CK2 Dev Diary #105 - Clergy Interactions Revamp

Hello, everyone.

Today we will be talking of a nice quality of life update to the interface, AI behavior and some new additional flavor regarding the Papacy (as well as any similar religious head that has access to these interactions, such as a Reformed Pagan High Priest with Hierocratic Leadership).

20181019092639_1.jpg


The patch coming with Holy Fury will place all Papal Actions in a more easily accessible list of icons, right under the portrait of your religious head in the Religion screen.

Furthermore, the behavior for all these actions has been un-hardcoded and fully scripted, so the Pope is now much more sensible when deciding who he wants to Excommunicate, and less restrictive when considering the possibility of granting an Invasion casus belli to an ambitious ruler. More importantly, players are now able to see exactly why their religious head is denying them a request.

The AI logic itself has been considerably expanded and tailored to the various actions.

CatholicClergy1.jpg


Having a vassal Pope no longer ensures that all your demands will be automatically accepted, and having an independent Pope will not make it near-impossible to get a favor from him. The Pope will take into consideration Opinion, Piety, traits, the specific circumstances (such as divorcing an infertile wife), and the amount of controlled Cardinal seats when deciding whether to accept a ruler’s request or not. Piety costs for these interactions have also been rebalanced and tied to the ruler’s tier, making them more accessible to low ranking rulers and costlier to Kings and Emperors.

CatholicClergy2.jpg


The Request Claim interaction has been given a special new interface as well to make it more intuitive and accessible to players. Rather than having to search directly for the title that you wish to gain a claim on, you can use the new button in the religious view to get a list of potential Catholic rulers owning titles for which the Pope is willing to grant you a claim on. By clicking on any of them, you will be shown a second window showing the list of all titles owned by the target ruler and from there you can select the one that you are interested in.

20180824084127_1.jpg


Finally, if you are Excommunicated, the Issue Declaration of Repentance decision has been revamped so that it is no longer simply a cash payment.

Much like when requesting a coronation, the Pope will now pick one out of several possible demands for the player to fulfill in exchange for the lifting of his excommunication. Requests can range from a show of contrition causing Prestige loss, to changing your realm laws, to give one of your sons to the Church.


Also, bonus Cardinal clothes, pre and post 1245:

Cardinals preview.jpg
 

MrCDexterWard

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Furthermore, the behavior for all these actions has been un-hardcoded and fully scripted . . . The AI logic itself has been considerably expanded and tailored to the various actions.

Hallelujah!

Also is the acceptance score simply a "needs to be above a certain threshold for acceptance" or is it simply get a positive score and you get a yes?
 
Last edited:

Kapitalisti

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Finally those snazzy red robes. But which "Papal" interactions are available to reformed pagans with hierocratic leadership? Divorces and excommunications only?
 

jumbi

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Will any other existing diplomatic actions, such as proposing marriages and betrothals, or voting in elective successions also be made scriptable?
 

Me_

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Nice :) What can we expect in the next DD?
 

J.B.

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Are Roman Catholic clergy members, or at least Catholics with the zealous trait meant to be clean-shaven after a certain year? The pre-1245 AD Cardinal has a beard, and the one after that does not, but is that just a stylistic choice on the part of those characters, or is it intended to fit into a more modern devout Catholic's uniform, of sorts?
 

Wagoo

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Screw this pagan reformation. Screw the Crusade mechanics. Screw Hellenist revival.

Making the Pope willing to do more negotiations and diplomacy is arguably the real reason we're buying Holy Fury.
 

Silfae

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Finally those snazzy red robes. But which "Papal" interactions are available to reformed pagans with hierocratic leadership? Divorces and excommunications only?
Divorces, Excommunications, Grant Claim and Request Invasion are all available for Hierocratic and Autocephalous Leadership. Only Ask Money is exclusive to the Papacy.
 

Silfae

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Are Roman Catholic clergy members, or at least Catholics with the zealous trait meant to be clean-shaven after a certain year? The pre-1245 AD Cardinal has a beard, and the one after that does not, but is that just a stylistic choice on the part of those characters, or is it intended to fit into a more modern devout Catholic's uniform, of sorts?
I would say that is more of a random chance. Christian and Hellenics of Iberian/Italian/Roman culture are set to be more likely to shave their beards in general.
 

LeSingeAffame

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Silversweeeper

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Un-hardcoding is always nice!

A few questions:

- Is the EP (and other autocephalous rel heads) still 100 % loyal, or does he fall under the same vassal rel head rule?

- Is there a way to ask other autocephalous rel heads than your own (particularly vassal ones) to excommunicate people for you (with or without some added difficulty to acceptance)?

- Is there a way to negotiate (to some extent; obviously, you're not in a great position to negotiate) the price of having an excommunication lifted (alternatively, will the Pope come up with a new demand if you ask a second time)? For example, becoming celibate could risk being game-ending, and perhaps you'd rather give a county/duchy to the church or something.

- Will the Pope remember what you did in order to have an excommunication lifted and take action if you go back on your word (e.g. breaking a vow of celibacy)?

- Will Catholic (or whatever the relevant faith is for a given rel head) Monastic Order members get any bonuses to papal (or whatever) interactions?
 

Silfae

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Un-hardcoding is always nice!

A few questions:

- Is the EP (and other autocephalous rel heads) still 100 % loyal, or does he fall under the same vassal rel head rule?

- Is there a way to ask other autocephalous rel heads than your own (particularly vassal ones) to excommunicate people for you (with or without some added difficulty to acceptance)?

- Is there a way to negotiate (to some extent; obviously, you're not in a great position to negotiate) the price of having an excommunication lifted (alternatively, will the Pope come up with a new demand if you ask a second time)? For example, becoming celibate could risk being game-ending, and perhaps you'd rather give a county/duchy to the church or something.

- Will the Pope remember what you did in order to have an excommunication lifted and take action if you go back on your word (e.g. breaking a vow of celibacy)?

- Will Catholic (or whatever the relevant faith is for a given rel head) Monastic Order members get any bonuses to papal (or whatever) interactions?

- The interactions use the new system regardless of what religious head they are being used on. (So yes, he's no longer 100% loyal either).
- No, they are only available towards your religious head.
- There are occasionally alternate options unlocked by traits/attributes, but, for the most part is a Yes/No event.
- No; most events are irreversible, so that would be hard to pull off in the first place.
- Not right now, though that is a nice suggestion.
 

AquosPoke206

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I've got a lot of questions about Pagan Fury so would it be ok if you guys could answer them.

Will the Shattered World and Random World work with the EU4 Converter?

How will Pagan Reformation affect the converter? For example; will a Reformed Hierocratic Suomenusko Independent High Priest get the Papacy government in EU4?

Are there similar types of interactions with Temporal Religous Leaders?

What are Norse Hierocratic Leaders, Suomenusko Temporal Leaders, Hellenic Temporal Leaders and Hellenic Hierocratic Leaders called?

What are the Hellenic holy orders?

Thank you in advance and sorry for the annoyance. I am so excited for Pagan Fury.
 

LeSingeAffame

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Silfae

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Will the Shattered World and Random World work with the EU4 Converter?

How will Pagan Reformation affect the converter? For example; will a Reformed Hierocratic Suomenusko Independent High Priest get the Papacy government in EU4?
I'm not familiar with the converter or EU4, so I'm afraid I cannot answer these.

Are there similar types of interactions with Temporal Religous Leaders?
No, Temporal Heads do not get these interactions as a way to balance the Leadership type.

What are Norse Hierocratic Leaders, Suomenusko Temporal Leaders, Hellenic Temporal Leaders and Hellenic Hierocratic Leaders called?
Fylkir, Tietaja, Pontifex Maximus. The titles are not changed based on Leadership.

What are the Hellenic holy orders?
The Myrmidons.
 

Patriarch of Bub

Lauc hum et Folgoratrix
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I love it. Thank you so much for the new clothing.
No pressure, you guys have done plenty for HF as it is, although could you revamp the Pope (really needed) normal catholic bishops (not as important, but their hats look like they are made of paper mache for a school project) orthodox clergy (need it like there is no tomorrow), Mya/Mono and Nestorian too.

Edit : totally forgot, but we are still missing religious clothing since Monks and Mystics! Mya monk society and Nestorian monk society completly lack clothes.

Thank you :p
 

orochi2k

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I wonder if "sacrifice 100 prisoners" is on Aztec Pope's request list...
Or....do all religious heads use the same request list....