Have you tried upping the manuver of the explorers to 32? That should help i'd think.Toio said:
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I think that should be considered, and I'll test it. Explorers don't suffer from attritions, so higher maneuver will just give a small boost for the chance of exploring land. Once the AI is out it seems very thurough, so I don't think that's needed, since it also make is easier for the player.sturmvogel said:
modified explorer events
I've paired up explorers with sea zones like this:
Gil Eanes Mauretian Coast
Dinis Dias Gorée Island
Alvaro Fernades Coast of Gambia
Alvise Cadamosto Cape Verde
Diogo Gomes Gold Coast
Pedro do Sintra Ivory Coast
I've modified the exploration events to activate only these explorers as well as adding 250 naval for each event. And shortened each explorer to live only 11 months. The earlier ones will likely need to be shortened even more, but this will do for a first test. I'll select the naval manufactory rather than the refinery in 1420 even though I much prefer the latter as a player.
Jason
I've paired up explorers with sea zones like this:
Gil Eanes Mauretian Coast
Dinis Dias Gorée Island
Alvaro Fernades Coast of Gambia
Alvise Cadamosto Cape Verde
Diogo Gomes Gold Coast
Pedro do Sintra Ivory Coast
I've modified the exploration events to activate only these explorers as well as adding 250 naval for each event. And shortened each explorer to live only 11 months. The earlier ones will likely need to be shortened even more, but this will do for a first test. I'll select the naval manufactory rather than the refinery in 1420 even though I much prefer the latter as a player.
Jason
Results
Played through 1470 with the revised explorers in a hard/aggressive game. Deleted the cities in the Azores and Cape Verde and un-discovered the Sea of Azores to show that neither area had any colonists of any sort in 1419.
Concluded the war with Morocco gaining just Tangiers rather than my usual everything but Fez. Sank my money first into Infra 3 to get an FAA and then minted for three years or so to buy it. Then switched everything to naval. Lvl 3 in Jan 1433, 4 in Jul 1445, 5 in Aug 1458, 6 in Jan 1470 and 7 was expected in Jan 85. Considering that the average cost of advance was about 7000 points, giving 250 for each of the 5 Exploration events doesn't seem unreasonable since Naval 9 should be reachable sometime in the late 1490s or 1500s.
As expected Velho discovered the Sea of Azores 5 Apr 1427, which opened it up for colonization which was completed in 1432. Eanes found the Mauretanian Coast in 1434 along with Noukachott. Dias discovered Gorée Island in Jun 1445 and Fernandes found the Coast of Gambia in Jun 1446 as well as Senegal. Senegal became a city in 1452. Cadamasto got to the Cape Verde Islands Jun 1456 although I didn't finish colonizing it before ending the playtest. Gomes reached the Gold Coast in May 1460 finding Casamance and Sintra reached the Ivory Coast in Jun 1461, discovering Leone along the way. Fernando Po found the Gulf of Nigeria in Jun 1469, the Coast of Cameroon in Oct 1469, after resupplying in Senegal and finding Gambia on the way back. He reached Rio Muni in Feb 1470 and would have been able to go further south if I'd continued the game.
I was very lucky discovering land provinces as I found 4 before 1460 which seems high even though I never found Fernando Po. I need to tweak the death dates to an average of 6 months or so although Fernando Po requires a full year to discover his two sea zones. All in all this plays very historically for a human player. I'll have to see how the AI does with this set-up even though I've been careful not to overlap explorers.
Jason
Played through 1470 with the revised explorers in a hard/aggressive game. Deleted the cities in the Azores and Cape Verde and un-discovered the Sea of Azores to show that neither area had any colonists of any sort in 1419.
Concluded the war with Morocco gaining just Tangiers rather than my usual everything but Fez. Sank my money first into Infra 3 to get an FAA and then minted for three years or so to buy it. Then switched everything to naval. Lvl 3 in Jan 1433, 4 in Jul 1445, 5 in Aug 1458, 6 in Jan 1470 and 7 was expected in Jan 85. Considering that the average cost of advance was about 7000 points, giving 250 for each of the 5 Exploration events doesn't seem unreasonable since Naval 9 should be reachable sometime in the late 1490s or 1500s.
As expected Velho discovered the Sea of Azores 5 Apr 1427, which opened it up for colonization which was completed in 1432. Eanes found the Mauretanian Coast in 1434 along with Noukachott. Dias discovered Gorée Island in Jun 1445 and Fernandes found the Coast of Gambia in Jun 1446 as well as Senegal. Senegal became a city in 1452. Cadamasto got to the Cape Verde Islands Jun 1456 although I didn't finish colonizing it before ending the playtest. Gomes reached the Gold Coast in May 1460 finding Casamance and Sintra reached the Ivory Coast in Jun 1461, discovering Leone along the way. Fernando Po found the Gulf of Nigeria in Jun 1469, the Coast of Cameroon in Oct 1469, after resupplying in Senegal and finding Gambia on the way back. He reached Rio Muni in Feb 1470 and would have been able to go further south if I'd continued the game.
I was very lucky discovering land provinces as I found 4 before 1460 which seems high even though I never found Fernando Po. I need to tweak the death dates to an average of 6 months or so although Fernando Po requires a full year to discover his two sea zones. All in all this plays very historically for a human player. I'll have to see how the AI does with this set-up even though I've been careful not to overlap explorers.
Jason
Fernando Po is now grouped in the Cameroon area, along with some provinces that shouldn't be colonised. Wouldn't it be better to group it with the Gold area: (796 Guinea, 795 Leone, 1493 Mossi, 1492 Niani). That would stop Portugal AI from wasting money on the difficult Cameroon continental provinces it shouldn't be colonising anyway.
Norrefeldt,
I really like that idea. Simple, doesn't affect human players, but should resolve a major problem for the AI.
Jason
I really like that idea. Simple, doesn't affect human players, but should resolve a major problem for the AI.
Jason
Norrefeldt said:
Easier is to not give POR the Cameroon area at all (as the original daywalker files) and to hell with people whinning about POR discovering the PO isle.
Toio said:
Well, it is less easy (it costs time to change one word in province.csv) but wouldn't the effort be well worth the histrorical correctness of Portugal colonizing Fernando Po?
I don't see how that would promote historical colonisation. FP is an asset for Portugal, since it's fairly easy to colonise with nice natives.Toio said:
Sao Thome from EP
I've been looking over IDLF's EP mod for anything of use for AGCEEP and have found a couple of events that look to be useful.
I'm a little leery of the refinery being handed out for free, but since it's destroyed later on, it can't be too unbalancing. Plus, since I'm about to write an event reducing the mine in Leone to about a quarter of what it was, the extra revenue will be damn handy to make up for the decrease in gold.
I've been looking over IDLF's EP mod for anything of use for AGCEEP and have found a couple of events that look to be useful.
Code:
event = {
id = 260051
random = no
country = POR
trigger = { owned = { province = 816 data = -1 } control = { province = 816 data = -1 } provincereligion = { province = 816 data = catholic } }
style = 1
date = { day = 1 month = june year = 1493 }
offset = 30
deathdate = { day = 1 month = january year = 1660 }
name = "Settlement of Sao Thome"
desc = "In 1493 Afonso V appointed Alvaro de Caminha captain of the island of Sao Thome. He brought with him some children of New Christians, who were taken away from their parents to make them become better Christians. Convicts were sent to the island as well. In addition to these arrivals settlers of Sao Thome traded with Africans on the coast of Guinea to obtain slaves to work their new plantations. Sao Thome then became the main exporter of sugar to Europe until Brazil was settled."
action_a = {
name = "We will become rich!"
command = { type = provincetax which = 816 value = 1 }
command = { type = gainmanufactory which = 816 value = refinery }
command = { type = population which = 816 value = 250 }}}
event = {
id = 260158
trigger = { owned = { province = 816 data = POR } OR = { exists = HOL exists = ENG exists = FRA }}
random = no
country = POR
name = "Decline of Sao Tome"
desc = "By mid 17th century, Sao Tome's sugar plantations were reduced to a mere shadow of its former self. With a plague worms that attacked the roots of sugar cane, slave rebellions, internal discord, attacks from the Angolars, and piracy, many of its former land owners left to Brazil, where they carried on their efficient money making slave plantations for sugar."
date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1600 }
offset = 120
deathdate = { day = 1 month = january year = 1690 }
action_a ={
name = "Oh well, it was good while it lasted"
command = { type = population which = 816 value = -1000 }
command = { type = provincetax which = 816 value = -2 }
command = { type = losemanufactory which = 816 value = refinery }
command = { type = population which = 198 value = 50 }
command = { type = population which = 199 value = 50 }
command = { type = population which = 200 value = 50 }
command = { type = population which = 203 value = 100 }
command = { type = population which = 205 value = 100 }
command = { type = population which = 207 value = 50 }
command = { type = population which = 209 value = 75 }
command = { type = population which = 210 value = 75 }}}I'm a little leery of the refinery being handed out for free, but since it's destroyed later on, it can't be too unbalancing. Plus, since I'm about to write an event reducing the mine in Leone to about a quarter of what it was, the extra revenue will be damn handy to make up for the decrease in gold.
El Mina events
As promised:
Province.csv must be changed to mine=5
As promised:
Province.csv must be changed to mine=5
Code:
#Settlement of El Mina#
#modified by Sturmvogel#
event = {
id = 260048
trigger = { owned = { province = 795 data = -1 } #Leone
control = { province = 795 data = -1 }
provincereligion = { province = 795 data = catholic }}
random = no
country = POR
name = "Settlement of El Mina"
desc = "In 1481 King Joao II of Portugal held a meeting with his council to decide whether or not to build a fort on the Mina coast to secure the trade of gold in this region."
style = 2
date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1482 }
offset = 60
deathdate = { day = 1 month = january year = 1660 }
action_a ={
name = "build the fort"
command = { type = population which = 795 value = 300 }
command = { type = treasury value = [COLOR=Yellow]-10[/COLOR] }
command = { type = fortress which = 795 value = 1 }
command = { type = trade value = 150 }
command = { type = mine which = 795 value =[COLOR=Yellow] 23[/COLOR] }
}
action_b = {
name = "too risky"
command = { type = merchants value = 6 }
command = { type = infra value = 100 }
command = { type = land value = 100 }}}
event = {
id = 260049
random = no
trigger = { owned = { province = 795 data = -1 } #Leone
control = { province = 795 data = -1 }
provincereligion = { province = 795 data = catholic }}
random = no
country = POR
name = "Muslim gold traders have begun to avoid El Mina"
desc = "Muslim gold traders have begun to seek more profitable markets than the Portugese fort at El Mina"
style = 1
date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1550 }
offset = 180
action_a = {
name = "Damn!"
command = { type = mine which = 795 value = -17 }}}
Last edited:
sturmvogel said:
I didn't see this until you posted about it in the submissions thread. Why do we need these events? They don't really seem to add much beyond the freebie refinery, which shouldn't be added. Without the added refinery, they are just unnecessary events.
I like them because they help to reduce Portugal's colonization costs which can be excessive, especially since I've proposed reducing the take from Leone, which is how Portugal normally pays for most of its colonizations. Plus it ties in with IDLF's Explusion of the Jews sequence, which I need to read up on before I can fully comment.
Freebies?
No more than enough to try and keep Portugal at a roughly historical pace in expansion and exploration. With the gold from Leone cut by over 40% just how easy is it going to be for Portugal to build her colonies at a historical rate?
Garbon said:
No more than enough to try and keep Portugal at a roughly historical pace in expansion and exploration. With the gold from Leone cut by over 40% just how easy is it going to be for Portugal to build her colonies at a historical rate?
IDLF proposals of extensive AI helps, and freebies to certain nations were considered and rejected. That's why he made his separate mod, which I believe was quite succesful, as the AI of big nations was beefed up, and they performed stronger.sturmvogel said:
We believe certain nations (and Portugal is definitely included) have it much easier, and therefore freebies to them are usually discouraged. Regarding AI helps, we only want to use them as a last resource, not as an easy way out.
I rather see Leone producing more gold than it should, as it might be owned by Portugal or any other nation, than a free manufactory handed down to Portugal.
Absolutely all nations underperform in colonization. We might look at a global way of fixing this, but no free manus for colonialists. The AI Portugal already resources to minting for colonization and cheating on inflation, as all the rest of the AIs.
I'm not particularly concerned about the refinery, it can stay or go as the HC sees fit. I do think that the colonists are a useful means to try and recreate the historical colonization patterns.Fodoron said:
I believe colonization by the AI is slow because its cost, not because lack of colonists.
sturmvogel said:
If that was the case, anyone who colonizes the province should get the boost...which I don't actually believe as that suggests a whole new way of dealing with colonization.
Fodoron said:
Exactly! And adding 250 people to an existing colony is a savings in money equal to 2 and a half colonists. Very worth-while.