Tomes of Magic - Info Compilation
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Looking at this I am starting to suspect there is some pathing with the tomes. Like Tome of Souls says souls are a resource used to make undead units. Probably means they are *required* to make undead. Which suggests the higher tier tome of Necromancy requires Souls to be selected first. In materium we probably require Enchanting before selecting Artificing. Glades probably requires Roots.
That said the other option in most tiers is probably more free. Doomherald and Winds both look like they can be taken as long as we have access to a tier 2 tome selection.
I am also thinking about metagaming with the tomes. We can probably select lower tier tomes when given the option and I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess one of the "select a new tome" triggers is finishing the research of a tome. Assuming higher tier tomes cost more and more research to finish it might become a choice of selecting a lower tier tome to get more options faster or spending more time working on a higher tier tome to get stronger options slower.
Which finally leads me to will there be a limit to the number of tomes we can select in a game or if a game goes long enough could we potentially get them all? There is probably a limit. Something like 2 tomes max per tier.
That said the other option in most tiers is probably more free. Doomherald and Winds both look like they can be taken as long as we have access to a tier 2 tome selection.
I am also thinking about metagaming with the tomes. We can probably select lower tier tomes when given the option and I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess one of the "select a new tome" triggers is finishing the research of a tome. Assuming higher tier tomes cost more and more research to finish it might become a choice of selecting a lower tier tome to get more options faster or spending more time working on a higher tier tome to get stronger options slower.
Which finally leads me to will there be a limit to the number of tomes we can select in a game or if a game goes long enough could we potentially get them all? There is probably a limit. Something like 2 tomes max per tier.
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We also know there is atleast 1 higher tier frost tome because in the reveal stream when they changed to a more advanced save they had the frostling transformation and their domain had changed to arctic, neither of these, to my knowledge, are possible with the tier 1 tome of cryomancy
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I keep coming back to this thread as a guilty pleasure to imagine cultures that would be fun to play.
it seems that som tier 2 are not so relatable to the tiers 1 like rock being tiers 1 and wind tiers 2.
I’m wondering if we will see more difference like that in other affinities.
it would mean that the path of times you pick isn’t as scripted
it seems that som tier 2 are not so relatable to the tiers 1 like rock being tiers 1 and wind tiers 2.
I’m wondering if we will see more difference like that in other affinities.
it would mean that the path of times you pick isn’t as scripted
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My more or less wild speculation is that the tome system is an iteration / modernization of the spellbooks from MoM (which were also referred to as tomes in some bits of documentation).
If that's correct, I'd wager on a few things:
- There is likely a cap on the maximum tomes you can get. MoM's cap was 11.
- Tomes probably aren't directly tied to specific spells, but instead tied to a specific type of magic. Spells are tied to a given field of magic and are unlocked as you get more tome points in the relevant field. To access the highest level of magic you need to go all-in on a specific flavor; diversity comes at the cost of raw power but has the benefit of allowing for cool (or stupid overpowered, or both) combinations.
- You can probably access higher tier spellbooks both via research (because that's how AoW has always done it, and it seems the most fair & fun) and also maybe by clearing special encounters (that's how MoM did it. It was kind of dumb and broken TBH).
100% just guessing, but literally the first thing to pop into my head when they revealed the tome system was, 'Oh, like spellbook picks?'
If that's correct, I'd wager on a few things:
- There is likely a cap on the maximum tomes you can get. MoM's cap was 11.
- Tomes probably aren't directly tied to specific spells, but instead tied to a specific type of magic. Spells are tied to a given field of magic and are unlocked as you get more tome points in the relevant field. To access the highest level of magic you need to go all-in on a specific flavor; diversity comes at the cost of raw power but has the benefit of allowing for cool (or stupid overpowered, or both) combinations.
- You can probably access higher tier spellbooks both via research (because that's how AoW has always done it, and it seems the most fair & fun) and also maybe by clearing special encounters (that's how MoM did it. It was kind of dumb and broken TBH).
100% just guessing, but literally the first thing to pop into my head when they revealed the tome system was, 'Oh, like spellbook picks?'
I quite like tomes and magic objects as reward for quests
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Added a section that contains a legend image for the different types of Icons that appear in Tomes.
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Haven't played MoM myself so I don't know how it looked like, I'd like however to comment on these points:
1. Cap is likely though I wouldn't be surprised if that was more of soft cap instead of hard one, as in with each tome unlocked the next gets more prohibitive to unlock. That would mean that while theoretically you could unlock all (unless some tomes specifically lock others) 54 tomes, it's basically never happening in a standard game.
2. I'm not sure what you mean there, I'm gonna be honest. From what I understand tomes are tied to affinities and are mostly their own thing, each book unlocks number of technologies which then can be randomly drawn from a pool to research. So far all tomes shown contain either 5 or 6 technologies. These can be units, buildings, spells and possibly general upgrades.
3. Research is the most likely way to unlock the tomes I agree. No idea as for clearing ancient wonders and similar encounters, it sounds like it could definitely be hard to balance around it.
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Final Ultimatum seems kinda interesting
In that it suggests that they are taking yet another new tack with Mind Control spells. In AoW3 we saw unconditional MC that stole units permanently, in Planetfall we saw mind control spells that either killed the unit or turned it into something else or needed a gold rank unit converted from another unit. Now we are seeing conditionally unconditional mind control that seems to also steal it permanently. Oh, and it comes at the very end of the tech tree so it's probably not very rushable.
I wonder if we'll see other mind control using the same sort of "conditions apply but those conditions are things you can make the other guy do, and it's pinnacle" and/or more of the Planetfall style "jump through three or four hoops if you want permanent units, otherwise just have them for the fight".
In that it suggests that they are taking yet another new tack with Mind Control spells. In AoW3 we saw unconditional MC that stole units permanently, in Planetfall we saw mind control spells that either killed the unit or turned it into something else or needed a gold rank unit converted from another unit. Now we are seeing conditionally unconditional mind control that seems to also steal it permanently. Oh, and it comes at the very end of the tech tree so it's probably not very rushable.
I wonder if we'll see other mind control using the same sort of "conditions apply but those conditions are things you can make the other guy do, and it's pinnacle" and/or more of the Planetfall style "jump through three or four hoops if you want permanent units, otherwise just have them for the fight".
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Actually, even though it says Tier V there, it doesn't mean is late-game in this game. Because it comes from a Tier III book, which is mid-game tome ("Focused on the more repressive aspects of Order, the Tome of Subjugation is a mid game tome focused on the domination and control of other races."). You can also see tier VI spells in this and other Tier III Tomes. Based on observation, my understanding is that Tier I Tomes have Tier I-II research elements, Tier II Tomes will probably have Tier III-IV research elements, then Tier III Tomes have Tier V-VI like we can see, and so on. So Tier IV tome will probably have Tier VII-VIII research, and Tier V tomes will have Tier IX-X research.
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This is only me speculating but it looks like one of the unidentified tier 3 tomes is related to the Tome of Rocks based on its color scheme/design.
Speaking of icons for things you can research from Tomes, and things you can research in general, the "select a research" menu not only includes a "shuffle research" button, but the otherwise-empty circle on the lower left of the icons has a lock symbol on it. I presume this lock symbol can be clicked on if you want a particular research to stay after the selection shuffles due to either completing the previous one, or pressing the shuffle button.
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Amazing Job!!
My speculation is that there are probably many enhancements in the tier IV Tomes and may even be named something like the Tome of Frostlings and that could be why they may not try showing them off until closer to the release
My speculation is that there are probably many enhancements in the tier IV Tomes and may even be named something like the Tome of Frostlings and that could be why they may not try showing them off until closer to the release
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Or you know they have 3 months worth of dev diaries to fill with content.
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There is a very cool sounding "Tome of Cold Dark" apparently (visible at 1:07 in the new video during realm creation), maybe Tier II-IV Shadow affinity stuff?
EDIT: Oy, more (Chaos?) Tomes: Tome of Pandemonium, Chaos Channeling and Chaos Gate - they sound very tempting, too!
EDIT: Oy, more (Chaos?) Tomes: Tome of Pandemonium, Chaos Channeling and Chaos Gate - they sound very tempting, too!
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From todays stream we can see "Sundering Strikes" from the Tome of Enchantment as a level up option for the leader.
So that icon seesm to mean "is added to the ability selection for your leader" and maybe heroes.
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