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historical fix
#(1455-1490) Partition of Leipzig
event = {
id = 273001
trigger = {
owned = { province = 331 data = -1 }
control = { province = 331 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 332 data = -1 }
control = { province = 332 data = -1 }
NOT = { exists = U16 }
event = 319002 #U16: Partition of the Wettin lands
}
random = no
country = SAC
name = "EVENTNAME273001" #The electorate and Thuringia are given to Ernst
desc = "EVENTHIST273001"
#-#The Treaty of Leipzig was signed on August 26, 1485 between Ernest, Elector of Saxony and Albert, Duke of Saxony, sons of Frederick II, Elector of Saxony. Based on the terms of the treaty, Saxony was divided into two realms whereby Duke Ernest acquired the western regions and Duke Albert obtained the eastern regions. Ernst had also already annexed Thuringia in 1482. Albrecht remained in Dresden and got the richest part of the Wettin possessions, his brother Ernst moved to the old capital of the electorate, Wittenberg, and was formally in a superior rank. Nevertheless, after less than a century, the Albertine branch proved to be more powerful and achieved hegemony over the Ernestines.
date = { day = 26 month = august year = 1485 }
offset = 0
deathdate = { day = 29 month = december year = 1490 }
action_a = {
name = "OK"
command = { type = independence which = U16 }
command = { type = addcore which = 347 } #Wurzburg/Thuringia
command = { type = trigger which = 319008 } #U16: Elector Ernst moves to Wittenberg
}
}
#(1455-1490) Partition of Leipzig
event = {
id = 273001
trigger = {
owned = { province = 331 data = -1 }
control = { province = 331 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 332 data = -1 }
control = { province = 332 data = -1 }
NOT = { exists = U16 }
event = 319002 #U16: Partition of the Wettin lands
}
random = no
country = SAC
name = "EVENTNAME273001" #The electorate and Thuringia are given to Ernst
desc = "EVENTHIST273001"
#-#The Treaty of Leipzig was signed on August 26, 1485 between Ernest, Elector of Saxony and Albert, Duke of Saxony, sons of Frederick II, Elector of Saxony. Based on the terms of the treaty, Saxony was divided into two realms whereby Duke Ernest acquired the western regions and Duke Albert obtained the eastern regions. Ernst had also already annexed Thuringia in 1482. Albrecht remained in Dresden and got the richest part of the Wettin possessions, his brother Ernst moved to the old capital of the electorate, Wittenberg, and was formally in a superior rank. Nevertheless, after less than a century, the Albertine branch proved to be more powerful and achieved hegemony over the Ernestines.
date = { day = 26 month = august year = 1485 }
offset = 0
deathdate = { day = 29 month = december year = 1490 }
action_a = {
name = "OK"
command = { type = independence which = U16 }
command = { type = addcore which = 347 } #Wurzburg/Thuringia
command = { type = trigger which = 319008 } #U16: Elector Ernst moves to Wittenberg
}
}
hey guys
sorry if this doesnt fit here but as there is no thread concerning both austria and spain i flipped a coin and voila.
i was tracing an event chain where i noticed something
So here appearantly spain seeks to form a league against the growing power of france in italy and if a is chosen then habsburg gets this event
description same as above
so this eventis one of triggers for this here event for burgundy
I
so this one triggers two events which gives royal marriages to spain and austria which are supposed to signal the historical marriages, and appearantly these lead to the habsburg rule of spain .
But so if we give us that in the event of 12143 spain goes with b we are seeing no french league and no marriage between spain and burgundy.
So we are also not seeing any habsburgs coming to the spanish throne and we are also seeing no burgundy being transferred to the spanish crown which brings us to the reason why i went through this event chain to find this loop hole. So i was trying to make and event for a burgundian cycle for the alt germany events in the case you were austria when you formed germany.
So is this possible and also wouldnt we need some fantasy leaders for spain if the spanish habsburg line never existed ?
anyway sorry for long post i just wanted to get this very clear
sorry if this doesnt fit here but as there is no thread concerning both austria and spain i flipped a coin and voila.
i was tracing an event chain where i noticed something
Code:
#(1495-1498) The Anti-French League of Venice
#modified by Bordic
event = {
id = 12143
trigger = {
NOT = { exists = ARG }
NOT = { event = 12144 } #ARG: The Anti-French League of Venice
OR = {
event = 12022 #NAP: Charles VIII presses claims on Naples
event = 170040 #FRA: The French King in Naples
}
}
random = no
country = SPA
name = "EVENTNAME326035" #The Anti-French League of Venice
desc = "EVENTHIST170040"
#-#
date = { day = 0 month = January year = 1495 }
offset = 25
deathdate = { day = 0 month = April year = 1498 }
action_a = {
name = "ACTIONNAME12143A" #Protect our dynasty from French interference
command = { type = casusbelli which = FRA value = 36 }
command = { type = vassal which = NAP } #if existing, Ferrandino asked Ferdinand's help
command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -100 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = 100 }
command = { type = relation which = MLO value = 100 }
command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 100 }
command = { type = relation which = PAP value = 100 }
}
action_b = {
name = "ACTIONNAME12143B" #We cannot stand up to the French
command = { type = stability value = -1 }
command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 50 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = -50 }
command = { type = relation which = MLO value = -50 }
command = { type = relation which = HAB value = -50 }
command = { type = relation which = PAP value = -50 }
command = { type = sleepevent which = 179025 } #HAB: The Anti-French League of Venice
}
}So here appearantly spain seeks to form a league against the growing power of france in italy and if a is chosen then habsburg gets this event
Code:
#(1495-1498) The Anti-French League of Venice
event = {
id = 179025
trigger = {
OR = {
event = 12144 #ARG: The Anti-French League of Venice
event = 12143 #SPA: The Anti-French League of Venice
}
}
random = no
country = HAB
name = "EVENTNAME326035" #The Anti-French League of Venice
desc = "EVENTHIST170040"
#-#
date = { day = 0 month = January year = 1495 }
offset = 20
deathdate = { day = 0 month = April year = 1498 }
action_a = {
name = "ACTIONNAME17024A" #Express Support
command = { type = casusbelli which = FRA value = 36 }
command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -100 }
command = { type = relation which = ARG value = 50 }
command = { type = relation which = MLO value = 25 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = 25 }
command = { type = relation which = PAP value = 50 }
}
action_b = {
name = "ACTIONNAME17024B" #Stay neutral
command = { type = stability value = -1 }
command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 25 }
command = { type = relation which = ARG value = -25 }
command = { type = relation which = MLO value = -25 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = -25 }
command = { type = relation which = PAP value = -25 }
}
action_c = {
name = "ACTIONNAME17024C" #Express Hostility
command = { type = stability value = -2}
command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 50 }
command = { type = relation which = ARG value = -50 }
command = { type = relation which = MLO value = -50 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = -50 }
command = { type = relation which = PAP value = -50 }
}
}description same as above
so this eventis one of triggers for this here event for burgundy
Code:
#(1495) The House of Habsburg settles in Spain
#by Bordic
event = {
id = 137022
trigger = {
event = 179025 #HAB: The Anti-French League of Venice
OR = {
flag = [Habsburg]
event = 3178 #HAB: The Habsburg inheritance of Burgundy (1477)
event = 137012 #BUR: Settlement at Arras (1482-1492)
event = 137021 #BUR: The new Archduke of Burgundy (1494)
}
exists = SPA
NOT = {
war = { country = BUR country = HAB }
war = { country = SPA country = HAB }
war = { country = SPA country = BUR }
}
}
random = no
country = BUR
name = "EVENTNAME137022" #The House of Habsburg settles in Spain
desc = "EVENTHIST137022"
#-#
date = { day = 29 month = March year = 1495 }
offset = 7
deathdate = { day = 0 month = January year = 1496 }
action_a = {
name = "ACTIONNAME137022A" #Let's bind our destiny to the Spanish Kings
command = { type = stability value = 1 }
command = { type = revoltrisk which = 60 value = -5 }
command = { type = DIP which = 2 value = 12 }
command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 300 }
command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -30 }
command = { type = trigger which = 285151 } #SPA: Political marriages with the Habsburgs
command = { type = trigger which = 179032 } #HAB: Political marriages with the Spanish royals
}
}I
so this one triggers two events which gives royal marriages to spain and austria which are supposed to signal the historical marriages, and appearantly these lead to the habsburg rule of spain .
But so if we give us that in the event of 12143 spain goes with b we are seeing no french league and no marriage between spain and burgundy.
So we are also not seeing any habsburgs coming to the spanish throne and we are also seeing no burgundy being transferred to the spanish crown which brings us to the reason why i went through this event chain to find this loop hole. So i was trying to make and event for a burgundian cycle for the alt germany events in the case you were austria when you formed germany.
So is this possible and also wouldnt we need some fantasy leaders for spain if the spanish habsburg line never existed ?
anyway sorry for long post i just wanted to get this very clear
Gottskalk said:
Spain inherits Burgundy with *this* event:
Code:
#(1517) Spain inherits Burgundy
event = {
id = 285100 #triggered by BUR_137003 A / BUR_137005
random = no
country = SPA
name = "EVENTNAME285100" #The Burgundian inheritance
desc = "EVENTHIST285100"
#-#When Fernando of Aragon died in 1516, Charles who had already inherited Burgundy from his father Philipp the Fair in 1506 was heir to the thrones of Castile and Aragon. He set sails for his coronation as King of Spain on September 18th 1517. Although in the first years of his reign the Dutch influence in his empire remained strong, his united possessions became known as Spain.
action_a = {
name = "ACTIONNAME285100A" #Charles is master of the world
command = { type = addcore which = 377 } #Luxembourg
command = { type = addcore which = 378 } #Brabant
command = { type = addcore which = 380 } #Flandern
command = { type = addcore which = 339 } #Holland
command = { type = addcore which = 340 } #Zeeland
command = { type = addcore which = 387 } #Franche-Comté
command = { type = addcore which = 409 } #Bourgogne
command = { type = addcore which = 379 } #Artois
command = { type = inherit which = BUR }
command = { type = add_countryculture which = dutch } #Controversial, but Charles deserves Dutch more than Iberian; should be removed by his abdication
}
}yes i know but you see that the description wouldnt match the case where the spanish family and habsburg family did not intermarry so charles would have no claim to spain right? that was what i was trying to imply
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About post #943Gottskalk said:
Yes you are right that any eventual action B made by Spain or even an action C made by Austria would be ahistorical, but imho these events of the Anti French League and the following marriage between Spain and Austria would have occurred the same if we follow the path of possible alternative history: France was interested in Low Countries (thus Burgundy) and in Italy (both North and South). The events are there trying to represent this.
What about if Naples doesn't exist in 1494 when playing with eu2? Also in this case, no marriage would happen between Spain and Burgundy-Austria? This is a eu2 technical problem, more related to predictable event chains. As it is now, even without these events you point out, the annexation of Burgundy and the marriage with Austria will happen the same in 1517-1519, whether or not the Low Countries turn Spanish.
The goal of these 1494-1497 event chains was to represent in the game the political condition which would have brought firstly to the Italian Wars and eventually to the war of Spanish succession in 1700s: in both cases France against the Habsburgs (both Spain and Austria).
The only and current alternative to the historical path is now the possibility for Mary of Burgundy to marry anyone else than Maximilian of Habsburg. Only in this case the Italian Wars (and even the WoSS) won't happen (no French encirclement by the Habsburgs in this case!)
For game's sake (or semplicity) the House of Habsburg will settle IN ANY CASE in Spain. The SPA or HAB player will know of this marriage only with the 1519 event instead of both events: the 1519 one and the 1495 one (which also grants the SPA-HAB marriage with Burgundy).
Coming back to the event sequences, the event with which Spain inherits Burgundy doesn't refer to Philippe the Handsome and Joan the Mad, as they are implicit: if Spain inherits Burgundy Mary of Burgundy chose Maximilian and somewhere between 1494 to 1517 Spain and Austria married each other. the events of post 943 are only there to explain history in case the game completely fits with history but they are not really necessary for the historical path to follow.
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Bordic said:
I think he means that if Habsburg and Trastamura families do not unite , then the marriage of Habsburg max with mary of Burgundy will leave Habsburg in the low countries without the trastamara portion involved.
this did happen early and max found it hard to control the low countries , which could have led to an early netherlands (a historical)
The only way I see it is if spain is not iinvolved in the low counties, then the easiest solution is for events to let austria to try to hold onto the low countires themselves
I agree we need to realign the events before this happens.
Problem here is that Spain without Habsburg monarchs is impossible to imagine, imo. As it is now, if Spain doesn't inherit Low Countries we haven't those events of Italian Wars and WoSS any longer. So the problem of determinism is in part solved I think.Toio said:
Or simply Flanders free?
I agree with this point. But why couldn't we just think of normal marriage between Spain and Austria with the union of the two dynasties as it historically happened without thinking of possession of Low Countries? Couldn't we reasonably think of this marriage as a means to stop French expansionism in HRE and Italy? As I said we won't have Italian wars as properly intended or the war of Spanish succession for the territories in Low Countries and Milan in case Low Countries become Kleves or Palatinate (alternative Mary's marriages).
Anti French league and the Habsburgs settle in Spain will fire only if France is interested in Italy. Since we have historical basis for these events I have thought about using the dynastic commands we have in game to bind Austria-Burgundy and Spain as to avoid any historically impossible alliance between France and one of them. But whether the events fire or not, it doesn't imply that the marriages won't take place... That's my point. Or we would like to have events for each aspect of each possible alternative event?
I recall that the sequence of BUR_137022 is an alternative (even if historical) to the event sequence in which Spain and Austria get the marriage. This following sequence should be considered technically speaking wrong because it refers to a previous marriage which has already happened in 1495. Instead this sequence is firing in 1516-1519 well after the death of Felipe I and the destitution of Juana by Carlos I.
Yes, I understand that the sequence is very deterministic but how can you figure any alternative dynasty in Spain except the Habsburgs or the Bourbons after?
Or just the release of all available Dutch minors with Flanders going to Hainaut...Toio said:
Sorry, I was talking about the Italian Wars after 1535 when Charles V decided to give Milan to his son Felipe II. France already renounced Milan at Cambrai in 1529 but this decision provoked her intervention in Savoie-Piedmont iirc.
OK
Once I have asked Fodoron why we have no Felipe I to rule over Castile with Juana at least until 1506-08, then Ferdinand will get the temporary regency of Juana until 1516. He said he preferred to see an already formed Spain before apparently historical date of 1516 when Charles took power. He also said that Spain was effecively united only when Felipe V Bourbon became king. AFAIK we agreed with having Spain with the marriage of the Reyes Catolicos somewhere in 1480s and so limiting Aragonese expansionism policies in Italy when France took Naples.
That should be however the meaning of the presence in agceep of similar events for Spain and Aragon in the early Italian Wars (1494-1513)
The historical marriage between Castile and Burgundy can mix up the game as it also concerns cross-marriages between them and Aragon + Austria. France will also have small-sized enemies to fight with.
In the en I don't know which path we could follow and which are the possible risks. There is also a problem with Castile AI to colonize America and with Tordesillas too.
Austria gaining slavonic culture and losing it again
Post 940 slightly changed.
was: startdate 1463.
Suggested by Toio: 1540 (Toio please delete your post in the submission thread the discussion should be either here in the Austria thread or in the cultures thread)
now: startdate 1471 (after Baumkirchers execution).
I do not think that moving back the startdate was *necessary*.
The complex trigger after all is not easily achieved. Even if Austria gains its core in 1463 ALL slavonic minor states have to vanish and the Ottomans have to share a border with Austria - in some games that will never happen.
However as it is unlikely that the triggers be met all as early as 1463 it will reduce the workload of the game for 8 gameyears, not checking every 30 days if the trigger is fulfilled.
Post 940 slightly changed.
was: startdate 1463.
Suggested by Toio: 1540 (Toio please delete your post in the submission thread the discussion should be either here in the Austria thread or in the cultures thread)
now: startdate 1471 (after Baumkirchers execution).
I do not think that moving back the startdate was *necessary*.
The complex trigger after all is not easily achieved. Even if Austria gains its core in 1463 ALL slavonic minor states have to vanish and the Ottomans have to share a border with Austria - in some games that will never happen.
However as it is unlikely that the triggers be met all as early as 1463 it will reduce the workload of the game for 8 gameyears, not checking every 30 days if the trigger is fulfilled.
YodaMaster said:
Istria is venetian and croatia hungarian when I start the 1520 scenario - so the trigger that the Ottomans are neighbouring Austria is not fulfilled yet.
Or has ownership of those proivinces changed in the newest version of AGCEEP?
Oops, you're right. There is no change.
But why not wait for 1540 and Habsburg Inheritance of Hungary?
I suggest:
But why not wait for 1540 and Habsburg Inheritance of Hungary?
I suggest:
Code:
date = { day = 24 month = july year = 1540 }
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YodaMaster said:
I agree with Yodamaster especially as Ferdinand I was really the first Austrian ruler to accept/welcome the slavs, then again, in those days, the slovenians must have been classified differently.
in accordance with the Austrian system of planting colonies of defenders along the Military Frontier, they (Uskoks)were welcomed by Emperor Ferdinand I. Moreover, the uskoks were promised an annual subsidy in return for their services.
YodaMaster said:
I tried to have a trigger that looks for the actual conditions on the balkans, not what in real history happened in a certain year under a certain ruler (as Toio mentioned Ferdinand I).
The main reason for that is that I tend to play starting always a grand campaign where everything is possible.
Historically both you and Toio are right - as long as Hungary borders and is opposing the Turks Hungary deserves slavonic culture and not yet Austria.
However that is taken care of by the trigger conditions.
If the game follows a historical course then the event won´t fire too soon, because one of the trigger conditions will not be met, e.g. TUR does not neighbour HAB even at the start of the 1520 scenario.
However if the game diverts from history at some earlier junction then the event should happen if it will be plausible. For example the Habsburg Inheritance of Hungary will in some games happen earlier, e.g. either when Austria conquers large parts of Hungary when it gains the cores or when the hungarian civil war has Ladislaus on the throne and the AI choses B (no personal union but austria inheriting Hungary). That might happen long before 1540 where historically Austria took control.
In that case the situation that historicaly existed in 1540 will be there at an earlier date. And in that case the event should consider the actual conditions and not fire at a time which is in that game meaningless.
Do you think the trigger lacking any important condition?
Code:
trigger = {
core = { province = 367 data = -1 }
Code:
emperor = yes #only a powerful Austria will get the trust of
countrysize = 7 #those fearing the Turks
Code:
owned = { province = 367 data = HAB } #Krain
control = { province = 367 data = HAB } #Krain
Code:
neighbour = TUR
Code:
NOT = { exists = BYZ } #only if eastern rome is gone
NOT = { exists = BUL } #and no independant slavonic state exists
NOT = { exists = SER }
NOT = { exists = BOS }
NOT = { exists = CRO }
NOT = { event = 261002 } #Not if Styria became Austria because then Austria will already have slavonic culture
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ConjurerDragon said:
there is nothing wrong with your event except the startdate and your notes reflect that you need this 1471 startdate due to human play. As you say, the event will not fire too soon IF AI played.
As I tested this, it did fire once for the AI, because Austria owned BOS., but with the new BOS and SER events, this seems more unlikely
I leave it to Yodamaster. 1471 or 1540 . your call
I understand ConjurerDragon's arguments but we don't need to help Austria (and a player) if advance in Slavonic lands happens ahistorically "too soon". In this case, can't we assume Austria will need time for full acceptance? That's why 1540 seems better to me.
YodaMaster said:
I see a problem with that assumption: Why would Austria need time for full acceptance if they begin to rule Hungary in 1441 and have to wait until 1471 (ahistorical b choice in event for Ladislaus but still have to wait until earliest startdate) or 1490 (ahistorical B choice of Hungary after death of Corvinus),
but won´t need time for full acceptance in 1540? These two dates in 1441 and 1490 are only the two events in which HAB ahistorically can inherit Hungary as a whole. With the granted cores and a sometimes weaker Hungary Hungary might not be in it´s historical position to be the bulwark against the Turks but Austria might be - that should be reflected in the events trigger.
However I could see one other condition in that Austria needs to be elected as king of Croatia (historically in 1526) to have a broader slavonic support than just the slovenians in Krain. I have added the condition that Austria has to have a core on Croatia (which in a historical flow of events it won´t have as in the Friedrich/Corvinus peace deal where Austria in the a choice gains Odenburg but loses the cores on the rest of Hungary/Croatia.
Until now only Toio and Yoda have commented about the events and if that remains so it will be 1:2 and I would also move back the startdate. Anyone else with an opinion?
We can "say" Slavonics have no choice in 1540 with historical situation. Before, we can "assume" they still have hope situation will evolve ("finally" in the name of the event could mean there is no hope). Once again we don't need to give Austria such advantage and break by event the already broken balance.