AGCEEP: Byzantine Empire Events Annex

[donm61873]

That's a good catch. I think I'm close to another update, perhaps this weekend.

 

[Duque de Bragança]

You have to unzip the content of Byzantium_Triumphant folder (Fantasy folder + Byzantium_Triumphant.eug file) into AGCEEP/Scenarios folder, not Byzantium_Triumphant folder itself.

Does not work for me (crash at the end of loading).
I'm on a Mac so the whole thing is pickier. Is the previous Fantasy Byzantium needed ? I removed it.

 

[unmerged(40707)]

@DuquedeBraganca: check your PM box.

EDIT: Fantasy Triumphant scenario and Fantasy Byzantium one are independent.

 

[Aigle Noir]

I think I've found another problem, with event 3001361.

In the Vassalization events sequence (3001360 to 3001383...), the structure of events is quite similar :
- a first event occurs if the country is not at war, AND if it is vassal of another country (ex : 3001365, 3001370, ...).
- a second event occurs if the country is at war, AND if it is NOT vassal (and/or allied) of another country.

But for event 3001361 (Georgia's second event), it occurs if Georgia is at war AND if it is vassal of another country...

I think correct scripting should be :
trigger = {atwar = yes
NOT = { event = 3001360 ##and not 3001364
war = { country = BYZ country = GEO }
vassal = { country = RUS country = GEO }
vassal = { country = SEV country = GEO }
vassal = { country = TRE country = GEO }
vassal = { country = KAL country = GEO }
vassal = { country = BAE country = GEO }
alliance = { country = RUS country = GEO }
alliance = { country = SEV country = GEO }
alliance = { country = TRE country = GEO }
alliance = { country = KAL country = GEO }
alliance = { country = BAE country = GEO }
alliance = { country = AKK country = GEO }
alliance = { country = TUR country = GEO }
alliance = { country = DUL country = GEO }
alliance = { country = QAR country = GEO }
alliance = { country = IRA country = GEO }
alliance = { country = MAM country = GEO }
alliance = { country = PER country = GEO }
alliance = { country = CAN country = GEO }
alliance = { country = CRI country = GEO }
alliance = { country = KAR country = GEO }
alliance = { country = GEN country = GEO }
alliance = { country = UZB country = GEO }
alliance = { country = MOG country = GEO }
alliance = { country = TIM country = GEO }
alliance = { country = U04 country = GEO }
alliance = { country = ENG country = GEO }
alliance = { country = SPA country = GEO }
alliance = { country = FRA country = GEO }
alliance = { country = MOL country = GEO }
alliance = { country = WAL country = GEO }
alliance = { country = ALB country = GEO }
alliance = { country = ARA country = GEO }
}
}

 

[Aigle Noir]

Explorer

A question about event 3001454 : it gives an explorer (1543 -1564) but it occurs in 1562, so we have this explorer only for 2/3 years...

Is is an error or not ?

 

[donm61873]

Yes, those both look like problems to fix. Thanks!

 

[donm61873]

It's been a month of "reality", and November and December look busy as well...

Might try to slide an update with the fixes in though...

 

[Aegisthus]

Great work. It's nice to see people are still working on Byzantium mods. I won't play it since I can't stand going back to the Vanilla map. I really hope that new AGCEEP map will come out soon.

Scanning through the event files I'm happy to see many of the old, extended expansion events are there. Nice to see.

Personnally there's a couple of events I don't like.
-I feel the diplomatic training pays off events shouldnt be there.
-I don't like the cultural conversion events of Anatolia. I don't mind the greecification of Anatolia but I feel this area should still be a home area for the byzantines. I'd prefer to give the Byzantines Turkish culture at the start of the campaign to reflect their familiarity with this area. From a gameplay point of view I think that having Byzantium conquer territories that are of different religion and the wrong culture impedes their tech development way too much.

I don't know whether this was all said before, since there are so many threads out there. But these were my 0.02$.

Keep up the good work!

 

[unmerged(76802)]

-I don't like the cultural conversion events of Anatolia. I don't mind the greecification of Anatolia but I feel this area should still be a home area for the byzantines. I'd prefer to give the Byzantines Turkish culture at the start of the campaign to reflect their familiarity with this area. From a gameplay point of view I think that having Byzantium conquer territories that are of different religion and the wrong culture impedes their tech development way too much.

What if Byzantium has the option to get Turkish culture after destroying the Ottomans? I agree on the Turkish lands hurting Byzantium's tech and such too much for the early game, especially since you have to take down the Ottos to survive.

 

[Aegisthus]

What if Byzantium has the option to get Turkish culture after destroying the Ottomans? I agree on the Turkish lands hurting Byzantium's tech and such too much for the early game, especially since you have to take down the Ottos to survive.

I don't think that would solve this problem. Turkish as an alien culture and Sunni religion of many provinces results in a big reduction of tax income. Add to this the increased cost of gaining stability, the need to use resources to convert provinces and the events that give stability hits to the Byzantines and you have a nation that will no chance to stay anywhere near the western powers in the tech race.

Please do keep in mind that I'm playing the Mymap version, which means the Ottomans have a lot more provinces and it will take much longer to annihilate them, while the impact of the different culture/religion is bigger. But this problem will be the same for the new AGCEEP map, if that will ever come out.

Don't get me wrong, I think a Byzantine Renovation should be a big uphill struggle. I feel a Byzantine Empire that miraculously survived and prospered under a line of exceptionally strong emperors should have a much more difficult time than the Ottomans Empire did to become a great power. And not just for gameplay Byzantines = player only) or historical reasons (it didn't happen), but also because the Byzantines were just a lot more exacting towards their subjects and much less religiously tolerant.

Now back to my main point why the Byzantines should have Turkish culture at the start of the Grand Campaign.
From what I know about Asia Minor the region has been a ethnic-cultural-religious hodge podge up to modern times. While Sunni Islam may have become the dominant religion in this region and Turkish the lingua franca I believe there remained enough "Greek" people to allow the Byzantines to govern the region.
Also modern Greek and Turkish culture have a lot in common (discounting language and religion). I hope I'm not being naive in assuming that this would have been the same in the EU2 time frame, centuries before the advent of nation states and nationalism.

 

[donm61873]

Interesting. My goal with the annex was to simply port the existing annex to the latest AGCEEP, which has been very successful!

However, I'll admit... I'm waiting for the new map. I'm tired of the vanilla map.

 

[unmerged(40707)]

However, I'll admit... I'm waiting for the new map. I'm tired of the vanilla map.

You can be sure you're not alone...

Is the new scenario complete now? could it be referenced with texts added in text.csv for next AGCEEP version (just like Granada)?

 

[donm61873]

You can be sure you're not alone...

Is the new scenario complete now? could it be referenced with texts added in text.csv for next AGCEEP version (just like Granada)?

I'm in the middle of one thing (commenting the scenarios for easier future modding) and after that will be the text breakout.

I don't think it's ready to be incorporated yet; it needs more testing, particularly in the 1700 period. Perhaps after the first of the year, if I focus...
:rofl:

 

[donm61873]

I've posted Alpha 6, which has all the bugs identified so far and their fixes. It's been tested with both 1.55 and 1.56b1, so there should be no issues.

Now, the next "bugfix" is to insure the rabid antagonism of the muslims if the Byzantines seize Mecca and Medina.

 

[unmerged(76802)]

but also because the Byzantines were just a lot more exacting towards their subjects and much less religiously tolerant.

Rereading, this leaped out at me. Religious tolerance isn't set in stone. Indeed, because the player knows where he's gonna be expanding first (and the most important area to expand in unless he goes Catholic), Islam is gonna get 50% tolerance, and then get more once the Reformation begins.

So, why shouldn't a Byzantium tolerant of Islam easily accept the Turks?

 

[Laur]

Rereading, this leaped out at me. Religious tolerance isn't set in stone. Indeed, because the player knows where he's gonna be expanding first (and the most important area to expand in unless he goes Catholic), Islam is gonna get 50% tolerance, and then get more once the Reformation begins.

So, why shouldn't a Byzantium tolerant of Islam easily accept the Turks?

Toleration is not the same as acceptance; there were many religious or ethnic minorities which were tolerated, though not accepted as true citizens, by the rulers of Medieval and Early Modern Europe.
I haven't played the game (AGCEEP) in a very long time, but I recall that the event that triggers the reclamation of Asia Minor sequence had for choice (a) something along the lines of "as long as the taxes are levyed in those provinces, who cares?" which leaves the Asia Minor provinces with Turkish culture without giving it to Constantinople. It was option (b) that allowed the player the power to change the ethnic make-up of the penninsula, or accept the Turks and gain Turkish culture.

I find that giving the Eastern Roman Empire Turkish culture at the start of the game just because they knew the area, or because the Turks did not completely assimilate the Greek and other populations of Asia Minor strange to say the least. Should, then, Granada start with Castillian, Catalan and Portuguese cultures? Should Poland have German rather than change Danzig, Pommerania, Kustrin and Silesia to Polish? Should Wales have Anglo-saxon?

 

[Underhand]

To get the Pope to move to Avignon correctly you need to rewrite the relevant events so that first the Provence province is given to PAP, then PAP can move its capital to Provence and cede its Italian provinces to BYZ.

 

[donm61873]

I don't want to do that, since eliminating Provence as a country causes other problems in AGCEEP. I'm holding that issue until the new map, hoping that Avignon gets its own space.

 

[unmerged(76802)]

There seems to be a problem with the "Turks demand withdrawal from Hellas" event. I told the Sultan to bugger off, and they selected "We march on Constantinople", but no war occurred.

The problem is Byzantium still grants military access, so the Ottos can't declare war, even if 'forced' to by event.

Edit: Also, maybe add conditions so it doesn't fire if the Byzantines have taken territory from the Turks.

 

[unmerged(40707)]

The problem is Byzantium still grants military access, so the Ottos can't declare war, even if 'forced' to by event.

And military access can't be removed by event... Be aware stab -3 for the wanted attacker also prevents a war from firing by event.