-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Hmm, depending on how quickly the US has industrialised since 1926, a third place finish could be on the cards.
Are you a little worried that the UK might launch a containment war?
Are you a little worried that the UK might launch a containment war?
Ren,
1. Are you putting some of these goods production pictures together through an extensive cut and paste of several screens?
2. Can we see a world map? I'd love to see where Siam's borders run now.
3. Ditto to Dewirix, are you not a little frightened of facing the UK in a war of containment? You've probably exceeded the threshold in several games so you know better than most, what will it take to make them step in? In my Spain game I'm in a similar situation to you. #5 power with #2 military score. I'm not sure the UK would declare containment on me but I don't want to chance it.
1. Are you putting some of these goods production pictures together through an extensive cut and paste of several screens?
2. Can we see a world map? I'd love to see where Siam's borders run now.
3. Ditto to Dewirix, are you not a little frightened of facing the UK in a war of containment? You've probably exceeded the threshold in several games so you know better than most, what will it take to make them step in? In my Spain game I'm in a similar situation to you. #5 power with #2 military score. I'm not sure the UK would declare containment on me but I don't want to chance it.
It's not actually that hard to beat the UK if you stay defensive (and before bolt-action rifles comes online). After Machine Guns, defense gets like a +8 advantage, even more with terrain or rivers. I actually managed to win a defensive war Austria + UK as Serbia with 4 states. And I don't mean just white peace - I claimed a war goal by getting to 25 war score via battles.
Rensslaer,
After lurking for quite some time, I have to applaud you on your inspiring accomplishments from such humble beginnings. Seeing what experts as yourself can do with the underdogs really puts in perspective all the options available.
Here's hoping you can take one more big step up in the world's eyes in the last few years!
After lurking for quite some time, I have to applaud you on your inspiring accomplishments from such humble beginnings. Seeing what experts as yourself can do with the underdogs really puts in perspective all the options available.
Here's hoping you can take one more big step up in the world's eyes in the last few years!
I was wondering about that seemingly random bit of gibberish at the top.Good luck with all those chores and may your lasagna turn out tasty! See you around some time during the weekend!
As it turns out, the lasagna and salad were intended for a teachers' lunch at my kids' school, so I didn't get to taste any of it. Unless it's gluten free, lasagna is vorboten for me unless I'm not being diet-obedient that day. That said, I had an incredible gluten free spaghetti and meatballs last night at a restaurant -- most excellent!
Well, as you know if you've continued reading, the truce was pretty much over anyway. Onward!
Welcome to my AAR, Geiseric!It was a gift from the Sardinians, whom we are courting!
I think I mentioned somewhere (I must have, as someone commented on it) that my Badboy/Infamy was around 100. Actually, having just looked it up, my Infamy in Jan 1930 (after my 2nd war aim against Turkey) stood at 48. So I was exaggerating, quite a bit. That's just under twice my threshold, and there are those who say (and to the best of my knowledge they're right) the real Badboy wars don't start until after you're more than twice past your threshold. So I'm reasonably safe, though that war with France on the heels of my earlier war with the Ottomans was surely a Badboy war. In answer to your further question, I've found that once you are very powerful, most countries will shy away from declaring war on you even if you're a Badboy. Obviously, this did not stop France, and they are not as powerful as the United Kingdom, so... I do still live in fear, or at least great respect!
No! Are you kidding!
I have 3 other AARs to finish! Besides, I think the Victoria engine starts losing its ability to realistically represent military technology advances increasingly from 1920 or so (which is why the old V1 game ended at 1920).Thanks! I'm sure there's a dynamic in every game where the different powers achieve what the game environment and outside pressures allow them to achieve. I suspect other games would see the development of Radios sooner, but there have been some major wars which may have contributed to a focus of tech research in other areas.
Indeed!
The Turkish/Siamese problems are going to make the Greek/Turkish problems seem minute by comparison
Yeah, no kidding! The invaders from the east. No... the REAL East!
I did a paper on the Greek/Turkish conflict in college -- interesting subject.Welcome, s1234567890m! There's more to come, indeed. Thank you! Glad you're looking forward to it!
Well, as it turns out, it didn't!
I was mistaken. The actual total in Jan 1930 was 48.Thanks! You know, I normally make a big deal about that, but have been too busy. I'll mention something at the end, here...
Indeed! Going to try for that. Umm... Yes! Definitely worried about the UK and containment. But we'll see!
Ahh, yes... A little overstated on my part, I'm afraid. Turns out it's only 48, now that I look at a savegame. I could easily have made it 100 by going after more war aims, but that would have prolonged the war, interminably. I think it shall work out better as it is now.
Yes, the production totals were pieced together through an agonizing process using about 50 screenshots!
Took a while, but I wanted to do it just that once, and so I made the screenshots long ago, and did my duty as an authAAR by painstakingly assembling it. You're right about containment wars. As I told Dewirix, it's a risk, but as you note, I'm kind of in a habit of surpassing the Badboy limits. By the time I do so, I'm usually powerful enough to hold my own against whoever might challenge me. Now, if this were v1.2 or v1.3, it might be different, as I understand there's more chance of countries joining forces to hit a Badboy when he's down. A war against, say, Britain and France or France and Russia would be quite a different, more worrying thing!You asked for screenshots of the world, so I've looked up one from June 1930 (don't think this is giving anything away). I didn't realize the USA had taken part of Alaska. That's by event, I'm sure -- they haven't fought a war with Russia. You can see the enlarged Peru.
British holdings in Africa are limited to South Africa here, but they make up for their lack of expansion in Africa with their incredible gains in Asia. North of South Africa, it's mostly France, Siam and the Turks. The Ottomans are still pretty massive, to look at them. Persia improves their look alot. Still a small Germany, of course. Austria remains.
Note that all the blue, and pretty much all the brown countries here are in our Sphere (Spain still controls the Philippines). There are alot of blue spots out in the Pacific Ocean (visible in both this shot and the Americas shot). With the exception of a few black spots which remain uncolonized, and the Hawaiian Islands, which are the USA's, most of the Pacific has been colonized by Siam.
Glad you're still around, Quetzilla! Yes, as Naggy has shown against France and Brandenburg (I think) has shown as Bukhara against China, there are ways to use the terrain and defensive values to your advantage and win even the most lopsided wars. Frankly, I hope I never get a chance to prove that statement.
Thank you, O'Daly! Welcome! I'm hoping to make that jump too. Frankly, I never expected to succeed like this. I figured I'd be a great power, and hold a regional hegemony in Asia, but I never figured I'd be zipping about the Mediterranean or colonizing Africa.
Thanks again, everybody for your comments, and your readership! Yes, I've passed that 100,000 views milestone! I appreciate your compliments, but that is a testament to your dedication that I've surpassed it, and I really value that. I've been known to write AARs I never expected anybody to read, but it's certainly more validating to have people really want to read! Thank you, to everybody!
This AAR is due up next for an update. Hopefully tomorrow. I've been busy and a little under the weather, but surely I'll be able to do this tomorrow if my brain doesn't fail me.
Rensslaer
Just caught up -- frankly, I'm amazed at what some people can do with relatively minor nations. Can't wait for the thrilling conclusion!
Great Power Siam?
Just caught up after a few days and nights of reading.
I'm learning quite a lot from this AAR. Frankly, I didn't expect you to succeed like this either! I wasn't sure you'd even reach GP, let alone win wars against France and the OE.
With that said, I'm trying to ascertain how you made it this far. I'm using as my basis of comparison my very first V2 game, as the Philippines. Siam and the Philippines are in relatively similar positions at the start of the game (assuming independent Philippines), so it's a fairly reasonable comparison. Sorry, but this is going to be a pretty long post.o
In my game, it's already 1934. The Philippines' world ranking is #10, which exceeds my wildest expectations, but is a far cry from your standing. Now I'm trying to figure out why.
I think the version has a lot to do with it, plus the fact that the world situation in my game is vastly different from yours. I'm playing 1.2, and there seem to be a lot of changes. For one thing, industry score counts for more. My total score is around 300-1200-300, so most of it comes from industry.
It doesn't help that the world economy is screwed up in my game. Only a few products are still in high demand, and most products are being produced far in excess of demand (as in supply is several times higher than demand). I blame the UK for this, and you'll see why soon.
Also, the GPs in my game are more powerful than the GPs in yours. You mentioned earlier that even Modena could become a GP, which partly explains how you got in so easily.
No such luck in my game. To illustrate: the #1 power, the UK, has an industry score of around 16000. And they have around 6000 brigades. No joke.
Lastly, there's that little part about you modding Korean and Japanese provinces to become home states. I don't know if it's because 1.1 is different, but I was able to convert Brunei, Madagascar, and Johore into Philippine home states just by encouraging Filipinos to migrate there, and then encouraging bureaucrats afterwards. Most of the time I didn't even have to encourage the migration; they went on their own.
Anyway, I'm still happy with my game. I thought reaching secondary power status was being optimistic already, and I was nowhere near as expansionistic as you have been.
One last thing still bugs me though. Your research points seem to be a little bit too high?
The Philippines starts out as civilized, with a literacy of 10%, and all first-tier techs researched except for Experimental Railroad. In 1934, my literacy rate is around 62%. Plurality is 100% and has been that way for decades. Clergymen are around 2.4% (because Atjeh has very lopsided clergymen percentages). I have already researched every tech in the "Philosophy" category (the one that increases RPs).
And yet, for all that, I get around 40 research points per day, IIRC. Last screenshot I saw, Siam was getting 38/day, and that's with lower clergymen percentages and a literacy rate of less than 40%. Plus you haven't even researched that many philosophy techs IIRC. What gives?
I saw earlier that you're getting a plurality bonus of more than 400%. Are plurality bonuses really supposed to be that high? It doesn't seem that way in my game.
Sorry, I can't access my save file right now, so my RPs/day may be inaccurate. It's what I remember. If anyone can help answer these questions, thanks.
Once again, nice AAR.
Just caught up after a few days and nights of reading.
I'm learning quite a lot from this AAR. Frankly, I didn't expect you to succeed like this either! I wasn't sure you'd even reach GP, let alone win wars against France and the OE.
With that said, I'm trying to ascertain how you made it this far. I'm using as my basis of comparison my very first V2 game, as the Philippines. Siam and the Philippines are in relatively similar positions at the start of the game (assuming independent Philippines), so it's a fairly reasonable comparison. Sorry, but this is going to be a pretty long post.
oIn my game, it's already 1934. The Philippines' world ranking is #10, which exceeds my wildest expectations, but is a far cry from your standing. Now I'm trying to figure out why.
I think the version has a lot to do with it, plus the fact that the world situation in my game is vastly different from yours. I'm playing 1.2, and there seem to be a lot of changes. For one thing, industry score counts for more. My total score is around 300-1200-300, so most of it comes from industry.
It doesn't help that the world economy is screwed up in my game. Only a few products are still in high demand, and most products are being produced far in excess of demand (as in supply is several times higher than demand). I blame the UK for this, and you'll see why soon.
Also, the GPs in my game are more powerful than the GPs in yours. You mentioned earlier that even Modena could become a GP, which partly explains how you got in so easily.
No such luck in my game. To illustrate: the #1 power, the UK, has an industry score of around 16000. And they have around 6000 brigades. No joke.
Lastly, there's that little part about you modding Korean and Japanese provinces to become home states. I don't know if it's because 1.1 is different, but I was able to convert Brunei, Madagascar, and Johore into Philippine home states just by encouraging Filipinos to migrate there, and then encouraging bureaucrats afterwards. Most of the time I didn't even have to encourage the migration; they went on their own.
Anyway, I'm still happy with my game. I thought reaching secondary power status was being optimistic already, and I was nowhere near as expansionistic as you have been.
One last thing still bugs me though. Your research points seem to be a little bit too high?
The Philippines starts out as civilized, with a literacy of 10%, and all first-tier techs researched except for Experimental Railroad. In 1934, my literacy rate is around 62%. Plurality is 100% and has been that way for decades. Clergymen are around 2.4% (because Atjeh has very lopsided clergymen percentages). I have already researched every tech in the "Philosophy" category (the one that increases RPs).
And yet, for all that, I get around 40 research points per day, IIRC. Last screenshot I saw, Siam was getting 38/day, and that's with lower clergymen percentages and a literacy rate of less than 40%. Plus you haven't even researched that many philosophy techs IIRC. What gives?
I saw earlier that you're getting a plurality bonus of more than 400%. Are plurality bonuses really supposed to be that high? It doesn't seem that way in my game.
Sorry, I can't access my save file right now, so my RPs/day may be inaccurate. It's what I remember. If anyone can help answer these questions, thanks.
Once again, nice AAR.
Last edited:
Back when I was in college, I would cruise around and hit up different churches on Sundays, and was amused to see a sign in a Catholic church noting they had "gluten free Hosts".
Before I begin, I want to make sure you don’t miss the world map shots I included in my last set of feedback. Just go back a few posts.
Early in 1930, Turkey experienced a pretty widespread rebellion, which happened to catch MY forces more off guard than theirs, since half of the Ottoman Empire was already under occupation by us.
So for the most part this is a nuisance attack against my occupation armies. But in one case – in the Balkans – it temporarily prevents a large Turkish army from marching to attack me.
There were several major battles that continued for months during this war. One was at Kutahya, in western Anatolia, just west of Ankara. The biggest Turkish army had fixed upon my siege force there, and they ended up causing us some hurt because of good die rolls. Obviously, it’s possible for the Ottomans to get the advantage on us if they have good luck. Not otherwise.
That defensive army of mine is still sitting in Izmir. My hope was that the Turks in Uskudar would march forth and attack my +3 Defense general, but they haven’t so far. About time for a different tactic there.
Another couple major battles are in eastern Anatolia, at Malatya and Urfa. We won Urfa in March 1930, destroying nearly 4 times our number of casualties in a relatively equally matched battle.
In Macedonia, we’re fighting the main remaining Greek army, and they’re taking heavy casualties. That’s 157 killed of theirs vs. 4 of ours in the screenshot, if you can’t read it very well. I may just be imagining this, but my screenshots seemed clearer in the past. Don’t know if it’s Photobucket or my MS Paint program that has ceased to perform adequately.
At the end of March, I finally win the siege at Izmir (not shown) and place Gen. Suriyawangse in charge of the army. With +2 attack (vs. the -2 attack of the defensive general), he now begins to march on Uskadar, just as another army begins landing at Istanbul by sea.
As you can see, that Macedonian battle ended as a significant Siamese victory (9,000 enemy dead, and nearly +2 to Warscore). We’ve begun occupying several new provinces. And we’ve improved our Army Tactics, which should shield us from so many casualties from now into the future. The rest of western Anatolia is mostly under siege by us, as we try to secure these areas.
Having achieved a military technology advance, we turn again to our economy. If we’re to really earn another rank in the Great Power race, we’re going to have to improve our Industry rating. And what better way to do that than by increasing our output from both Factories and Farms by 10%? The Combustion Engine will be our newest task. I’m sure others have achieved this already. In fact, I can tell you for true that the USA and France have – among, perhaps, others – because they’re already producing autos and aeroplanes.
After a long stern chase, fending off many “boarders”, we finally bring the Two Sicilies into our Sphere of Influence! We’ve fought off both the US and UK from China, too – they were trying to play in our backyard, and we chose not to let them. We haven’t yet climbed on the back of the dragon once more, but so long as we can keep all these rivals out, we still have a chance before 1936. We’re having to play the same Diplomatic game in the Netherlands, which everybody wants to take from us.
And remember that major battle in Malatya, northeast from our current holdings in Turkey/Anatolia? As of May, 1930, we have achieved enough Warscore (+13 now), along with the promise of much, much more, that we add a third Wargoal to our aggressive revenge-fight.
I’ve been neglecting to show you the Persian front, as it’s a scattered conflict with fewer major battles. But the Turks had one major army out that way, and they managed to cause us a defeat because of bad odds. We’ll be back. But to make up for it, we’ve taken twice our number of Turks with us out of the Battle of Katahya, in the west. Now that army is free to either assist other siege forces in the Aegean area, or to march north across the Bosporous into mainland Europe to continue the fight there…
…because it’s there – in the Bulgaria, Macedonia area – where many of the remaining large Ottoman armies are. At Plovda we’ve got a huge battle going on, with many casualties on both sides. But we’re getting about 4:1 results there – that screenshot is showing 340 Turkish fallen per day versus 78 Siamese.
Meanwhile, the war is going SO well -- at 28% Warscore now – by early June, that we add a FOURTH Wargoal. We shall seek to take Mosul, in northern Iraq, from the Turks. This would further connect our lands in the south – Palestine – with those in Turkey proper.
I apologize for the agglomeration nightmare in that screenshot. The Battle of Lamia, in Greece/Macedonia, shows another 5,000 dead enemy. We’ve allied, now, with the Sicilians who own Syria (as well as Sicily and southern Italy). And we’re continuing to make major progress. Which is why we laugh at the Greeks when they offer us peace.
Not a serious attempt at peace, but here you can see the relative Warscore to our current demands. As we capture territory that we’re asking for, the Warscore “cost” of those lands reduces. For instance, Rutbah might have been 15 Warscore cost at the beginning of the conflict, but now that we occupy some of their provinces it’s gone down to 10 because it’s more “realistic” for us to ask for land that we’ve already successfully secured. Malatya, which is more valuable, is not yet in our hands, and so it is more costly. But eventually our growing Warscore will converge with the reducing cost, and we’ll be able to make our demands stick.
Over in Bosnia, that large Turkish army has finally found us at Pljevlja, after both they and we dealt with those pesky rebels. This will also turn out to be one of the major battles of the war, causing modern history lecturers the world over consternation in trying to pronounce the name Pljevlja, or at least derive a standard mispronounciation that most professors can agree upon.
By July, we have little else to do but load thumb-twiddling armies onto transports and bringing them to the remote vacationlands of the Black Sea coast to clash with Serbian troops over Romanian lands under Turkish rule. With us using gas in the defensive conflict, with well-entrenched positions, our outnumbered invaders will turn this into a long, long battle.
Another +2 to Warscore from July’s Battle of Uskudar, across the strait from the Turkish capital. Then another +3 from an August victory in Bosnia, at Pljevlja. Then another +1.3 at Trikkala – a second major battle there, this time against a Turkish army, rather than the Greeks.
Most of Greece is under our control, now. And much of the rest of the Balkans and Turkey itself is under some degree of occupation. That battle at Plovda continues in epic proportions, with serious casualties weighted against the Turks.
As 1930 drifts into Autumn, we’re very confident of victory, and wondering when it can be achieved so that we can make peace and begin working the economic angle to turning these conquered lands to Siamese purposes.
Early in 1930, Turkey experienced a pretty widespread rebellion, which happened to catch MY forces more off guard than theirs, since half of the Ottoman Empire was already under occupation by us.
So for the most part this is a nuisance attack against my occupation armies. But in one case – in the Balkans – it temporarily prevents a large Turkish army from marching to attack me.
There were several major battles that continued for months during this war. One was at Kutahya, in western Anatolia, just west of Ankara. The biggest Turkish army had fixed upon my siege force there, and they ended up causing us some hurt because of good die rolls. Obviously, it’s possible for the Ottomans to get the advantage on us if they have good luck. Not otherwise.
That defensive army of mine is still sitting in Izmir. My hope was that the Turks in Uskudar would march forth and attack my +3 Defense general, but they haven’t so far. About time for a different tactic there.
Another couple major battles are in eastern Anatolia, at Malatya and Urfa. We won Urfa in March 1930, destroying nearly 4 times our number of casualties in a relatively equally matched battle.
In Macedonia, we’re fighting the main remaining Greek army, and they’re taking heavy casualties. That’s 157 killed of theirs vs. 4 of ours in the screenshot, if you can’t read it very well. I may just be imagining this, but my screenshots seemed clearer in the past. Don’t know if it’s Photobucket or my MS Paint program that has ceased to perform adequately.
At the end of March, I finally win the siege at Izmir (not shown) and place Gen. Suriyawangse in charge of the army. With +2 attack (vs. the -2 attack of the defensive general), he now begins to march on Uskadar, just as another army begins landing at Istanbul by sea.
As you can see, that Macedonian battle ended as a significant Siamese victory (9,000 enemy dead, and nearly +2 to Warscore). We’ve begun occupying several new provinces. And we’ve improved our Army Tactics, which should shield us from so many casualties from now into the future. The rest of western Anatolia is mostly under siege by us, as we try to secure these areas.
Having achieved a military technology advance, we turn again to our economy. If we’re to really earn another rank in the Great Power race, we’re going to have to improve our Industry rating. And what better way to do that than by increasing our output from both Factories and Farms by 10%? The Combustion Engine will be our newest task. I’m sure others have achieved this already. In fact, I can tell you for true that the USA and France have – among, perhaps, others – because they’re already producing autos and aeroplanes.
After a long stern chase, fending off many “boarders”, we finally bring the Two Sicilies into our Sphere of Influence! We’ve fought off both the US and UK from China, too – they were trying to play in our backyard, and we chose not to let them. We haven’t yet climbed on the back of the dragon once more, but so long as we can keep all these rivals out, we still have a chance before 1936. We’re having to play the same Diplomatic game in the Netherlands, which everybody wants to take from us.
And remember that major battle in Malatya, northeast from our current holdings in Turkey/Anatolia? As of May, 1930, we have achieved enough Warscore (+13 now), along with the promise of much, much more, that we add a third Wargoal to our aggressive revenge-fight.
I’ve been neglecting to show you the Persian front, as it’s a scattered conflict with fewer major battles. But the Turks had one major army out that way, and they managed to cause us a defeat because of bad odds. We’ll be back. But to make up for it, we’ve taken twice our number of Turks with us out of the Battle of Katahya, in the west. Now that army is free to either assist other siege forces in the Aegean area, or to march north across the Bosporous into mainland Europe to continue the fight there…
…because it’s there – in the Bulgaria, Macedonia area – where many of the remaining large Ottoman armies are. At Plovda we’ve got a huge battle going on, with many casualties on both sides. But we’re getting about 4:1 results there – that screenshot is showing 340 Turkish fallen per day versus 78 Siamese.
Meanwhile, the war is going SO well -- at 28% Warscore now – by early June, that we add a FOURTH Wargoal. We shall seek to take Mosul, in northern Iraq, from the Turks. This would further connect our lands in the south – Palestine – with those in Turkey proper.
I apologize for the agglomeration nightmare in that screenshot. The Battle of Lamia, in Greece/Macedonia, shows another 5,000 dead enemy. We’ve allied, now, with the Sicilians who own Syria (as well as Sicily and southern Italy). And we’re continuing to make major progress. Which is why we laugh at the Greeks when they offer us peace.
Not a serious attempt at peace, but here you can see the relative Warscore to our current demands. As we capture territory that we’re asking for, the Warscore “cost” of those lands reduces. For instance, Rutbah might have been 15 Warscore cost at the beginning of the conflict, but now that we occupy some of their provinces it’s gone down to 10 because it’s more “realistic” for us to ask for land that we’ve already successfully secured. Malatya, which is more valuable, is not yet in our hands, and so it is more costly. But eventually our growing Warscore will converge with the reducing cost, and we’ll be able to make our demands stick.
Over in Bosnia, that large Turkish army has finally found us at Pljevlja, after both they and we dealt with those pesky rebels. This will also turn out to be one of the major battles of the war, causing modern history lecturers the world over consternation in trying to pronounce the name Pljevlja, or at least derive a standard mispronounciation that most professors can agree upon.
By July, we have little else to do but load thumb-twiddling armies onto transports and bringing them to the remote vacationlands of the Black Sea coast to clash with Serbian troops over Romanian lands under Turkish rule. With us using gas in the defensive conflict, with well-entrenched positions, our outnumbered invaders will turn this into a long, long battle.
Another +2 to Warscore from July’s Battle of Uskudar, across the strait from the Turkish capital. Then another +3 from an August victory in Bosnia, at Pljevlja. Then another +1.3 at Trikkala – a second major battle there, this time against a Turkish army, rather than the Greeks.
Most of Greece is under our control, now. And much of the rest of the Balkans and Turkey itself is under some degree of occupation. That battle at Plovda continues in epic proportions, with serious casualties weighted against the Turks.
As 1930 drifts into Autumn, we’re very confident of victory, and wondering when it can be achieved so that we can make peace and begin working the economic angle to turning these conquered lands to Siamese purposes.
Ottomans are not the sick man of Europe, but rather the sick and beaten man of Asia.
This has turned into a rather easy war for you, but to paraphrase the cliche, can you win the peace?
By the way, is Serbia communist or socialist? There appears to be a red star on their flag...
By the way, is Serbia communist or socialist? There appears to be a red star on their flag...
It was at this point last war with the Ottos that the French stepped in. That sort of thing can be habit forming. I'm expecting them to try their hand at containing Siam, again.
I also hope the Ottomans don't pull in one of their stooges, like France, but victory shall prevail.
Awesome AAR. I need to play Vic 2, but I need a better computer.
Rensslaer, keep the good work against the Ottomans.
Rensslaer, keep the good work against the Ottomans.