Early game factories vs artisans

[luke5589]

So I’m fairly new to Vicky 2. I only have about 30 hours in it. I understand the general concepts of the game and understand it enough to play it, but I don’t seem to understand economy and industrialization enough. Also, I am playing with both of the expansions.

I’ve been doing a lot of reading and research and have read that it’s far better not to build factories early game ( early game is 1836-1860ish...I think) and focus on increasing RGO output. Is this correct?

My question is, how can this be done, when the capitalist build factories themselves from the second I start the game. Even if I don’t build any, by the time 1860 comes my capitalists have built like 30-40ish factories on their own (most of them being useless ones). My economy seems to do great the first 20-30 years, and when I hit the 70s-80s my income starts going in the negatives hard, and can’t seem to get out of it. I’ve been playing Prussia and forming the NGF around 1840, and super Germany by around 1850 if anyone is wondering.

Also, if factories early game is bad, why are there so many damn craftsmen early game??

I apolgize if I sound very uneducated on this topic, but industrialization and economy are what I’m struggling to understand, and I’ve watched/read just about every guide and tutorial.

So if anyone wants to give some early game tips on Atrisans, capitalists, RGOs, factories, economy, etc thatvwould be great.

 

[DerGrößteRitter]

You should check if your factories are subsidized. I believe that when a factory is built, by default it is subsidized. You should uncheck unprofitable factories, as they are acting as drains on your treasury.

 

[grimkm]

Improving factory efficiency through tech, input/output/throughput is key, and building railroads. If playing with a high lit. country like Prussia, I can't see why you wouldn't want to industrialise early on.

Depending on the economic policy you have LF/SC/PE/Int, you can influence what factories or production lines each state has. You get a boost from having the RGO required i.e wheat for booze, cotton for fabrics, coal for cement, etc. But as a rule of thumb, see what your artisans are making and start building factories accordingly. Booze is always a good starter, so is furniture and a bit of wine. Cement is useful, especially if you're a big economy with loads of states, but not so crucial if you're a small country. Early on, a lumber mill and machine parts are good too as both tend to be in short supply and are crucial to expanding and building naval bases.

But as above, untick unprofitable factories, destroy useless factories proposed by your capitalists. The NF to promote industry can work, but isnt terribly effective I find. But sometimes keeping unprofitable factories going whilst you build new ones to grow your factory worker pops. Some factories do become profitable over time. When choosing them if you can build them yourself, check the output number. If its red, it will be unprofitable.

 

[Nuklearius]

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[grimkm]

There is no clear answer on this, it depends on the country and its situation. UK can start spamming factories and encourage craftsmen endlessly because they got India so they never overproduce and always have enough raw ressources. With a low pop country like Sweden I wouldn't do that until you got colonies.

I regularly play Schweden and start building factories in the two most populous states from the get go. The low pop is a massive hindrance for any truly crushing industrial supremacy, but with a population starting at 90% literacy, you can get clerks from the start. You also blast through tech research. Also, if not a GP and in the sphere of Russia..you got raw materials flooding the market. Easy way to get ahead early on. But a very good point on pop growth.

 

[Challenge]

I think two of the major concerns for building industry early are literacy and resource production. Without literacy you don't get the craftsmen needed to work the factories and without resources you are at the mercy of the market system for raw materials, so you need both developed. Generally this is why a lot of the advice is centered around waiting to build your industry.

You improve literacy by focusing on increasing the number of Clergy and techs from the Culture/Social Thought branch. You can increase RGO output with railroads and techs from the Industry category. You also get resources from your Sphered nations and they are the first to buy your industry output. The more diverse the RGO variety in your Sphere, the less time you have to wait before you start building the factories. And don't bother subsidizing factories built by the Capitalist early unless you need them to support your military or infrastructure improvements.

 

[Kovax]

Having a few factories early helps build up a supply of Craftsmen for later when your techs make industrialization far more efficient. As said, depending on your form of government, subsidizing or not subsidizing various factories can allow you some choice of what remains, even if you can't choose what gets built.

Note that factories such as cement, cloth, steel, and lumber are essential to insure a source of raw materials for further industrialization, but cement in particular will become uncompetitive at various times, so you don't want more than one or two factories to produce it. Some factories are late bloomers, such as Canned Food, which will often struggle just to break even in the early years, but once the lower classes begin to develop a need for it, they'll want and buy a lot of it. Your troops need it, so you'll want at least one factory running even when it's losing money.

Liquor is almost a guaranteed seller. Military goods are something you want to have at least one of, but they won't make much money in peacetime. Like cement, they're profitable at times, but at other times they lose money and need to be subsidized. Furniture and clothing, and their luxury equivalents, are generally good sellers.

 

[fr-rein]

First of all, this rule barely applies to major nations. Prussia, having key resources and literate population (and tech as a result) is an early competitor.

The advice is meant for most nations, for example like Serbia, which usually have these issues:

• Very low literacy
• Small population
• Lack of resources (especially coal, but you could be unlucky enough to have no grain to make booze)
• Getting sphered may make your industry a prey for majors
• Lack of finances to build/sustain industry (especially as very small nations)

In short, first years you must prepare a fundament for your industrialization. Since you can't compete in early game, you should wait until the techs from 50-60s actually affect RGOs and resources supply dramatically increases - especially some crucial for smaller states, like wood, cotton, grain, coal.
Midgame is the key time to snatch yourself a slice of industry pie and actively grow to increase your weight in world.

For example, Serbia is rarely that good at early industry. And in fact, last time I played I invested it all into crisises, annexing Montenegro, fighting Ottomans when they were beaten by wars and/or revolutions - and if your game goes well enough, you can expand Serbia to have coast, take most of native cores and get Bosnia, which makes you a decent enough country in 60s to industrialize.

 

[Caewil]

Yeah as Prussia go ahead and industrialize early. You have no reason not to.

As Prussia I swap to state capitalism for the first few years to manually plan industries so they gain the synergy bonus eg build steel in coal and iron producing states, then get some machine tools there as well.

Tech a bit, get efficiency techs and then swap to LF later on. Since you picked profitable factories from the beginning instead of letting the ai scattershot them, they should do fine without subsidies.

As Prussia you’re all set up to go turbo even from the beginning.

Edit: As Prussia and later Germany, you should be planning on becoming world industrial hegemon. Plan for the late game economic crash and save capitalism from itself: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/late-game-economic-crash.789259/