CK3: Tours and Tournaments - The Vision

[Epic Monarch]

I think a lot of players agree that what we got is interesting but wanted something more. All we get are promises, yes this might lead to more "mechanical" additions to the game but it has been more than 2 years and yet we still do not have anything. It seems like all DLCs are skeletons that allow modders to work with. From the royal court to the struggle to the tours here. What a majority of the players want are these additions alongside DLC that leans towards the grand strategy aspect of the game. We got DLC that lean to the RP:

• Royal Court
• Fate of Iberia
• Friends and Foes
• Tours and Tournaments

Yes, it was stated before in previous DDs that this will focus on RP and not other aspects that a lot of the fan base wants. However, it seems the cycle of DLC, is a bit weird and not to the benefit of this game. What would happen after all the RP DLC are out and all we get are DLC that cater to the grand strategy. People that only care about RP would be disappointed. Changing between DLC that leans to the RP and then to the grand strategy would be more beneficial to the game. While those are not exclusive, as others have stated, it seems to me, that there are slight differences between each other that warrants this kind of thinking. There are differences between the Friends and Foes DLC and for example a DLC focusing on Republics and Trade.

I think coming forth in the upcoming DD and being more open about the future of the game would be beneficial to the game. Releasing a road map for the year on what exactly is being released would help calm the simmering distrust between the fan base and the developers. Most people see a promise of a vision but no results, only crumbs and more promises. This player base is one of the most loyal and stick with a game and buy a lot of the payed DLC, it seems kind of a disservice to not come clean on what we would get in the future.

 

[TripleAgent]

The excellent RICE supermod has a struggle for the Viking colonies in the Atlantic (Greenland and Vinland) and IIRC a Norman struggle will be included in the next update.

Nice! I may have to check that out again, I've haven't played vanilla w/ RICE much as opposed to Elder Kings recently, thanks for letting me know they'd added those mechanics!

 

[johnty5]

Question: does that mean characters will now actually have a location on the map, or are tours more of an event chain with events tied to locations? Asking for all the landless gameplay believers.

It looks like there'll be specific locations and travel time.

 

[rasuuru]

Yeah, struggles were supposed to be moddable too but I've seen nothing in terms of mods expanding them to other areas except for the Struggle for Britannia mod that is now defunct and hasn't been updated since September. I've been holding out on some talented modder doing something with the system if PDX won't, but it doesn't look like that's going to happen.

Striggle mechanics is not flexible. It is limited to a certain area, list of cultures and religions. And it has to be defined statically and loaded with the rest of the game. It would be great mechanics if struggles were created and started dynamically, in place, when game founds that a certain region has too many competitors.

 

[The Shacks]

One small note on pilgrimages I hope they do not go too mad on the timescales. In the 12th century it only took a well connected servant of the King about 3 weeks to get to Rome from England. Dover>Calais, on foot via France through the Alps down through Romagna. Now I imagine plenty of things could go wrong or you could try do it cheaply and it could take a couple months. Hopefully there is plenty of room for distractions, 'quests', illness and getting lost or imprisoned. But if I need to see the Pope in a hurry and nothign goes wrong, a month or so seems legit, not half a year. Going to the Holy Land....now that should be a real spin of the wheel.

 

[Cyhort]

This is exactly the kind of additional content I want for this game. A character based game should have role playing systems like this. I'm especially looking forward to seeing how these new systems interact with the house rivalry mechanic. And the tours look fun too. Might have to play lower than 4 speed for once, XD

 

[Trinita132]

Question: does that mean characters will now actually have a location on the map, or are tours more of an event chain with events tied to locations? Asking for all the landless gameplay believers.

 

[Torngasuk]

This is exactly the kind of additional content I want for this game. A character based game should have role playing systems like this. I'm especially looking forward to seeing how these new systems interact with the house rivalry mechanic. And the tours look fun too. Might have to play lower than 4 speed for once, XD

I profoundly look forward to the day when speeds 2 or 3 are a reasonable, normal, and realistic speed to play the entire game at, and I feel no need to go higher. This is one step closer to the dream.

 

[Vivat Imperatoris]

Well there’s another 2 years of development gone. Maybe we will get something meaningful in 2025…

It is amazing! 2 years and they added a throne room some flavor things (viking stones) and now a bunch of things no one needs. Meanwhile, the late game is a disaster and lacking on all fronts. Challenge, war, economy, character building, religions, significant events as ruler of a great empire, ... all more pressing matters

 

[darcinc]

Firstly, I very much hope that the regency mechanic will be in the update that accompanies T&T. That's in line with the policy that big systems should be part of the core game so that modders and future DLC can build on them.

T&T will then add flavour for regencies while your ruler is away travelling and W&W will add flavour for regencies while your ruler is under-age. Those are separate things within the same category, but there's likely to be very little overlap between the events.

But I was expecting the regency mechanic in Wards and Wardens, it was precisely due to the fact that there could be a regency mechanic that this topic seemed interesting to me. Now I actually get one mechanic split into two DLCs. Instead of dedicating the small amount of mechanical changes in Tours and Tournaments to fixing important gaps in the game (such as the new laws), the developers split one mechanic into several additions.

 

[Blackwhitecavias]

• Functional crusades that actually make sense as opposed to sending all your armies to faff around on the Sinai peninsula until they're out of supply and wiped.
• Actual pushback from strong councils when they disagree with the actions of the monarch.
• A papacy that actually matters
• Muslim rulers that are actually interesting and distinct to play
• Government law/types that actually affect playstyle.

And 2 of those could possibly included in here in some way or would be helped greatly by mechanics described:

-Crusades having a presence on the map like tours would be a huge improvement over any CK2 system and allow things such as them actually gathering somewhere instead of coming in piecemeal.
-Regents are also a huge part of councils and their inclusion could mean we could possibly see at least some council expansion in the patch, while regent interactions are similarly also close to council ones.

The other 3 are less likely to be included, but would still profit from some of the systems (if Muslims have different flavour for the included mechanics that would also be a factor to help them, the papal conclave profits from mechanics letting people actually travel and laws are involved in all aspects).

I see no need to be negative yet when we've so far only seen some basic outlines of the dlc and do not know what will be included in the patch or even the details of the expansion (something like crusades could easily be a special tour we don't know about yet).

 

[Silens]

Now I actually get one mechanic split into two DLCs

Regencies are part of the free update, so it's not, as you say, "split into two DLCs". The free update includes old decisions (hunting, pilgrimage and feasts), but applies the new event mechanic to (similar to wedding planning).

Edit: There's a third focus in the free update, which is "major changes to vassal relations and domain management". For me, that is the dark horse of the entire update.

 

[Epic Monarch]

And 2 of those could possibly included in here in some way or would be helped greatly by mechanics described:

-Crusades having a presence on the map like tours would be a huge improvement over any CK2 system and allow things such as them actually gathering somewhere instead of coming in piecemeal.
-Regents are also a huge part of councils and their inclusion could mean we could possibly see at least some council expansion in the patch, while regent interactions are similarly also close to council ones.

The other 3 are less likely to be included, but would still profit from some of the systems (if Muslims have different flavour for the included mechanics that would also be a factor to help them, the papal conclave profits from mechanics letting people actually travel and laws are involved in all aspects).

I see no need to be negative yet when we've so far only seen some basic outlines of the dlc and do not know what will be included in the patch or even the details of the expansion (something like crusades could easily be a special tour we don't know about yet).

You stating that things like crusades could be a special tour is just you coping to have the DLC be better than it actually is. If something like crusaders or coronations were included they would have added them to the trailer and announced them to hype up the DLC. I like what I'm seeing but I'm tired of more promises.

 

[DolceLorenz]

In Grand Marriages, the right to bed with the bride will be really important for the ancestral tradition of the Kingdom.

 

[Flockingbird]

One of the devs previously explained that the FoI development was too far advanced by the time RC was nearing completion to be able to incorporate the RC mechanics/systems. If I find the post I’ll edit it in.

Finally found it!

I think finding time to add more content to one of the older systems is better done in the Flavour Packs, but with parallel development it is also difficult to do. Take Fate of Iberia and the Royal Court. They were released about 3-4 months apart, and that is not a lot of time for Fate of Iberia to adapt the features we added later in the development of RoCo. I cannot remember quite when FoI got access to all the stable features of RoCo, but adding content that uses the RoCo features would need to have time to implement, test and verify that it would all work.

Will also edit it into my previous post, but making this new one so I can use the multi-quote system, which doesn’t work with edits.

 

[Jorlem]

The bit that most catches my interest is the taxation tour. It’s existence implies that harder to reach vassals won’t be paying all their taxes, indirectly nerfing sprawling realms.

 

[rasuuru]

In Grand Marriages, the right to bed with the bride will be really important for the ancestral tradition of the Kingdom.

I wish we get right of the first night to create more dramatic weddings. It would be yet another way to worsen relationships with liege or vassals or get gold from liege (if liege is willing to pay for it).

 

[Voy]

In Grand Marriages, the right to bed with the bride will be really important for the ancestral tradition of the Kingdom.

That's a myth.

 

[johnty5]

The bit that most catches my interest is the taxation tour. It’s existence implies that harder to reach vassals won’t be paying all their taxes, indirectly nerfing sprawling realms.

Also - what that implies for the tour system.

A lot of people are assuming it's going to be a UI that just generates events - like the Royal Court - but it seems to me just as possible that this is an example of ways in which it will interact with other systems in interesting ways.

 

[darcinc]

Regencies are part of the free update, so it's not, as you say, "split into two DLCs". The free update includes old decisions (hunting, pilgrimage and feasts), but applies the new event mechanic to (similar to wedding planning).

Edit: There's a third focus in the free update, which is "major changes to vassal relations and domain management". For me, that is the dark horse of the entire update.

It doesn't really matter if the regency is a free upgrade or not. The regency was to be part of the Wards and Wardens. Then it would be a good flavor pack - mechanics and roleplay together. And about the statement that they say the players themselves voted this way for Wards and Wardens. I may be wrong, but I think so. Since I live in an authoritarian country, I have seen election manipulation happen. In this case, the other two variants Love&Lust and Villains&Vagabonds could be bogus candidates, as Wards and Wardens looks like the most interesting of the lot, especially given the expectation of a regency in it. Again, I may be wrong, but I admit that the choice that the players made may not actually be them.