler_1_female = AUTOKRATEIRA
ruler_2 = DESPOT
ruler_2_female = DESPOTISSA
ruler_3 = BASILEUS
ruler_3_female = BASILISSA

trigger = {
   government = monarchy
   tag = BYZ
}
}


The game goes through the government entries, picks the first one it finds where the trigger evaluates true, and applies those government titles to that nation. This means that if you so desire, you could create a complete unique set of government names for each and every country in the game!


AQP3Ng9.jpg
 

airpirate

Colonel
102 Badges
Apr 9, 2010
899
97
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Age of Wonders II
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Victoria 2
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Age of Wonders
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Premium edition
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Deluxe edition
  • BATTLETECH
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
Being an emperor has nothing to do with holding lots of power. A emperor is a title with religious overtones. The roman emperor was pontefix maximus, and later the rightful ruler of all christians (though not all christians accepted that was the case) who had to be crowned by a religious leader (the pope in the catholic countries, and a patriarch in the orthodox). The chinese and Japanese emperors likewise had similar ideas. I'm not sure how the emperor of India of the brittish monarch factors into that, since as far as I understand they created the title.

The problem with attempting to force a European title on states across the world is that all the different titles used by those states tended to have entirely different meanings and connotations. An "emperor" is not the same as a "huangdi" which is not the same as a "Khagan" which is not the same as a "padishah" which is not the same as a "Sapa Inca" which is... well you get the idea. The only thing these terms that tend to all be called "emperor" have in common is that they are at a rank above most other rulers in a given region, which is all this rank system should represent.
 
  • 8
  • 1
Reactions:

Jorlem

Field Marshal
118 Badges
May 9, 2012
4.564
4.056
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Victoria 2
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Dungeonland
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • The Showdown Effect
  • War of the Roses
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Surviving Mars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
Looking forward to converting a CK2 game to this version of EU4. I'm guessing that governments will keep the rank of their highest title?
 
  • 7
Reactions:

airpirate

Colonel
102 Badges
Apr 9, 2010
899
97
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Age of Wonders II
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Victoria 2
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Age of Wonders
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Premium edition
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Deluxe edition
  • BATTLETECH
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
Haven't seen the most imprtant question answered: will there be an achievment for getting Emperor rank as the Palatine? :p
 
  • 7
Reactions:

Immortal88

Major
100 Badges
Sep 25, 2012
627
470
  • Sengoku
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Stellaris
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
  • Tyranny - Tales from the Tiers
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • War of the Roses
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Prison Architect
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
I realize this is a game and not a simulation, but what on earth is the rationale behind lowering the time cooldown for changing the national focus for higher government forms? I'd surely imagine an empire would be more difficult to steer than a duchy, as in oil tanker vs. sailing boat.
 
  • 7
Reactions:

Andrzej2

Colonel
47 Badges
Jul 2, 2010
882
2.677
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Majesty 2
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Rome Gold
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
I think you should introduce some restrictions:

No country in HRE should be able to reach kingdom rank with exception of united Germany and Italy (there should be event that HRE emperor agreed and grants us those titles). Historically Brandenburg turned into Prussia just becouse they couldn't claim to be kings of Brandenburg becouse Brandenburg was in HRE.
System what you are proposing that electors can be kings doesn't make sense. Also once achived you shouldn't lose your title (for example when kingdom of Burgundy turns into kingdom of Netherlands and joins HRE).

Catholic or maybe even protestant/reformed nations shouldn't be able to claim title of the emperor as long as Holy Roman Empire exists. Revolutionary state should be exception from this rule and be able to became revolutionary empire.

Ortodox nations shouldn't be able to claim title of the emperor as long as Bizantine Empire exists. Ethiopia could be exception.

Some events for catholic nations about emperor's and pope's approval for king title would be nice. Historically duke of Burgundy was close to convincing Holy Roman Emperor to give him king's crown.
 
  • 7
  • 3
Reactions:

Wagonlitz

Resident WW Foreigner
103 Badges
Jul 19, 2010
8.196
5.453
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Supreme Ruler 2020
  • Pirates of Black Cove
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Steel Division: Normand 44 Sign-up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • War of the Roses
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Crusader Kings III Referal
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma Pre-order
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Rome Gold
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Heir to the Throne
Or rather when things were solidified. The HRE consisted of the Kingdoms of Germany, Italy, Bohemia and later also Burgundy. That's why I want to see HRE-Germany or HRE-Italy automatically being promoted to kingdoms, because the rulers of those realms were kings (nevermind that the HRE was pretty much the King of Germany in personal union, so that formable shouldn't even really exist).
Good point.
I HAVE AN IDEA!!
Ive had an idea of having two buttons when it comes to colonisation. One called civilising which lets you to take areas that use to be colonisable where the religion changes and the cultures change. But in this case you would only be taking an area by sending a colonist to civilis the people and would face alot of resistance. This would be a great tool as it would work with other mechanics you have had added such as the cliant states. Like if you have an area in siberia and you are a WESTERN (only available for western, eastern and muslim) nation then you can make that province a cliant state. Which is what that culture there would consider it as its own nation. so if it gets taken and revolts it would form that nation but it wont be your cliant state any more(and would keep there tach same as you had when civilising them). This would be great to have as paradox knows that africa and some areas of the world like the middleast and north africa was put into a civilising program in various time in history. This would keep your colonists busy too.
Civilising the savages is more 19th century though.


Ugh, not these restrictions again, I've grown extremely annoyed with the in the CK2 forums already. The only reasonable "hard" restriction would be that you can't be an empire within the HRE since you're nominally a vassal. But otherwise constructing extremely rigid parameters for when you can or cannot do stuff simply on the basis that that's how it happened in our history is quite boring. And you're just running into lots of necessary exemptions anyway.
It is unrealistic for catholics and probably also protestants/reformed to proclaim an empire in this time frame---as long as the HRE still stands at least.
And the kingdom of Germany still existed, so the duchies of the HRE couldn't just raise themselves to kingdoms as they were already under a kingdom (and an empire).
 
  • 7
Reactions:

oblio-

Wallachian Warlord
16 Badges
Dec 4, 2013
3.603
1.089
oblio360.com
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • BATTLETECH
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Prison Architect
You clearly just know nothing about roman imperial ideology. Empire is no just some fancy title that anyone can claim if he is big enough. There is deep meaning behind this. Roman empire is universal - Emperor is the ruler of the whole world. Anyone who would claim emperor's title other that Roman Emperor would be usurper. There are two powers in this world - pope in spiritual sphere (for catholics) and Roman Emperor in political. Good christian can't acknowledge any other imperial title as long as there is rightfull Roman Emperor. So it should be exacly how it happened in history - Napoleon claimed imperial title becouse of revolutionary and nationalistic ideology. Austria and Prussia/Germany claimed imperial titles after Holy Roman Empire was destroyed. Russia claimed imperial title as a succesor of Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantine) that was always acknowledged as only rightfull Roman Empire by ortodox christians.
Your arrogance is amazing.

The world has known hundreds of empires (most having nothing to do with the Roman empire) and the concept itself was created and refined by Persia: the Romans just copied them. And the Roman empire wasn't universal, it even had a recognized equal, Persia itself.

Please stop teaching others history...
 
  • 7
  • 2
Reactions:

Will Steel

Centurion First-File
112 Badges
Oct 23, 2010
6.784
7.173
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Semper Fi
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Victoria 2
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Pride of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Prison Architect
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Surviving Mars: Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
You clearly just know nothing about roman imperial ideology. Empire is no just some fancy title that anyone can claim if he is big enough. There is deep meaning behind this. Roman empire is universal - Emperor is the ruler of the whole world. Anyone who would claim emperor's title other that Roman Emperor would be usurper. There are two powers in this world - pope in spiritual sphere (for catholics) and Roman Emperor in political. Good christian can't acknowledge any other imperial title as long as there is rightfull Roman Emperor. So it should be exacly how it happened in history - Napoleon claimed imperial title becouse of revolutionary and nationalistic ideology. Austria and Prussia/Germany claimed imperial titles after Holy Roman Empire was destroyed. Russia claimed imperial title as a succesor of Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantine) that was always acknowledged as only rightfull Roman Empire by ortodox christians.

What about other empires, then? Persian Empire was the first real empire in the world, and it was actually larger than Roman Empire. Both Indian (Maurya) and Chinese (Qin) Empires came much before Rome was even a Mediterranean power, and none of them might've ever heard about Rome. Rome copied from other empires, and after it's downfall the barbarian kingdoms tried to copy from them.

Besides, Roman Empire was not at all 'universal'. Chinese Empire also claimed to be a 'universal' empire right until their collapse in 1911, claiming to be rightful ruler of 'all under heaven'. All major Indian Empires and their rulers claimed the title of 'worldly ruler' (Samrat Chakravartin), Mughals used an equivalent title in Persian language but the same. But does this all make them any universal?
 
  • 7
  • 2
Reactions:

Lemont Elwood

General
On Probation
43 Badges
Jun 10, 2011
2.247
1.882
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Semper Fi
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Victoria 2
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
I had suggested "Divine Authority" a long time ago. If I may make a suggestion, I think it would be good to have low Devotion theocracies run the risk of becoming secular, much as how nations with low Republican Tradition can become dictatorships and, eventually, monarchies. In particular, it could work in such a way that theocracies run by priests may become republics, while ones run by nobles may become monarchies. A theocracy should have to actively work to maintain its religious nature, or it will not be a theocracy for long.

Also, it would be great if we could see a stat added to Native Councils and other Tribal governments that currently lack a mechanic. I think "Tribal Unity" is a concept that could be expanded on and implemented, with it maybe affecting things like how much territory you can hold, how quickly you can migrate, and general strength.
 
  • 7
Reactions:

zmarcos

Captain
101 Badges
Dec 20, 2011
424
270
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings III Referal
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • BATTLETECH: Heavy Metal
  • BATTLETECH: Season pass
  • BATTLETECH: Flashpoint
  • BATTLETECH
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Tyranny - Tales from the Tiers
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • 500k Club
Players like to see development. I loved the increasing number of citizens in EU3, well, until I found out its capped at 999.999. That made me sad, because it simply feels good to see growing numbers. (Yeah, maybe no AE or WE or OE...)
But we will get development, and thats a good thing. If you finally can make Siberia (or even Stockholm... :) ) into the most prosperous place on earth, I will definetely do that. And if I see no number of people but a number of basetax, thats fine, as long as its not arbitrary capped.
But I agree that I would really like a "flowing" religion and culture representation more than the current one. Its not like you need a missionary or some bird mana and a few monts later a whole province with thousands of people all completely changed their mind. Percentages of people following a certain religion or culture would allow for a far better simulation and could be greatly used for lots of additional stuff.
Most of this are Victoria features. We need Victoria 3 now!!! :D
 
  • 7
Reactions:

Skyaway

Corporal
61 Badges
Nov 4, 2014
48
33
twitter.com
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II
Though this DD mention Devotion
religious idea is weird for non-Christian, and religious system is still awful in Far East.

Suggestion:
  1. Idea group will change like Aristocratic/Plutocratic
  2. Merge Confucian & Shinto into Buddhist system
  3. Divide into 2 Schools of Buddhism + Confucian, Shinto
    1. Theravada : in South Asia and Southeast Asia
    2. Vajrayāna : in Tibet and North Asia
    3. Confucian : in China and Korea
    4. Shinto : in Japan
    each sect has unique feature, ex: Buddhist Theocracy (Lama!) only available for Vajrayāna.
Buddhist_sects.png

 
Last edited:
  • 7
  • 2
Reactions:

Wizzington

Game Director (Victoria 3)
Paradox Staff
41 Badges
Nov 15, 2007
12.513
137.626
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • Sengoku
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • March of the Eagles
  • Majesty 2
  • Magicka
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Deus Vult
  • East India Company
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Divine Wind
  • For The Glory
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Prison Architect
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
Thanks for the quick response. You're definitely on top of your forum game recently.

I can see how it might not add too much from a pure strategy/gameplay perspective but I think being able to level up your OPM from a county to a duchy is the kind of thing that would feel meaningful to the player because they are developing the "story" of their country. Plus it doesn't make sense that the weakest states of the HRE would start with the same rank as a great power (Burgundy). Neither does it make very much sense for them to jump straight to kingdom (we all know Prussia's struggle). Therefore I think having an extra rank would make a lot of sense.

Either way I plan on modding it in as part of a wider HRE map mod if that's an option.

There were numerous states in the HRE that historically had the same rank as Burgundy. Burgundy being just a Duchy was a source of major concern for its rulers and something Charles the Bold was trying to fix.
 
  • 7
Reactions:

Golladan

Field Marshal
68 Badges
Dec 25, 2013
4.938
3.132
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Knights of Pen and Paper 2
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Surviving Mars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Magicka 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Warlock 2: The Exiled
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
So what benefit do you get from a higher government rank, besides a new title and fancier headgear? Well, for one, higher government ranks are able to change their National Focus more often, with the default 25 year cooldown being 20 years for Kingdoms, and a mere 15 years for Empires.
Since ranks are part of the expansion, does this mean that National Focus will also be available with this expansion even if you don't have Res Publica?
 
  • 6
Reactions:

Axe99

Ships for Victory
127 Badges
Feb 13, 2003
15.951
13.022
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Lead and Gold
  • The Kings Crusade
  • Magicka
  • Majesty 2
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Supreme Ruler 2020
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Pride of Nations
  • Rise of Prussia
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
Cheers for the DD :). All sounds very interesting, I like the idea of Government ranks. Question - can (and if yes, how) countries drop ranks as well? If not, is there a risk there'll be a convergence towards more countries having gone up ranks by the end of the game (as development levels can increase regardless of whether the size of a nation increases).

No, there's alot more..

Great news :D.

And? I enjoy playing the game Europa Universalis 4 because it allows me to put myself in the shoes of a early modern European state. The worse the game is at allowing me to do that, the less enjoyment I have. My comment is perfectly relevant and your answer isn't an explanation. Even if you ignore that, it's a poor idea. Game mechanics should make sense, we should be able to understand the cause and effect. What's the cause and effect between your neighhbour calling you a king and your ability to tax Breton peasants better?

I agree the response you got could have been a little deeper, but the impact of government rank on the government type bonuses could be seen as modelling the impact of a the strength of the nation as an institution - institutional depth, so to speak. So the Byzantine Empire, by dint of it's age and entrenched institutions gets bonuses that most small countries wouldn't. It could be a sort-of parallel to legitimacy as well, whereby a nation that is more developed is seen by its subjects as a bit more legitimate, and thus the impact of its government type is greater. Of course, I've got no idea what the devs are trying to model with it, could be something else entirely :). I'm also interested in their answer, if we get one :).

On the by, I'd probably prefer that institutional depth had a more detailed and explicit mechanic, but this is a decent start at least :). One of the things about the 'monarch point' approach is that while it makes a lot of sense that it just relies on head and state and advisors at the start of the game, by the end of the game the strength of a nation was at least as much institutional as it was monarch based (for example, while George III (Great Britain) was a bit of a fruit loop during the Napoleonic Wars, Great Britain itself was very effective due to strong, established and growing institutions).
 
  • 5
  • 1
Reactions: