Arc Welders should have its own unique starting system

  • We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Nyaruko

Captain
76 Badges
Feb 20, 2019
454
884
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron 4: Arms Against Tyranny
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Prison Architect
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
Despite the origin desc claim their system was rich, But actually poor than solar system. Most random start will give you a system less than 20 objects, While solar system will guarantee you have 25 objects.
We should expect a richer system than our solar system in origin description. But result was, Picking solar system will always better than randomly generated one.
1715308775834.png


1715308810881.png


1715308858157.png


Random vs Solar System, Obviously solar system far richer.
 
  • 1
  • 1Like
Reactions:
The two systems have a difference of 3 minerals (27 vs 30).

Do not be fooled by the abundance of 1's, most of which are sure to exist because of the Arc Furnace. Not counting the 1s, the two systems have 19 vs 16--another difference of 3, this time in favor of the random system.

Not counting the +25% output from the presence of the furnace, you'd be getting 14 vs 12. Which is kind of on-par with what you get in a regular system.

I guess by 'bounty of riches' they forgot to mention that said bounty only exists because of the furnace?
 
  • 1
  • 1Like
Reactions:
Do not be fooled by the abundance of 1's, most of which are sure to exist because of the Arc Furnace. Not counting the 1s, the two systems have 19 vs 16--another difference of 3, this time in favor of the random system.
Only object quantity matters. Fully upgraded furnace provide 8 mineral 4 alloy per object, Regardless initial output of objects, 25 objects means 200 minerals, 15 means 120 minerals. Also, Even without any upgrades, It's 27 vs 41. You may start a game and check it. It's my fault that moon and many objects were not shown.

Starting minerals means nothing because you are supposed to upgrade it asap, You want a system with many objects, Not a system with less objects but more(probably just 3) resources.

In case many haven't tested in gameplay, Here is simple proof why solar system is far superior:



Screenshot 2024-05-10 113629.png
1715312311095.png
 
Last edited:
  • 1
Reactions:
Apologize, I haven't written any detail yet, Here's detailed comparison with data:

1715314047301.png


This is solar system, without any techs and upgrades. Guaranteed 40 minerals, Later upgrades will double it.

1715314090932.png


This is random system. Depend on luck but usually less than solar system.

1715314163498.png


This is hidden effect of origin: Guaranteed 'profitable' system. Regardless retry attempts, And your starting system setting, This system will always spawn near your home.

This origin is fully capable to have zero miners all the game so you are supposed to maximize your profit, make sure select system with ~20 objects, Don't be fooled by initial output. A system with 12 inital minerals but with 10 objects just worse than 3 minerals system with 20 objects, If you plan to build and upgrade your Arc Welders.
 
Last edited:
  • 1
Reactions:
I tried counting it out and the best random system is probably Random Unary 1, which gives 7-26 mineable planetary bodies for Arc Furnace deposits. Random Binary 1 has a higher minimum of 9, but a much lower maximum of 20. Systems with more stars have a better chance to save a planet or two by rolling their research deposits there where they won't block an Arc Furnace mining deposit, but none of them have enough possible bodies to compete with Unary 1 (which is the only random option that can get more than 20). Random Binary 2 is the worst Arc Welders system, with only 5-14 mineable planetary bodies.

Sol system gives 22 by my count, though that'll drop to 21 after you terraform Mars. On average it should be the best choice.
 
  • 2
  • 1Like
Reactions:
I tried counting it out and the best random system is probably Random Unary 1, which gives 7-26 mineable planetary bodies for Arc Furnace deposits. Random Binary 1 has a higher minimum of 9, but a much lower maximum of 20. Systems with more stars have a better chance to save a planet or two by rolling their research deposits there where they won't block an Arc Furnace mining deposit, but none of them have enough possible bodies to compete with Unary 1 (which is the only random option that can get more than 20). Random Binary 2 is the worst Arc Welders system, with only 5-14 mineable planetary bodies.

Sol system gives 22 by my count, though that'll drop to 21 after you terraform Mars. On average it should be the best choice.
Paradox may need force the home system spawn 20+ mineables, Otherwise, the average object of random start will around 15, Even with best random system.
Usually home system won't affect your economy much but Arc Welders is exception.