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CK3 Dev Diary #1 - Dynasties & Houses

Greetings, and welcome to the first CK3 Feature Dev Diary!

As this is the first DD we want it to be extra juicy, and showcase something that we’re excited about - namely what we’re doing with Dynasties! Dynasties are immaterial yet fundamentally important things that make Crusader Kings what it is - your line must follow an unbroken line of members from your Dynasty; if your Dynasty ends, so does your game.

Now, the representation of Dynasties in CK2 was limited. A character belonged to a Dynasty, and that was that - you got a minor opinion boost with characters that were of the same one, and nothing more. In CK3, we really want to emphasize the power that Dynasties held, and their impact on the medieval world! We want you as the player to feel a bond with your Dynasty, and care for it. To achieve this, we’ve done a multitude of things!

DD2.png


Firstly something that we know will especially please CK2 players, we’ve redefined what a Dynasty actually is - not a monolithic entity, but a collection of Houses. No longer will Dynasties have just one name, one Coat of Arms, and one identity - instead several Houses (aka Cadet Branches!) will be collected under the umbrella that is the Dynasty, working together (theoretically…) towards bringing renown upon the Dynasty!

So, what is a House?
Each Dynasty will have a Founding House (usually of the same name as the Dynasty), which is the first House of that Dynasty. As the game progresses, ruling Dynasty members that are distant by blood to the current House Head (more on this below) may choose to create a Cadet Branch - effectively creating a new House under the Dynasty. Creating a Cadet Branch makes the character creating it House Head (with the most powerful House Head becoming Dynast), and by extension free from the direct influence of their old House Head.

Making your own Cadet Branch requires quite a bit of prestige, that you do not stand to inherit your House Head’s titles, and that all of your Dynastic ancestors are dead (your father can’t be alive, for example). Cadet Branches/Houses come with a lot of flavor: their own names, Coat of Arms and Mottos, usually inspired by the location in which they are founded, and the founding character. For example, if a ruler of the Jimena Dynasty would create a Cadet Branch in southern France, they might be called the Toulouse-Jimenas, and so on.

DD1.png


Now, what is a House Head or a Dynast?
Within a House there is always a leader, a House Head, that wields power over the rest of the members. A House Head has the power to legitimize bastards, call House members to war, and demand that they adhere to their Faith (refusal to convert will result in them creating a new Cadet Branch). The House Head also has inherent leverage on all House members born after they were made head, by virtue of getting a Hook on them (more on Hooks in another DD). They also gain passive prestige based upon the number of members in their House. House leadership follows the succession of the House Head, so that if you’re the leader of your House you will most likely keep that title on succession.

The Dynast, on the other hand, wields significantly more power than a House Head - with their power encompassing the members of all Houses of the entire Dynasty! The Dynast is always the most powerful House Head of a Dynasty, with leadership being updated on the death of the old Dynast. In addition to everything the House Head can do, the Dynast can also Disinherit/Restore Inheritance, Denounce/Forgive members of the Dynasty (which affects opinion in a major way), personally Claim titles held by Dynasty members, and make Dynasty members end wars they have against each other. All of these powers work against every member of the Dynasty, not just the House they’re a part of. The Dynast also gains prestige for every living member of the Dynasty. Being the Dynast is very powerful indeed, but you have to carefully weigh the powers against other benefits, as they cost Renown.

So what is Renown?
Renown is a resource accumulated by a Dynasty, and is used for several things. Firstly, all renown earned by a Dynasty counts towards its Level of Splendor. The Level of Splendor is the outward perception of the Dynasty, how well it is perceived in the eyes of the world, and affects the prestige you get on birth, the prestige when marrying into it, and the maximum long reign opinion you can get. Having a high level also makes it much easier to arrange marriages, especially with Dynasties below your level. Regardless of if Renown is spent or not, the Level of Splendor won’t decrease. The higher your Dynasty’s Level of Splendor, the more impressive its Coat of Arms frame will look. Peasant Dynasties will start at a negative Splendor level, which means that you’ll actually lose prestige for marrying them.

Renown itself is a spendable currency, representing the clout your Dynasty holds over itself. Its use is twofold; firstly it can be used for the most powerful Dynast interactions (getting claims, disinheriting, etc.) and secondly for unlocking Dynasty Legacies (more on this below).

The way you get Renown encourages you to mimic a ‘playstyle’ that was common in reality, but that wasn’t very practical in CK2 - spreading your Dynasty far and wide! You will gain renown for every ruler of your Dynasty that isn’t a subject under another member of your Dynasty. This is based on tier, which means that a King will give more Renown than a Duke, and so on. Marrying in such a way that your Dynasty ends up on the throne of a foreign realm is therefore useful for other reasons than to just murder them until you inherit their lands. Having your Dynasty spread out will give you more Renown, and thus a more powerful Dynasty overall. For example, if you’re playing as the King of England you will NOT gain renown from your landed vassal brother, but you WILL gain renown from your Dynastic cousin ruling a Duchy in the Holy Roman Empire. You will also gain renown from marrying away your dynasty to be spouses of powerful rulers, symbolizing your newfound influence in their realms. This gives you a reason to carefully plan the marriages of your kinsmen, even if you are not in need of an alliance!

So, what are Dynasty Legacies?
We all know that the playing field in Crusader Kings is a very volatile one, you might be Emperor of the World as one character, while being reduced to Count of Norfolk as the next. Dynasty Legacies offer some permanence in this otherwise very wild world, in the form of modifiers and unlocks that affect every member of your Dynasty. Essentially, by using Renown you get to shape what your Dynasty is known for. There’s a myriad of Legacies to choose from, all divided into tracks with an appropriately thematic name, such as ‘Kin’, ‘Guile’ or ‘Blood’. These aim to represent notions the world had (or has) about certain dynasties, i.e., that the Seljuks are warriors, the Abbasids lawmakers, the Habsburgs diplomats (and, ahem, prone to marrying their own kin), etc. Each Legacy track contains five unlocks, each costing a progressively higher amount of Renown to unlock.

DD3.png


In this Dev Diary we will go into details on one of these tracks, “Blood” (which also happens to be my favorite). This track is designed for those of you who enjoy breeding traits into your family line, with the first few unlocks all focusing on increasing the chance of inheritance, emergence, and reinforcement of genetic traits (more on genetic traits in another DD). The last few unlocks will reduce the chance of negative traits appearing (essentially allowing for more.. ‘risky’ marriages), give you the chance to choose a genetic trait to be more common among your kin (i.e. beautiful, intelligent and strong… but also giant or dwarf. No matter how much I pleaded with art I couldn’t get a ‘Habsburg chin’ trait, though!), and finally rounding off with an increase to your Dynasty members Life Expectancy (which increases both their average age, and average fertility - this even means that women of your dynasty remain able to bear children for longer!).

Legacies take a long time to unlock, and you will have to work hard toward unlocking even one full track - though their power more than makes up for the wait. Legacies are chosen and unlocked by the Dynast, so make sure that you’re in control of your Dynasty.

That’s all for this time! We won’t spoil any more of the Legacy tracks for now, but rest assured that they all offer very interesting opportunities for you to shape your dynasty as you would like it! Next up we have a sneak preview of the map, stay tuned for the next DD.
 
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Nikicaga

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What a start! Literally everything people asked for and more regarding Dynasties!
 

Sleight of Hand

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It *could* be saying when the Robertine dynasy was founded, not when the Robertine Cadet Branch of Capet was founded.
I don't think so, because if you look at the Dover-Godwin dynasty it would suggest that the date refers to the cadet branch, not the original dynasty.

Also, the Robertian dynasty should go back way before 866.
 

Tokiedian

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I agree with dynasty legacies, because some houses has unique tendencies definitely. However, idea that only head of dynasty can set legacy just with consuming renown... It isn't my taste. It looks too gamey and EU4-like. I think legacies should require much more conditions like Bloodlines did in CK2 HF, not just amount of Renown mana.
 

d12ddd

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A few questions:
1. Will AI unlock legacies(Aka will Rurikids in 1066 be among the best dynasties?) and will we have a way to see what legacies other dynasties have accumulated?
2. Does the legacy that increases life expectancy just increase your overall health(thus making it easier to recover from sickness and injuries) or does it only protect you from old age?
3 Are names, mottos and CoA customisable?
 

IndigoRage

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Seriously? ANOTHER mana bar? Like, we complain again and again that we dont want more mana bars, and yet you keep making more mana bars. Why?
Literally every Paradox game has some form of "mana". Yes. Even that one. The difference is how controllable it is, and how instant and major the outcome is. Money and manpower are technically forms of mana, but you'll never see anyone complaining about them. Having some kind of points you accumulate and spend on something is not damning in itself.
 

guinea prince

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I look at this in a different way: if you progress Erudite for instance, your Dynastic head starts promoting ideas of learning to the rest of the Dynasty, and demands that they focus more on it. If the Dynast chooses to progress War Legacy, he will promote warfare through the Dynasty and the dynasty will live a more warlike lifestyle.

Having a great warrior for an ancestor does not mean that the entire dynasty should suddenly want to live by his example. Maybe they believe that he carved the way for a more diplomatic future?
I always figured that reputation was a lot of it. A +0.50 from bloodline wouldn't inherently make you a better combatant; but on the field of battle, your opponent would know "holy camel dung, this is the grandson of the great Uncle Reginald! Killer of 50 men in a single brawl!" A little intimidation based on reputation, but one factor of many. Uncle Reginald's grandson will still be an overweight wimp, but that legacy alone gives the foe a second's pause.

Meanwhile, Uncle Reginald gathers all the family heads together. They wait in pregnant silence when his manservant rushes in to announce his arrival. Uncle Reginald shuffles in slowly, bloodied, having just returned from bringing glory and conquest to his kin. Many cousins were made kings this day, and everyone wants to know what future Uncle Reginald wants to direct his dynasty towards.

BOOKS! shouts the bloodied and scarred Uncle Reginald. BOOKS AND DWARF BABIES!
 

Serenity84

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difference is how controllable it is, and how instant and major the outcome is
A major difference is the level of abstraction. Everyone hates monarch power because it is 100% abstract and doesn't really mean anything. Manpower and money are only slight abstractions. Things like political power and army experience are somewhat abstracted, but still have a clear meaning. People are fine with piety and prestige, because they aren't too abstract and people can easily imagine what they represent. Though some of their uses are a bit game-y too. Like spending prestige when you found an empire, although that should increase your prestige
 

Pirisinian

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Seems like a big emphasis for this dev diary was on dynastic co-operation. Hopefully in the future we see room for inter-dynastic or even inter-house conflicts, so that being a head is as dangerous as it is rewarding.
 

branimir1999

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If the renown is high enough, will we see dynastic unions such as with Maria Theresa and her son's Habsburg-Lorraine dynasty?

Also, this is a bit off-topic but will we see a little bit more chaos regarding ruler life expectancy? I've always felt that ruler lives were far too stable: I've rarely had to concern myself with my legitimacy to rule, susceptibility to disease, succession wars, plots on my life and other. I would usually kill off my character via console command when my heir came of age just to simulate this.

Finally, what about children? In CK2, spamming kids had no negative impact and you could just create children for either marriage, the perfect heir or expanding your dynasty. Will there be a drawback (financial or the risk of death on childbirth) to having lots of children?
 

IndigoRage

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A major difference is the level of abstraction. Everyone hates monarch power because it is 100% abstract and doesn't really mean anything. Manpower and money are only slight abstractions. Things like political power and army experience are somewhat abstracted, but still have a clear meaning. People are fine with piety and prestige, because they aren't too abstract and people can easily imagine what they represent. Though some of their uses are a bit game-y too. Like spending prestige when you found an empire, although that should increase your prestige
I consider the whole thing a natural extension of prestige, though we'll see how it applies in game terms when we get to it I guess. I'm fine with the legacies in a sense since they kind of mirror the concept of bloodlines in CK2 (IE, the way your dynasty is perceived influences outcomes for them and the way others perceive them) though I hope blood is just a small nudge, since it seems like a prime offender for being kind of iffy.
 

in heaven

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I like this system, one thing I'm not liking though is dynasty bonuses changing genes of your family, I think this should be more of a natural thing, the whole "Habsburg chin" thing should come out naturally by the way you marry rather than be unlocked. Just my two cents.
 

durbal

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Being a glorious knight does not mean that he reveres that lifestyle or wants everyone to live by it. AI will, if I understood it correctly, base the decisions of the Dynast's traits and preferences so a bloodthirsty glorious knight will promote a warlike lifestyle, while a Kind and Patient glorious Knight might use his renown to instead promote a diplomatic lifestyle to his descendants. Or a Diplomacy-savy King, filled with Wroth and Cruelty, who earned a lot of renown may use his charisma to spread violent sentiments across his dynasty. So if AI bases its choice on its traits, it is organic.
An RP-oriented player will do the same: he will base the chosen Legacy by what makes sense for him.

There is a huge difference between Legacy and Imitating.

What the AI will do is irrelevant when talking about the game design and mechanics themselves though.

I'm also not a huge fan of the AI acting as a pseudo-player-character because it tends to just weaken the AI. For example, the AI is poised to press a claim but then the ruler dies and is succeeded by a character with the 'kind' trait (but also maybe has 20 martial) and so decides to not press it meanwhile nearly every player would (and even an RPer justifying it as 'the will of my father' or some such). This tends to naturally be less of a problem in the CK series since traits influence outcomes a bit more, but it's a big problem for the AI in Imperator and EU4 because the AI keeps changing its aggressiveness and weights throughout a session based on ruler traits while the player can freely ignore such things. It is still a problem in CK nonetheless and could be especially annoying in CK3 if, for example, suddenly your dynast martial ruler dies in battle and is replaced by one from the AI who decides to spend all the dynasty mana on the Erudite path because they got a trait from some event years back.
 

Thrake

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I was confused on how cadet branches could be made interesting, but you did it anyway. However I'm not really sold on renown. Legacies feel gamey and say dishineriting should have harsher consequences than just spending a currency.
 

Razmorg

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Nice stuff.

Splendor + renown: A bit worried but sounds a bit like it's just dynasty prestige with a split for a permanent value and a flexible one which should feel natural and fun.

Legacies: It does sound a bit gamey to pick it from a tree and just get buffs by dumping renown. And it sounds off to me that renown would be "spent" to gain legacies. It makes sense if renown would go down if you use your good name in abusive ways or bad ways but not just establishing your dynasty identity. So my big wonders is if there should be a way to make it feel less like a bonus shop and more as a way to steer the image of your dynasty (but I'd really hope if it wasn't just black and white and you could get legacies based on events and maybe even bad legacies)?

But yeah. Will be interesting to see how this system works.
 

mpsdevil

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I like this system, one thing I'm not liking though is dynasty bonuses changing genes of your family, I think this should be more of a natural thing, the whole "Habsburg chin" thing should come out naturally by the way you marry rather than be unlocked. Just my two cents.

That would be really nice but realistically probably wouldn't be as good cause there's no way that they could account for all possible unique ways of playstyle and presumably it would just be a matter of ticking boxes to unlock certain powers / boosts, which is just as gamey (not that there's a problem with that, it is a game which is why I'm fine with the function as described in the diary)
 

Tryvenyal

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I like it! Very interesting!

How is not every dynasty a cadet-branch of another, except that historyfiles can't go far enough back? :)

Is the name unique? Or can potentially multiple same named cadet- branches coexist?

Is a spawned noble character the founder of his dynasty? What level does they start?

No more generic "Lowborn" dynasty then? Every peasant has a dynasty on his own?

What does a spouse bring to the new dynasty, except children and renown from the marriage?
 
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IndigoRage

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The higher your Dynasty’s Level of Splendor, the more impressive its Coat of Arms frame will look.

Speaking of. Is this the final way the escutcheons or "frames" will be represented? The shape almost looks too futuristic. It might just me being used to CK2, but the very wide top gives it a weird modern feel.

Also I don't know if I'm a fan of courts being marked with small banner sprites rather than large escutcheons. Seeing a tiny flag isn't really the same as seeing that big beautiful grandiose coat of arms.
 
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