Things that make you go hmmm....

[21oliver]

Manpower has everything to do with history the moment they attached it to a real life historical event where it can be refuted. If they would have made up something (Hitlers birthday! recruits are flocking to the military!) we couldnt see peep, but when they attached it to a real life event, where we know it didnt occur, they opened themself up to be evaluated.

Let me ask you something if you edit the anschluss to give Germany 100 manpower, and then linked it to a follow up event that provided another 400 manpower (Baby Boomers population growth congrats Germany!). How would the game be effected negatively? germany would still get their 500 manpower. That is all im saying. No other issues need to be brought into play here. The end result is the same, its just more palatable historically. We know they had events that arent historical because it adds flavor and or helps the game be "balanced" so we tend to live with them without much discussion, why not simply do the same here, especially if its so easy to do. Why all the discussions about the game, its mechanics etc etc, when another simply automatic event would have handled it properly.

 

[comsubpac]

Manpower has everything to do with history the moment they attached it to a real life historical event where it can be refuted. If they would have made up something (Hitlers birthday! recruits are flocking to the military!) we couldnt see peep, but when they attached it to a real life event, where we know it didnt occur, they opened themself up to be evaluated.

Let me ask you something if you edit the anschluss to give Germany 100 manpower, and then linked it to a follow up event that provided another 400 manpower (Baby Boomers population growth congrats Germany!). How would the game be effected negatively? germany would still get their 500 manpower. That is all im saying. No other issues need to be brought into play here. The end result is the same, its just more palatable historically. We know they had events that arent historical because it adds flavor and or helps the game be "balanced" so we tend to live with them without much discussion, why not simply do the same here, especially if its so easy to do. Why all the discussions about the game, its mechanics etc etc, when another simply automatic event would have handled it properly.

as i said in my first post: why have two events or modifiers or whatever when you end up with the same thing: additional manpower for germany? you wouldn't change the result but you would make the way needlessly complicated. if you tell me how much % more manpower per month germany should get to have roughly the same i can replace it with a modifier. not that it would make much sense though.
and no manpower and all the other resources still have nothing to do with history even when linked to events (since you can't provide as with historical numbers anyway). you still don't understand the underlying mechanics of games.

 

[21oliver]

This has nothing to do with the mechanics of the game. Why did you make an event pack with 68 historical events, why not just make up 68 fictional things? because you wanted to add more flavor, more realism of the time period to the game we play. that is my point. These three events are so off base its not silly. Give Germany the manpower who cares, but by doing it in this manner its horrible. In game i can immediately queue up 50 divisions upon Germany's Anschluss of Austria. We know the anschluss didnt provide Germany anywhere near 50 divisions immediately.

Forget the game mechanics and all that other BS, we play the game because it provides us some illusion of the time period which we enjoy to study and play games about. The more Accuracy the game has the better the game feels to us. How can you care about accuracy here, but not here, i do over here, but not over here. This issue is easily changable with a minimum of effort there is no need to go on for days about game mechanics. If all we cared about was that Japan surrenders after the abomb and Russia beats Germany why bother with any of it? Give Germany and Japan nothing but Militia to build and youll get those 2 results. As Austria you have 50+ available manpower and yet you give Germany 500 and you say its no big deal because the result is the same. Of course its a big deal, its all a big deal, thats why we invest hours into this game and this forum, this isnt pacman. If Siam had nukes and the USA only formed Cavalry and Luxembourg conquered the world everygame we wouldnt be here discussing it or playing would we?

Other people can argue that they dont care it doesnt make a difference. I know you care, ive read many posts and now your modding the game to give it more historical detail, of course you care. I really respect and apreciate your knowledge and your support of this game, but really as a piece of advice you should avoid my posts before you have a coronary. This wasnt a post up for discussion it was over the moment it was formed. To continue on will only look bad please just let it go. Sometimes your very much on the money, this one i would just skip.

BTW nice work on the mod, ive heard, havent had a chance to check it out.

 

[James_Manring]

its just more palatable historically

Alright everyone, let's take a moment to reflect on this one point. It is the driving force for 21oliver and even if we don't have as picky of a palate we can respect that someone else does. It is the same with food, hence the analogy. If this can be done to achieve the same result with a different and more palatable approach, everyone comes out happy. 21oliver is not the only user that has this mindset, I assure you all. It is not a negative thing for us to pay attention to others and try to absorb their opinions. When he has a good point it makes sense to look at what can be done to make everyone feel they are deeply immersed in the game.

The modders here, at least Comsubpac and I, are able to make any of these changes quite easily. As Comsubpac says it adds complication to the game, however a few more lines of code aren't going to hurt anyone. I added over 600 lines of code to DI:G for just one event to create a peace deal if there is a Military Coup after a successful Operation Valkyrie and it didn't have any noticeable slow-downs except for when enacting the once off event. I hope that you can all join me in optimism.

Comsubpac, I think we are of close enough opinions that we can come together on this. To me you seem to be saying, "the ends justify the means." and what I think I am saying is that, "the ends justify the means though they could stand to be more logical in their application." I think that everyone would be happy if we work on making the means make more sense. I don't see this as being a particularly challenging balance issue as we are only dealing with one country and a finite amount of manpower introduced before a finite time.

 

[21oliver]

Maybe you were the cop instead of me! Anyway i am used to being able to seperate issues and analyze a single issue, ive noticed many here are not able to. You wont catch me often jumping topics. I mean if you say i think that the armor isnt powerful enough in HOI3 and i do respond it will be either 1) yes your right! or 2) i disagree because... it will never be 3) well its do to the complex aircraft requirements and how it affects strategic materials and so forth. I know or at least i thought i knew when i would start a thread that will lead to war here, this one i thought was a no brainer.

 

[James_Manring]

Maybe you were the cop instead of me! Anyway i am used to being able to seperate issues and analyze a single issue, ive noticed many here are not able to. You wont catch me often jumping topics. I mean if you say i think that the armor isnt powerful enough in HOI3 and i do respond it will be either 1) yes your right! or 2) i disagree because... it will never be 3) well its do to the complex aircraft requirements and how it affects strategic materials and so forth. I know or at least i thought i knew when i would start a thread that will lead to war here, this one i thought was a no brainer.

Use some tact my friend, tact I say... This post is just baiting another reply from anyone it upsets. Lets end the Sprekenzkrieg into a Sitzkrieg.

 

[21oliver]

im buttoning ze lips...

 

[James_Manring]

Accepted - I am now going to talk to some Kookaburras

Not a bad choice. I hear they laugh and are pretty much gay as life can be. Must have been in a song somewhere. Probably makes for an enjoyable day.

im buttoning ze lips...

No hugs? Come on.... you know you want to hug us. It isn't unmanly as long as you don't hold on for too long.

 

[Secret Master]

Folks, if we can't be civil and stay on topic, then this thread has outlived its usefulness. Clearly, the OP wants a solution to a problem that Paradox isn't going to give them. That Anschluss event has been around for awhile. Therefore, the solution seems to be modding, as some have already suggested.

I'm going to go ahead and close this thread. If you folks want to have a civil discussion about modding the game in the ways the OP would like to see, feel free to open a new thread in the appropriate forum.