Let the ruling classes tremble – an Interactive Revolutionary AAR

[Raph]

The national question is an economic question aswell. With the current system of self-governing soviets working in accordance to goals set by the (national) state plan, we have achieved huge levels of economic success in general, and an even distribution of production as well as consumtion in the entire VSVR. Thanks to the possibilities of modern scientific economic planning together with the democratic initiative of the councils, we can utulize our natural resources and allocate the fruits of our labour in a both efficient and fair way. This planning, specialization, and distbriution becomes more efficient the larger the economy is, since we can transfer resources from where they are needed to other parts of the economy, and we have the natural resources to produce anything. Our various industrial sectors cooperate to create every higher standards of living. However, we also compete with the economies of the imperialists, and with the economies of our comrade nations in the comintern. This competition causes inefficiency, when several parallell economical processes all working against each other instead of cooperating and specializing.

Increased national division, as the NC proposes, will aggravate this problem. Increased economic integration, as the Marxists propose, will be a very concrete step on the way to the abolishment of the state. Remember, the state is not just a political entity, it is an economic unit, and the economy is the base of the state and the entire society. We need a communist economy if we want communist, i.e. stateless, politics.

 

[Tommy4ever]

What are the polls currently at?

Latest Polls:

Total Vote: 59

Marxists: 39
Democratic Anarchists: 11
National Communists: 9

The Marxists have a massive lead. 66% of the total vote. No Chairman has ever been elected with more than 50%.

Still, we can hope for a good few more votes. IIRC 80 is the record.

 

[John Forseti]

I cant believe I forgot to vote last time, and I would have voted Marxist-Leninist. I wonder how things would have turned out?

Anyway, not forgetting this time;

Marxist

 

[LordTempest]

Marxists

 

[Tommy4ever]

As an amusing side note I'm starting to run out of room in the section I left to tally the Marxist vote. :rofl:

 

[Lenin Cat]

Well, I have to say that a case can be made that continously splitting the world into ever smaller divisions should also end in a stateless society (first divide it on ethnical lines, then geographic lines, then into kilometer squares (or whatever), then into parcels, then into collectives and then every person gets to be his own state and then the state is abolished)

However, this would only work once Britain and their navy dont have the opportunity anymore to bully little states around, which means that even if the NC way of dividing the world is not completely wrong, it would only work once the World Republic is here, and once that is here the state can be abolished right away anyways.

So Trotsky's approach is simply a timesaver

Socialism states that the state will be abolished when classes are abolished.

 

[thekonkoe]

Splitting of the state into nations need require splitting of the economy. In fact it doesn't even require the creation of borders, the nation is the people, the Volk.

 

[WelshDude]

If I read the decision correctly, it only gives Africa cores on VSVR territory, correct? Could you make it for all of Africa by deleting the "any_owned" part?

 

[Barón Rojo]

I don't know why we allow the existence of this tribal theocracy... Sokoto is called. Why do not topple this "Caliph", as hilariously calls himself the warchief of these lands, give the tools and the knowledge to this people to develop the socialism, and see what can do they with it; instead of the colonialism, good-hearted but colonialism anyway, of the European industries managed by European workers with European managers? We are sweeping out the local identities of the African peoples with these massive waves of immigrants and this paternalism. Why don't we help their culture to flourish? Why don't we see what can do this culture for the socialism? Why the peoples of Russia, France or Spain have the right to exist as socialist entities with their own state and on the other side the African peoples see this possibility denied?

I don't concur with my Marxist comrades on this. The real stateless society will be achieved throw dissolution of all the nations by the Komintern, not globing all the nations of the Earth on a single "super-state" and later pretend to abolish it.

 

[SwiftRosenthal]

Marxists. We're almost there...

 

[unmerged(247551)]

Socialism states that the state will be abolished when classes are abolished.

I wasnt disagreeing with that. Classes would also be pretty much abolished if the continous splitting of states results in everybody being his own state.

But anyways, it would take forever that way. Trotskie's way is straightforward and direct and this is why marxists are the only realistic option anyways.

 

[Konnigratz]

It'd be an amazing result if Trotsky, not content with "merely" winning the election and becoming the first person to serve 3 terms, also won with two thirds of the vote.

 

[keynes2.0]

I wasnt disagreeing with that. Classes would also be pretty much abolished if the continous splitting of states results in everybody being his own state.

But anyways, it would take forever that way. Trotskie's way is straightforward and direct and this is why marxists are the only realistic option anyways.

Realistic is generally not the first adjective I would use in describing forcing the entire world to peacefully co-exist at the point of a gun. Do you really think that when the capitalists are conquered the state will cease to exist? How long would they stay conquered without an occupying army? How do you expect such thoroughly capitalist societies to integrate into the Comitern without the VSVR telling them so?

Conquer the world by force and it will take more then a millennium for a stateless society to emerge. We must allow communism to emerge in a form natural to every state. In Germany, that was at the hands of the proletariat. In Russia, it was the hands of the peasant. And in the US and the UK it is the ballot box.

We can bury the US and the UK beneath our economic might, comrades and make them see the error of their ways so that they will embrace communism. But if we conquer them we can force them to be marxists but they will never become communists.

 

[unmerged(247551)]

Realistic is generally not the first adjective I would use in describing forcing the entire world to peacefully co-exist at the point of a gun. Do you really think that when the capitalists are conquered the state will cease to exist? How long would they stay conquered without an occupying army? How do you expect such thoroughly capitalist societies to integrate into the Comitern without the VSVR telling them so?

Conquer the world by force and it will take more then a millennium for a stateless society to emerge. We must allow communism to emerge in a form natural to every state. In Germany, that was at the hands of the proletariat. In Russia, it was the hands of the peasant. And in the US and the UK it is the ballot box.

We can bury the US and the UK beneath our economic might, comrades and make them see the error of their ways so that they will embrace communism. But if we conquer them we can force them to be marxists but they will never become communists.

Ach, youre overstimating the situation. Once the white house is on fire they'll need no ballot box no more, they'll not even know what the word burgeoise means anymore. The proletariat will rise up and get their revenge on all of the burgeoisie.

Of course we could do it the sneaky peaceful way, but after all we are a revolution, so why not free the world now since we can?! And I was against Trotskly sometime too, but his performance speaks for itself. He probably even outperformed Lenin and Marx. So all the hate is just jealousy comrades, and jealousy is something reactionary. Do not throw yourselves into the path of history, or history will roll over you!

 

[Vivern]

Realistic is generally not the first adjective I would use in describing forcing the entire world to peacefully co-exist at the point of a gun. Do you really think that when the capitalists are conquered the state will cease to exist? How long would they stay conquered without an occupying army? How do you expect such thoroughly capitalist societies to integrate into the Comitern without the VSVR telling them so?

Conquer the world by force and it will take more then a millennium for a stateless society to emerge. We must allow communism to emerge in a form natural to every state. In Germany, that was at the hands of the proletariat. In Russia, it was the hands of the peasant. And in the US and the UK it is the ballot box.

We can bury the US and the UK beneath our economic might, comrades and make them see the error of their ways so that they will embrace communism. But if we conquer them we can force them to be marxists but they will never become communists.

Will overthrown their regimes and re-educate people, without lies that tell them capital, they will embrace ideas of socialism, if will let this imperialist predators to exist they will do anything to destroy us.
There is another opportunity, if eastern empires will fall to revolution, capitalistic world, will become too small, their capitalism just die without the ability to exploit uncivilized countries, also we must stimulate riots and unrest in colonies.

 

[keynes2.0]

Ach, youre overstimating the situation. Once the white house is on fire they'll need no ballot box no more, they'll not even know what the word burgeoise means anymore. The proletariat will rise up and get their revenge on all of the burgeoisie.

You sir, are living in a fantasy world. You speak as if life is just some grand narrative that some benign author ordains to proceed incrementally towards a satisfactory conclusion. You completely ignore how human nature actually works. Your belief in a grand narrative is as pathetic as those who believed that god ordained the kings of old.

((Let me just lean this up on the rooms forth wall...))

 

[Barón Rojo]

Ok, but even if China turn communist the Anglos still have India and with India a big colonial market and resource of manpower (in this game). We all know that any revolution in India will be shamefully crushed under the might of the british army, so, Is not this the time to spread the revolution through India in the only manner possible? With India (and later China) in our side the world will enter in a post-scarcity phase and cheap, even luxury, goods will fill the houses of the proles of the Earth. This is not time for fluffy pacifism comrades! Even without the "orders" of the bourgeoisified leadership! We don't need the permission of these bureaucrats! To the arms comrades!

 

[KomodoWaran]

National Communists

 

[Vivern]

Ok, but even if China turn communist the Anglos still have India and with India a big colonial market and resource of manpower (in this game). We all know that any revolution in India will be shamefully crushed under the might of the british army, so, Is not this the time to spread the revolution through India in the only manner possible? With India (and later China) in our side the world will enter in a post-scarcity phase and cheap, even luxury, goods will fill the houses of the proles of the Earth. This is not time for fluffy pacifism comrades! Even without the "orders" of the bourgeoisified leadership! We don't need the permission of these bureaucrats! To the arms comrades!

Indeed comrade)))

 

[Serpent]

Marxist

For the Comintern
For the welfare of the people
For a rational economy
For the unity of all mankind

Against foreign and domestic passivity
Against appeasment with the capitalists
Against reviving the medieval guilds
Against separatism and racism

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edit1:

I place my vote for Drexler's Very Merry Band of Drunken German Dwarves.

Ooc:
Ic

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edit2:
And Zimmerwald really deserves a prominent position in the party. Very nice articles.